Emperor angel stopped eating, skittish

Philt56

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My emperor has suddenly stopped eating the last few days. Have had him over 4 years since a small juvenile, now about the size of my hand. Normally he's a pig and swarms the tank when I do a feeding (LRS, Rods, mysis). Now he tends to hide in his hole behind the rocks or when he comes out, he will lean against a cave like waiting for a cleaner to service him. Water parameters are fine except for high nitrates, but they have always been that way. No new fish and all others are much smaller than him and show no symptoms.

One thing that happened about the time he started acting up is that the pistol shrimp that lives under the rock in front of his hideaway started going crazy on digging a new burrow and the tank got kind of cloudy from the sandstorm he kicked up. This semed to get the angel real agitated and I wonder if all that digging released some polutants? I checked ammonia and nitrite yesterday and both seemed at 0.

The other thing new is that I started treating with Vibrant a couple weeks ago for algae.

Any ideas for treatment that is reef safe? I don't really have a good QT available right away and not sure if he would tolerate tearing down everything to get caught?
 
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melypr1985

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His eye looks a bit cloudy in the picture. Is that just a trick of the camera or is it something that you see as well?
 

melypr1985

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Yes, it is a little cloudy to me too.

This could be the reason for his behavior. Is it just the one eye or both? I ask because one eye usually denotes an injury that has gotten infected. Both eyes can mean flukes are present.

Infection would mean antibiotics -preferably in a QT with the meds in the water, but they can be fed in the food when bound with Focus by Seachem.
Flukes would mean dosing prazi in the display.

You can check for flukes by doing a freshwater dip on the angel.... though that means you would have to catch him first.
 

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I would check for flukes first, as angels are very suspectible.

If none show up in the dip, move on to this being an infection.
 
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Philt56

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Thanks all. I picked up prazi at my LFS and decide to treat right away. Removed chemipure, shut off carbon reactor and skimmer. I really didn't want to stress him out trying to catch and do the dip.

Both eyes are a little cloudy but it's not like they are milky that you can't see any black. I honestly don't recall them looking differently.

After all this time can flukes just appear without introducing an infected fish? Or is it sort of like where they say ich is always present and goes rampant whenever a fishes immune system is weakened?

Could the stirring up of the sand bed by the pistol shrimp or during a previous sand bed cleanup have stirred up any parasites in the sand bed and led to the problem? The shrimp lives under the rock that us the front of the angel's main lair.

Will let you know of any change of status.

Other inhabitants: 2 percula clwns, 2 banghais, metallic shrimp gobie, spotted mandarin, lawnmower blennie. Coral banded shrimp, fire shrimp, pistol shrimp, Indian starfish,, sea urchin, hermits and turbo snails. O
 
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The whitish marks on the skin by the fin, would that be the flukes coming out as a result of the prazi? Haven't noticed them before. Does that mean the prazi is working or he's just getting worse?
 

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The whitish marks on the skin by the fin, would that be the flukes coming out as a result of the prazi? Haven't noticed them before. Does that mean the prazi is working or he's just getting worse?

Actually that could be places where the flukes were present and the slime coat appears to be ruffed up as a result. It should go away on it's own in a day or so. I've never had that last longer than 24 hours if that's what this is.
 
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Hope it's not too late. Finally got him in a QT but his skin is getting pretty bad, mottled. At first I thought it was velvet or ich but not positive.

I added prazi to the tank but also have metro and cupramine on delivery for today. today. Which should I add? Can I have all 3 meds in there or is that too much? If not what should go in with the prazi?
 

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I added prazi to the tank but also have metro and cupramine on delivery for today. today. Which should I add? Can I have all 3 meds in there or is that too much? If not what should go in with the prazi?

You can add both, but I probably would only add Cupramine (at this time) if you suspect ich or velvet.
 
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Philt56

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Really appreciate both of you for your advice. Unfortunately he didn't make after I put him in the QT. Added the prazi and then the metro arrived so I added that. But he died a few hours later. Again thanks for taking the time to help.
 

melypr1985

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Really appreciate both of you for your advice. Unfortunately he didn't make after I put him in the QT. Added the prazi and then the metro arrived so I added that. But he died a few hours later. Again thanks for taking the time to help.

I'm so sorry for your loss :(
 
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Philt56

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Well, things have progressed to worse:(
In addition to the emperor, I've also lost a target mandarin and lawnmower blennie. Mandarin stopped eating and died a day after, he seemed emaciated and his skin seemed slimy. Prior to this, he was a ravenous eater of LRS frozen food. The lawnmower also was emaciated and lethargic, he was still pecking on algae yesterday. I put him in the hospital tank and died later today.

I put my 2 perculas in the hospital tank with cupramine. They seem ok but I wasnt sure about their skin. Slight velvet-like appearance but only near the dorsal. Still eating fine. My 2 bamgais are still in the main tank but harder to catch. They also seem fine and eating.

The shrimp goby is in his burrow and is also eating fine.

So what would you guess? Velvet or some other disease? A bacterial disease wouldn't be this contagious would it? I did treat the display with prazi a few days after the angel stopped eating.

Was a little worried if the hospital tank isn't in the best shape? I have the seachem ammonia alert in it and I think it looks ok. Attached thumbnail. I just have a HOB aqueon filter on it with biomedia from the main sump in it, they are like plastic bio balls that are filled with ceramic "gravel". The water was a little cloudy when I put the angel in it but cleared up greatly in between the day he died and today. I was just worried that the blennie and mandarin died in the hospital in less than a day each. Almost want to put the clowns back in the display.

This tank was up for over 5 years with no disease.

The shrimp goby was the newest member fish-wise. He's been in for 3 months. I added a couple small starfish last month that came from the LFS' small frag tank which also has some fish in it. Can the starfish carry any disease with them?

The tank is a 65 gal tall. All parameters were good except nitrates are high.

The other thing I have is a large devil hand leather coral which hasn't been doing well, not inflating or showing polyps. Could it be dying and poisoning the tank?

Thanks again for all your help!

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melypr1985

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Could be velvet, and yes a starfish can bring these things into the tank though it would have come in the water not on the starfish's body itself. Bacterial infections can spread just like anything else and gram negative infections can kill faster than velvet sometimes.

The mandy could have actually starved to death and been a separate matter all together. They have such a short digestive tract that they have to eat constantly so even if he was eating frozen food, he would have needed plenty of pods available so he doesn't starve.

You'll want to get all the fish out of the display and leave it fallow for 76 days since we aren't sure what we are dealing with. I would run copper and a broad spectrum antibiotic like kanaplex at the same time.
 
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