Fairly new reefer looking for any and all advice!

ksc · Dec 1, 2016

saltyfilmfolks said:
works out pretty good. IMO.

If it was cold enough we didn't even need buckets...

saltyfilmfolks · Dec 1, 2016

ksc said:
If it was cold enough we didn't even need buckets...

Be102 · Dec 1, 2016

saltyfilmfolks said:

Pretty clueless here.. but are nearly all ocean parameters the same? Can I literally go down the street to the Atlantic Ocean and fill my buckets? Does this stuff need to be altered other than just heated up? What's the rule behind being able to do large water changes and it not harming the tank? What stops people from grabbing a saltwater and starting a tank right up? I mean if it has all the stuff what is missing besides the bacteria?

Brew12 · Dec 1, 2016

Be102 said:
Pretty clueless here.. but are nearly all ocean parameters the same? Can I literally go down the street to the Atlantic Ocean and fill my buckets? Does this stuff need to be altered other than just heated up? What's the rule behind being able to do large water changes and it not harming the tank? What stops people from grabbing a saltwater and starting a tank right up? I mean if it has all the stuff what is missing besides the bacteria?

Ummm... nothing stops people from grabbing saltwater straight from the ocean and using it. You risk getting some stuff you don't want but it is a fairly common thing to do. Absolutely nothing wrong with doing it if you can access it in a fairly high flow and clean location.

Many LFS's on the coast get sea water, run it through a UV filter to kill any parasites and sell it.

Be102 · Dec 1, 2016

Brew12 said:
Ummm... nothing stops people from grabbing saltwater straight from the ocean and using it. You risk getting some stuff you don't want but it is a fairly common thing to do. Absolutely nothing wrong with doing it if you can access it in a fairly high flow and clean location.

Many LFS's on the coast get sea water, run it through a UV filter to kill any parasites and sell it.

Of course I constantly jump ahead of myself.. but do you recommend uv sterilizers? What is their use? Will definitely keep this in mind.. I thought it wasn't possible

saltyfilmfolks · Dec 1, 2016

Brew12 said:
Ummm... nothing stops people from grabbing saltwater straight from the ocean and using it. You risk getting some stuff you don't want but it is a fairly common thing to do. Absolutely nothing wrong with doing it if you can access it in a fairly high flow and clean location.

Many LFS's on the coast get sea water, run it through a UV filter to kill any parasites and sell it.

Be102 said:
Pretty clueless here.. but are nearly all ocean parameters the same? Can I literally go down the street to the Atlantic Ocean and fill my buckets? Does this stuff need to be altered other than just heated up? What's the rule behind being able to do large water changes and it not harming the tank? What stops people from grabbing a saltwater and starting a tank right up? I mean if it has all the stuff what is missing besides the bacteria?

Welcome to the dark side........
the concerns are contaminants mainly. Standard Pollutants like gas and oil, "red tide", viruses, bacteria, dinos, cryptos, unstable mineral content, the plague, increased taxes, fear of the unknown and cooties.
Ive been on NSW from the start as are many down here. the two tanks you see are "sand filters", a mechanical filter that strains out sediments and the larger bugs and fish. the pumps send the water from the below holding tanks to the scripps oceanography labs and the Birch Aquarium just up the hill.

the homer bucket with brown in it you see that's open is actually the entire contents of my QT tank.

that's how I did my first Water change in it.

fwiw, ive never had dinos cryptos red tide ick velvet or cooties. not in the tanks any way.

Be102 · Dec 1, 2016

saltyfilmfolks said:
Welcome to the dark side........
the concerns are contaminants mainly. Standard Pollutants like gas and oil, "red tide", viruses, bacteria, dinos, cryptos, unstable mineral content, the plague, increased taxes, fear of the unknown and cooties.
Ive been on NSW from the start as are many down here. the two tanks you see are "sand filters", a mechanical filter that strains out sediments and the larger bugs and fish. the pumps send the water from the below holding tanks to the scripps oceanography labs and the Birch Aquarium just up the hill.

the homer bucket with brown in it you see that's open is actually the entire contents of my QT tank. that's how I did my first Water change in it.

fwiw, ive never had dinos cryptos red tide ick velvet or cooties. not in the tanks any way.

Unfortunately was unable to pick up a bottle of stability; however I did manage to get a bottle of prime. Currently have my RO/DI running to clean the TFC membrane of antibacterial that comes when it is shipped? Anyways I am hoping to atleast do a 5 gallon change tonight if not more. Only problems I am facing is the inability to warm water fast enough.

Be102 · Dec 2, 2016

saltyfilmfolks said:
Welcome to the dark side........
the concerns are contaminants mainly. Standard Pollutants like gas and oil, "red tide", viruses, bacteria, dinos, cryptos, unstable mineral content, the plague, increased taxes, fear of the unknown and cooties.
Ive been on NSW from the start as are many down here. the two tanks you see are "sand filters", a mechanical filter that strains out sediments and the larger bugs and fish. the pumps send the water from the below holding tanks to the scripps oceanography labs and the Birch Aquarium just up the hill.

the homer bucket with brown in it you see that's open is actually the entire contents of my QT tank. that's how I did my first Water change in it.

fwiw, ive never had dinos cryptos red tide ick velvet or cooties. not in the tanks any way.

Should I only dose the prime once despite planning on flushing my system? I intend on doing basically a bunch of large water changes now that I have the luxury of having the water at home it's literally the convince of turning a handle. I took the coral rack off and started cleaning today. Next are the power heads and heater. I was curious on what is "reef" safe for cleaning. First regarding algae and all that good stuff like salt build up ; and then even cleaner to get the salt off my equipment. You mentioned bleach before in the filter cleaning process, is that safe? Is there requirements for carbon regarding amount per tank size? Can too much do any harm? Or would it just mean extra clean water? Hoping my local lfs has some sort of media bags in stock. Might grab and throw some gfo just for the heck of it. I managed to get my calcium test to show calcium by just testing my newly mixed salt water. Is there any diy media bags possible to create incase I am unable to find some? Are more of those filter floss (blue/white) pad things good to use just one or should I use multiple ? My canister has a lot of room in it with different levels.

Brew12 · Dec 2, 2016

Be102 said:
Should I only dose the prime once despite planning on flushing my system? I intend on doing basically a bunch of large water changes now that I have the luxury of having the water at home it's literally the convince of turning a handle. I took the coral rack off and started cleaning today. Next are the power heads and heater. I was curious on what is "reef" safe for cleaning. First regarding algae and all that good stuff like salt build up ; and then even cleaner to get the salt off my equipment. You mentioned bleach before in the filter cleaning process, is that safe? Is there requirements for carbon regarding amount per tank size? Can too much do any harm? Or would it just mean extra clean water? Hoping my local lfs has some sort of media bags in stock. Might grab and throw some gfo just for the heck of it. I managed to get my calcium test to show calcium by just testing my newly mixed salt water. Is there any diy media bags possible to create incase I am unable to find some? Are more of those filter floss (blue/white) pad things good to use just one or should I use multiple ? My canister has a lot of room in it with different levels.

Wait on the prime until you are done with your changes.

Doing large water changes is fine, but make sure you mix the salt a few days in advance. Freshly mixed salt is not good for fish. Even if it looks like it has all dissolved, it hasn't.

I like cleaning everything in my tank with vinegar. Cheap and works very well. Gallons of vinegar!

Bleach isn't safe to use directly. That said, it fairly quickly breaks down into a safe product. Bleach is NaOCl. Table salt is NaCl. So yes, chlorine bleach is just table salt with oxygen. This oxygen will break down the cell walls of bacteria so it isn't exactly safe in this application. That said, the bleach releases that oxygen over a fairly short period of time and turns into table salt. So you can use bleach, just rinse it and dry it well then give it a day or two before you use whatever you cleaned again.

Extra clean water isn't necessarily a good thing. Organisms in your tank need to eat the stuff in your aquarium that activated carbon can pull out but it shouldn't do any harm to have too much. Just make sure you understand that the carbon used as a filter is much different than the carbon used for dosing. Two very different uses.

Some GFO won't hurt. Just make sure you change it out regularly. Many forms of GFO will gradually release PO4 back into the water once it reaches end of life.

Did your calcium number match what you should have expected with your salt?

Petco carries media bags and bulk filter floss. You shouldn't have a problem finding either.

Be102 · Dec 2, 2016

Brew12 said:
Wait on the prime until you are done with your changes.

Doing large water changes is fine, but make sure you mix the salt a few days in advance. Freshly mixed salt is not good for fish. Even if it looks like it has all dissolved, it hasn't.

I like cleaning everything in my tank with vinegar. Cheap and works very well. Gallons of vinegar!

Bleach isn't safe to use directly. That said, it fairly quickly breaks down into a safe product. Bleach is NaOCl. Table salt is NaCl. So yes, chlorine bleach is just table salt with oxygen. This oxygen will break down the cell walls of bacteria so it isn't exactly safe in this application. That said, the bleach releases that oxygen over a fairly short period of time and turns into table salt. So you can use bleach, just rinse it and dry it well then give it a day or two before you use whatever you cleaned again.

Extra clean water isn't necessarily a good thing. Organisms in your tank need to eat the stuff in your aquarium that activated carbon can pull out but it shouldn't do any harm to have too much. Just make sure you understand that the carbon used as a filter is much different than the carbon used for dosing. Two very different uses.

Some GFO won't hurt. Just make sure you change it out regularly. Many forms of GFO will gradually release PO4 back into the water once it reaches end of life.

Did your calcium number match what you should have expected with your salt?

Petco carries media bags and bulk filter floss. You shouldn't have a problem finding either.

In regards to vinegar, is there a specific type? Will it clean my salt off my tank? Is it safe if some falls in? Don't people dose with vinegar ?! Anything for the smell ? Is there a specific type of media bag itself or just any sizing and whatnot? Will gfo go through the holes? Calcium came out I think correct for my salt. 450 I believe. Could my tank possibly have too much calcium it didn't show ? I'll I try to find filter floss for my canister? Or will any do better than none.

Brew12 · Dec 2, 2016

I use distilled white vinegar. It will clean the salt off your tank. Vinegar is acetic acid which is why it dissolves the salt and coraline algae so well. People do dose vinegar. The chemical formula is C2H4O2. When you add it to water the carbon separates out (this is carbon dosing to feed bacteria) and the rest is just H2O or water. Can't help with the smell. I do my vinegar cleaning in the garage.
Just a fine mesh media bag should be fine. You'll understand when you see them.
I don't know enough about your test set to know what the problem was. Too much calcium could be the problem but I don't know how you would have gotten there if you hadn't added a calcium supplement.

Any filter floss would work I think. I'm not a canister filter guy though.

Be102 · Dec 2, 2016

Brew12 said:
I use distilled white vinegar. It will clean the salt off your tank. Vinegar is acetic acid which is why it dissolves the salt and coraline algae so well. People do dose vinegar. The chemical formula is C2H4O2. When you add it to water the carbon separates out (this is carbon dosing to feed bacteria) and the rest is just H2O or water. Can't help with the smell. I do my vinegar cleaning in the garage.
Just a fine mesh media bag should be fine. You'll understand when you see them.
I don't know enough about your test set to know what the problem was. Too much calcium could be the problem but I don't know how you would have gotten there if you hadn't added a calcium supplement.

Any filter floss would work I think. I'm not a canister filter guy though.

Will I be alright to remove the canister; dump everything, give it the nice cleaning with a little bleach and then leave it to dry for a day or two? Will my tank suffer at all? I'm thinking that since after I cleaned some algae already and I get rid of whatever is in the canister that I will be nearly in ideal water conditions. Is there such thing as having too many water changes? I'll make sure to let the salt mix throughly before adding it to the tank. I actually originally added allium a long time ago from a product called "polyplab One" which actually nearly wiped all my fish out... any way that still has crazy high levels in my tank? I haven't had any coral growth tho so I am thinking that wasn't the problem. But who knows.

ksc · Dec 2, 2016

This stuff?
https://www.polyplab.com/products/one

Brew12 · Dec 2, 2016

Be102 said:
Will I be alright to remove the canister; dump everything, give it the nice cleaning with a little bleach and then leave it to dry for a day or two? Will my tank suffer at all? I'm thinking that since after I cleaned some algae already and I get rid of whatever is in the canister that I will be nearly in ideal water conditions. Is there such thing as having too many water changes? I'll make sure to let the salt mix throughly before adding it to the tank. I actually originally added allium a long time ago from a product called "polyplab One" which actually nearly wiped all my fish out... any way that still has crazy high levels in my tank? I haven't had any coral growth tho so I am thinking that wasn't the problem. But who knows.

If you have plenty of live rock and flow in your tank I would have no concerns taking your canister off line, cleaning it, and then putting it in the closet for a month or two!

A day or two would work also.

I think you can do too many water changes. Only because of stability. Right now I wouldn't worry about doing too many. Sounds like you have plenty of "learning opportunities" (otherwise known as mistakes) to get out of your tank before you can simplify and move forward.

Corals need alkalinity and calcium, in proper balance, to grow. If I had to guess, you aren't getting coral growth for many reasons. One of which is you are just trying to do too much to your tank. Another is that phosphates interfere with the ability of the coral to utilize the alk and calcium and inhibit growth. Some phosphate is important, too much is a very bad thing.

Be102 · Dec 2, 2016

ksc said:
This stuff?
https://www.polyplab.com/products/one

Yes that. Talked back and forth with their support to basically come to a "we got no clue this never happens we're sorry" sort of handling to it.. honestly that probably was what ruined my experience. All the time, money, fish, and dedication was ruined to wake up to dead fish when I thought I was doing the right thing..

ksc · Dec 2, 2016

Brew12 said:
If you have plenty of live rock and flow in your tank I would have no concerns taking your canister off line, cleaning it, and then putting it in the closet for a month or two! A day or two would work also.

I think you can do too many water changes. Only because of stability. Right now I wouldn't worry about doing too many. Sounds like you have plenty of "learning opportunities" (otherwise known as mistakes) to get out of your tank before you can simplify and move forward.

Corals need alkalinity and calcium, in proper balance, to grow. If I had to guess, you aren't getting coral growth for many reasons. One of which is you are just trying to do too much to your tank. Another is that phosphates interfere with the ability of the coral to utilize the alk and calcium and inhibit growth. Some phosphate is important, too much is a very bad thing.

This might interest you....

What's up with phosphate? by Richard Ross | MACNA 2014

Be102 · Dec 2, 2016

Brew12 said:
If you have plenty of live rock and flow in your tank I would have no concerns taking your canister off line, cleaning it, and then putting it in the closet for a month or two! A day or two would work also.

I think you can do too many water changes. Only because of stability. Right now I wouldn't worry about doing too many. Sounds like you have plenty of "learning opportunities" (otherwise known as mistakes) to get out of your tank before you can simplify and move forward.

Corals need alkalinity and calcium, in proper balance, to grow. If I had to guess, you aren't getting coral growth for many reasons. One of which is you are just trying to do too much to your tank. Another is that phosphates interfere with the ability of the coral to utilize the alk and calcium and inhibit growth. Some phosphate is important, too much is a very bad thing.

The only reason I intend to use this canister is as a large reactor basically. I was going to order the brs 2 part media reactor. If you don't really think the carbon/gfo is needed just yet it will save me another trip (despite going it seems everyday) to petco. I just think this ro/di is going to save my life. I hope so at least. I have quite amount of growth in my tank from stuff I didn't provide and it's been going for a year so I don't think I'll lack the biological filtration.

Be102 · Dec 2, 2016

ksc said:
This might interest you....

What's up with phosphate? by Richard Ross | MACNA 2014

I'll make sure to check them out. Thanks

Be102 · Dec 3, 2016

Just did a 25 gallon water change. Should I wait a few before testing my levels? Or can I do it now? I added a capful of prime to the water whilst mixing it too. I have a bottle of clarity I was curious if I could dose too? I just have a lot of stuff floating around in the tank and it's just circulating. I also have these things.. not sure if they're the snails or whatnot but they're legit everywhere, I always thought there was just a string or two floating around. Basically they're hard pointy stubs . The picture is really bad, sorry.. but on the other side my tank does look better and cleaner!