Possible velvet irradication. Many warnings inside.

drawman

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 27, 2016
Messages
3,537
Reaction score
3,604
Location
Florida
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Not yet. I'm in the process of making a big move, so all experimentation is shut down until after the 1st of next year. The good news is after that, I will have access to mass quantities of fish to expand my research. :D

Now you have me interested! You didn't buy quality marine did you? :eek:

Wow, some good stuff here. My bleach treatment has been done with for a while. Months later fish are fine and growing happy. I treated for several weeks. @Brew12 i agree that some nitrifying bacteria may die. But i never suffered a re cycle. So maybe the loss is minimal. Cyano was able to thrive in it which is a negative.

The positive is, there have been no outbreaks. Also during treatment the colors of my acros were amazing and bright. After treatment was done rhey seem to dill back. Water clarity was also awesome during this.

Remember the ppm we avhieve here is less that the drinking water coming out of your tap.

My concern was the was the bleach binding with natural organics to form thms. This is a cancer causer in humans...no know effect on fish

I can't remember if you addressed this but did you every test with a molly?
 

Reefahholic

Acropora Farmer
View Badges
Joined
Sep 5, 2014
Messages
7,425
Reaction score
6,220
Location
Houston, TX
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Humble...you moving to the H or what?? I know you coming for a little while, but how long?
 

TheWhiteFord

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Messages
665
Reaction score
267
Location
York, PA
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
This thread is so interesting! Kudos to @BoneXriffic and @twilliard for pioneering this. My only concern is the cell damage to the other organisms in the tank[emoji51]. On the other hand it is better than tearing apart your reef to catch your fish and treat them. IMO you should only use this method if you get velvet in your DT as it probably does less damage to the fish and coral than tearing the reef apart and treating the fish.
 

edosan

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Apr 6, 2015
Messages
527
Reaction score
376
Location
Chile
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Thanks for sharing guys, very interesting. So basically now is not too bad use the aiptasia wand with high voltage. (I do it all the time)
 
OP
OP
BoneXriffic

BoneXriffic

GO BLUE!
View Badges
Joined
Mar 10, 2016
Messages
1,525
Reaction score
1,192
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Does anyone have any updates on this?
What would you like to know. I believe i was the only one to test.

Been months since treatment ended, all fish are fine and disease free. Well, no symtomps. It is hard to believe velvet would remain dormant in all of these fish lol
 

melypr1985

totally addicted
View Badges
Joined
May 4, 2014
Messages
15,113
Reaction score
23,543
Location
Dallas area
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
What would you like to know. I believe i was the only one to test.

Been months since treatment ended, all fish are fine and disease free. Well, no symtomps. It is hard to believe velvet would remain dormant in all of these fish lol

You could test it. Add a black molly that's been transferred over to saltwater (by you, not an LFS). See what happens. The idea is that the molly has never been exposed to saltwater diseases or parasites and would have no defense against them. The black color makes it easier to see any spots that may show up.
 
OP
OP
BoneXriffic

BoneXriffic

GO BLUE!
View Badges
Joined
Mar 10, 2016
Messages
1,525
Reaction score
1,192
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
You could test it. Add a black molly that's been transferred over to saltwater (by you, not an LFS). See what happens. The idea is that the molly has never been exposed to saltwater diseases or parasites and would have no defense against them. The black color makes it easier to see any spots that may show up.
My lfs planned tonstock some converted ones! Soon
 

melypr1985

totally addicted
View Badges
Joined
May 4, 2014
Messages
15,113
Reaction score
23,543
Location
Dallas area
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
My lfs planned tonstock some converted ones! Soon

You don't want the ones that are already converted. They are likely to have been exposed to a disease or two along the way. You want to convert them yourself for a good solid test.
 

Breakthecycle2

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Jun 1, 2013
Messages
3,653
Reaction score
827
Location
Hasbrouck Heights, NJ
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I dosed bleach yesterday. I didn't today because I ended up taking the tank apart an getting all the fish out. I had 8.75% bleach. So I did .003/.087 x 200 gallons and got 6.8mls. I dosed 7 because my tank is closer to 250 and didn't want to over do it. My corals were not happy. They closed up almost right away, but rebounded today. Im hopeful that this or a hybrid of this could work. I just think more testing needs to be done.
 
OP
OP
BoneXriffic

BoneXriffic

GO BLUE!
View Badges
Joined
Mar 10, 2016
Messages
1,525
Reaction score
1,192
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I dosed bleach yesterday. I didn't today because I ended up taking the tank apart an getting all the fish out. I had 8.75% bleach. So I did .003/.087 x 200 gallons and got 6.8mls. I dosed 7 because my tank is closer to 250 and didn't want to over do it. My corals were not happy. They closed up almost right away, but rebounded today. Im hopeful that this or a hybrid of this could work. I just think more testing needs to be done.
The corals wont die from it, as there have been several tests with, after a few days they seem to begin to brighten up lol.

@twilliard dosed to the point of killing fish, much higher than the recomended amount and didnt lose a single coral.
 

4FordFamily

Tang, Angel, and Wrasse Nerd!
View Badges
Joined
Feb 26, 2015
Messages
20,434
Reaction score
47,523
Location
Carmel, Indiana
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I dosed bleach yesterday. I didn't today because I ended up taking the tank apart an getting all the fish out. I had 8.75% bleach. So I did .003/.087 x 200 gallons and got 6.8mls. I dosed 7 because my tank is closer to 250 and didn't want to over do it. My corals were not happy. They closed up almost right away, but rebounded today. Im hopeful that this or a hybrid of this could work. I just think more testing needs to be done.
With everything else you have going on this is not a risk I would take.
 

twilliard

Tank pests..
View Badges
Joined
Jun 3, 2015
Messages
10,332
Reaction score
9,493
Location
Central Washington
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
The corals wont die from it, as there have been several tests with, after a few days they seem to begin to brighten up lol.

@twilliard dosed to the point of killing fish, much higher than the recomended amount and didnt lose a single coral.
This is correct
To my amazement I had "0" coral loss with massive amounts of bleach
Due to college I have not been able to further my work with bleach but I do plan to in the near future.
 

Humblefish

Dr. Fish
View Badges
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
Messages
22,424
Reaction score
34,844
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
You don't want the ones that are already converted. They are likely to have been exposed to a disease or two along the way. You want to convert them yourself for a good solid test.

+1 FW mollies should have no built-up resistance to SW diseases; assuming the molly has never been in SW.
 

edosan

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Apr 6, 2015
Messages
527
Reaction score
376
Location
Chile
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Hi guys, any update on this?
Any one else try this?
How long does bleach stays in the tank before degradates into NaCl probably?

This post is very interestig, bleach might have a use in reef tanks...it may control bacterial bloom, dinnos, and so on. Regarding Cyano, probably is the algae form of cyano and not the bacterial one?..donno..ideas.

Amazing corals where in perfect shape after treatment. I will experiment on this soon! Thanks for sharing!

Final Though, will thunderstorms in the ocean will produce Chorine/bleach due electrolisis? so bleach is a natural ocurrence in oceans?
8c86589a8a3f88d79bf24880fde3aabe.jpg
 
Last edited:

jenreefer

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2016
Messages
596
Reaction score
727
Location
Magnolia, TX
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
So first and foremost, this is still early in the testing phase. Also this will not be widley accepted by many. And a big warning, I do not reccomend nor endorse anyone attempting this just yet.

Hope someday this works and becomes a sticky =)

So next up. The honorable mentions, I would also like these, and everyone with positive and/or negative feed back to please interject! I am a big boy and can handle it....
@twilliard @Humblefish @melypr1985 @4FordFamily @FL_Reefer others as well, sorry if you wern't added

This journey started with Twillard, whom was battling the good fight, dinos. A plague that has taken so many fellow reefers, me as well. Through many trials and errors he found something that worked. Some it did not quite work so well for. For me a cure, and this left me to wonder, thanks to humble and mel, and all the research they have led me too in Marine Velvet. Most of us have faced this devilish disease.

I have learned that velvet is a form of dino. If you wish to know common cures you will find much info from humble and mel. A big one, fallow. But some of us have a terrible time getting fish out of a display tank. Most of the time we are too late.

No before I go any further, I fully support you to QUARANTINE FIRST.
Eh, yeah it is totally a wise decision.

I however was not so smart. And after several deaths, And 2 immune fish I found myself in a bad place. 2 fish that wont die and are impossible to catch in a full reef 90gallon aquarium. Can't fallow, can't treat the host fish. So what do I do? Nothing, I assumed I was stuck with the lonley clown and blue damsel forever.

So knowing Velvet is a form of dino, and knowing of a fairly invasive but promising cure I decide its time to add some fish, first another clown. Hardy. 2 weeks later, a blue hippo. Not so hardy. Now it has been a little over a week for the tang, and three weeks for the clown and guess what? Yep, no signs, no spots....nothing but happy healthy fish

Yes it is early to say for sure. As I said early in the testing phase. But things look promising.

Now some of you know where this is going. For the others, and I am preparing my self to duck. I know things will be thrown.

Bleach

There, I said it. The stuff you use to make your toilet tollerable, ruins your clothes.... All things that should scare you from using it in your aquarium. So do not use it...just yet. Let me save the world, or ruin my aquarium first. @twilliard has had some unfortunate things happen. And some good as well.
If this works, he was the pioneer!

So what am I dosing? Well all bleach has a potencey. Liquid bleach ranges from 5 to 12 percent... so, much maths later we came to a dose rate of .003 divided by bleach percentage x how many gallons....to give you ml per gallon....so for 6 percent bleach, .003 divided by .06 x 100gallons gave me my dose....the math is...unimportant now however as....yep, still testing. 3 weeks straight of dosing now and no ill effects. 5ml of bleach twice a day.

But consider the possibilities. A possible reef safe cure for velvet. And who knows what other diseases we face might come from this IF IT WORKS! and thats a big of. I am skeptical but optimistic.

Much updates to come, and may the pitchforks and fires commence...and for the end of the beginning of this journey how bout a pic of some happy not dying fish living in a tank recently wrecked by velvet
1470443924410276345472.jpg
I use bleach on all parts of tank, with no ill effects. I have long believed that used properly, it keeps all things fishy healthy. As with all chemicals, too much is a bad thing.

I am eager to see where this goes and willing to set up some experiments to further the cause. Since Velvet is killing the Houston fish market right now, there is no difficulty finding velvet infected fish here.

Keep us posted.
 

spartanman22

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Oct 10, 2014
Messages
772
Reaction score
588
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I am curious to give this a try on my DT for the purpose of ICH. I QT'd all my fish; however, I do not QT my corals and inverts and I think I unintentionally introduced ICH into my setup. I have a UV and feed heavy so I'm presently running an ICH management system. Every now and then spots pop-up on a fish here or there, but they never last more than a day or two. So, I think I'll give this a try on my home setup to see if I can eliminate ICH once and for all. Who knows if it'll be successful, but I'm confident low levels of hypo wont negatively impact our system. I know reefers who use tap water to run their reefs, and I've personally ran tap water systems with freshwater and fish-only saltwater in the past.

Also, interestingly enough there is a disinfection process known as electrochlorination in which a low DC voltage is applied to a saltwater solution. H2O + NaCl + energy = NaOCl + H2. So, if you've ever had any stray voltage in your systems you've likely produced "bleach" inadvertently.

I'm going to grab some samples and confirm, with a microscope, that I do in fact have ICH, and then I'd like to do some testing with samples and dosages of bleach to determine effectiveness on ICH.
 

AllSignsPointToFish

"No Longer The Guy Without FaceBook"
View Badges
Joined
Oct 1, 2015
Messages
5,851
Reaction score
9,670
Location
Gulf Breeze, Florida
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I use bleach on all parts of tank, with no ill effects. I have long believed that used properly, it keeps all things fishy healthy. As with all chemicals, too much is a bad thing.
I was kind of thinking along the same lines. I bleach the cr@p out of my filter socks weekly, then let air-dry after a good rinse. I can still detect a bleach smell even after the socks are dried. I wonder if residual sodium hypochlorite (it is a salt, afterall) on equipment/socks is enough to have an impact on ich/velvet. While at concentrations much lower than what is experienced during dosing, it would be present in low quantities continuously in my system. Interesting!
 

A worm with high fashion and practical utility: Have you ever kept feather dusters in your reef aquarium?

  • I currently have feather dusters in my tank.

    Votes: 73 37.8%
  • Not currently, but I have had feather dusters in my tank in the past.

    Votes: 66 34.2%
  • I have not had feather dusters, but I hope to in the future.

    Votes: 25 13.0%
  • I have no plans to have feather dusters in my tank.

    Votes: 28 14.5%
  • Other.

    Votes: 1 0.5%
Back
Top