Saddle valves and Low pressure to RODI unit

jason2459

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This was an eye opener to me. I always thought I had pretty good pressure and was just fine for my common and standard 5 stage RODI unit.

Right around 74psi
053d47893b48fb7cf7312f8e0f3fcb67.jpg



My system has been running like this for years. I do remember it being at one point around 76psi. I use a very easy to use and implement saddle valve to a 1/4" OD feed line to the RODI unit.

4b7bc3e9abab4898c2937e48dd0449dc.jpg



Great so far and over the past 8 years or so I've slowly upgraded the system and also my tank size. Right now I'm using dual 150gpd RO membranes and get something between 200-300gpd.

I'm always looking at ways to up the production rate, reduce the waste water, higher rejection rates etc with out having a 2 to 10 grand commercial unit.

I was also looking at the life of the carbon blocks I'm currently using and I was looking at getting a larger block with 20" x 2.5" housings vs the standard 10"x2.5" housing to handle higher amounts of chlorine removal (or worse chloramines, call your local water department to find out. I call yearly as it can change).

I then ran across The Gapper at Buckeye Hydro
http://www.buckeyehydro.com/the-gapper-light-commercial-ro-system/

I fell in love. 400gpd, 1:1 waste ratio, 98.5-99% rejection, the 20" housings I was looking for anyway, booster pump, autoflush and solenoid system, etc and well under a grand.

Their rep has been tremendously helpful in answering questions on what I'll need. One of the things was the Gapper uses 3/8" tubing vs. 1/4" and they highly recommended against using saddle valves. To paraphrase: the saddle valve is barely ok for standard RO units and terrible choice for the commercial units including the gapper.

So, I went to tap into my copper piping with a T which was very easy using some press to fit fittings. I used some sharkbites from homedepot. (Make sure if your house uses the copper piping for ground like mine does you get ground clamps and jump across. I did up higher then whats in the picture.)

3/4" slip to a T that reduces to 1/2" out the side. Then a angle stop quarter turn valve to the 3/8" tubing needed for the Gapper. It's actually 1/4" ID pex here which is 3/8" OD
f560ac087123166b4b91ba3477094168.jpg


If in doubt get a plumber. ;)

And I was curious just how "bad" that saddle valve is to use... So, I slapped on to the end where that 1/4" pex runs too a john guest type 3/8" micro valve and a 3/8" to 1/4" reducing quick connect union.

89d444154bbe5d949a263a259529a422.jpg



Then I hooked up that same 1/4" tubing going to the saddle valve that was producing around 74psi to that new 3/8" to 1/4" union.

I was expecting maybe a little increase in pressure. But what I got was shocking to me

Close to 20psi increase!
d566334708633959f2b90db579185595.jpg



Summary: Converting from a saddle valve to a T right from my supply water increased the water pressure by close to 20psi

So, if you're using a saddle valve and think you need a booster pump go ahead and swap out that saddle valve and get the right fittings to connect right to the supply line. You may not need that booster pump.

Check to see what the membrane is rated at and talk with a reputable rep to find a good solution.

Thanks again to buckeye hydro for answering my multiple questions so far.
 
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jason2459

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Oh and FYI all prefilters were just replaced a couple weeks ago so the drop from what I remembered around 76psi to 74psi seen above could just be fluctuations in supply pressure or as explained to me the little needle in the saddle valve could be getting scale build up.
 
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jason2459

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And a good question by someone.

The pressure shown above is with water flowing normally through all stages.
 

Pola0502ds

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Funny you mention this, I am going through this with a tank I take care for a elementary school. Link in my signature. We got a RODI unit, hooked up with a saddle valve, and we are getting 42 psi. Are you saying that if I TEE off the supply line and take it down to 1/4" that might solve the problem?
 
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jason2459

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Funny you mention this, I am going through this with a tank I take care for a elementary school. Link in my signature. We got a RODI unit, hooked up with a saddle valve, and we are getting 42 psi. Are you saying that if I TEE off the supply line and take it down to 1/4" that might solve the problem?

It certainly may. For me it made a significant difference in the running pressure. How long is your feed line?
 
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jason2459

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Is the Gapper RO or RO/DI?
The Gapper is RO only but can easily have DI stages added to it. Just get a new housing, bracket, screws, fittings, and refillable cartridge. Most all of the high flow commercial units I've seen are RO only.


Like over the years I have added two more DI stages to my original unit.
20170128_161512.jpg
 

SandJ

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Oooh, those fittings make it look easier than sweating the pipes.

And this same principle applies for refrigerator ice makers and water dispensers. If you notice low pressure, it may be from a saddle valve. Been there, done that lol
 

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I've put off getting an RODI for a long time and finally picked one up over Black Friday. During christmas break I finally had some free time to do the install. I too decided against the saddle valve as its very prone to leaks and doesn't give you the best hole or valve control.

I used the Sharkbite fitting and installed it myself. Super easy and a much more reliable installation. They even come in Reducing Tees with the valve built in.

wwiZ5d4h.jpg
 
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jason2459

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Oooh, those fittings make it look easier than sweating the pipes.

And this same principle applies for refrigerator ice makers and water dispensers. If you notice low pressure, it may be from a saddle valve. Been there, done that lol
I absolutely hate plumbing. Anything that makes it easier is a blessing. Those sharkbites aren't cheap but so well worth it. Definitely make sure to get the releasing tool.
 
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jason2459

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Funny you mention this, I am going through this with a tank I take care for a elementary school. Link in my signature. We got a RODI unit, hooked up with a saddle valve, and we are getting 42 psi. Are you saying that if I TEE off the supply line and take it down to 1/4" that might solve the problem?

Did you ever get that running pressure up?
 

Pola0502ds

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No I didn't, I switched the supply connection from the saddle valve to direct from the faucet and got 10 more psi so now i'm at 52psi and it still won't work. I think it's because it has a 150 GPD ro membrane in it. With 52 PSI only I think it needs more to push through it. I brought up my RODI unit that has a 75 GPD and it worked fine.
 
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jason2459

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No I didn't, I switched the supply connection from the saddle valve to direct from the faucet and got 10 more psi so now i'm at 52psi and it still won't work. I think it's because it has a 150 GPD ro membrane in it. With 52 PSI only I think it needs more to push through it. I brought up my RODI unit that has a 75 GPD and it worked fine.

Nice, brought it up 10 psi. But yeah still low for an RO unit and not very optimal for even a 75gpd unit. You could get a booster pump.
http://www.buckeyehydro.com/booster-and-delivery-pumps/
 
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jason2459

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I'd call up buckeye hydro or spectrapure. Both have been super helpful and can get you going the right direction. May not be a strong enough booster pump.
 
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