Slight 'Shock' in Aquarium. Stray Volts?

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Hey Guys,

So recently I've been feeling a slight shock (mostly on my fingertip, as I often cut my nails too short and it becomes a bit sensitive) in my aquarium!

It had my concerned as stray volts. I got out the Volt Meter, and tested on VCA with the black wire in the right of the outlet (small vertical line)), and gives me a reading of 60-70 when I put the red tip in the Tank.
I then unplugged EVERYTHING, but still had the same reading! Is the electricity still flowing since maybe it wasn't "drained" from the tank yet, and I tested too soon? (Items were still in the tank)

(When I put the red tip in the big vertical of the outlet socket, i get 120).

I then tested with some aquarium water in a cup, which doesn't have the same shock factor on my finger, gives me a reading of 10-20.

I purchased a grounding probe and inserted in the aquarium, and today was shocked again! Re-did my test, and still giving me a reading of 60-70.

I can deal with the slight shock on my cuts if this is common, but my worry is when my fish go in the main tank from QT, they might get the same shock and possibly wipeout if a unit is causing this!

I tested my quarantine as well, which gave the same results. Am I just not testing right, or have faulty parts, or is this normal?

Equip in Main Tank:
2x HOB filters, 2x powerheads, 1x 200w heater, 1x in DT skimmer, hang on tank lights, and 1x battery powered thermometer

Equip in QT:
1x HOB filter, 1x powerhead, 1x 50w heater


I guess my next experiment to testing is to physically remove objects 1 by 1 (instead of unplugging), and seeing if levels change. Thoughts? Should I be worried? Why would I not get lower results w/ a grounding probe in?
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
tutmatt3

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Ok, just retested - according to this image:


Outlet-Terminals.jpg

(Red Wire in tank)

With Grounding Probe in:
Black Wire Neutral - 54
Black Wire Ground - .002

Without Grounding Probe in:
Black Wire Neutral - 54
Black Wire Ground - 2.02

If I'm testing right, I guess my fish will be safe if results base off 'ground'.
If they base off 'Neutral', then I def have a problem.


Also did the same test w/ the heater on. Similar results as above.
(note, there is no shocking feeling right now, all other equipment was on though..)
 
Last edited:

Sm51498

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Aug 22, 2016
Messages
437
Reaction score
440
Location
Raleigh, NC
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Could it just be that saltwater hurts your sensitive skin under your nails? That happens to me.
 

cbutkos

Community Member
View Badges
Joined
Jan 19, 2017
Messages
36
Reaction score
43
Location
Long Island, NY
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
If I have the slightest cut/abrasion/hang nail and I put my hand in I always get a shock feeling.

What I would do is use the ground prong and unplug one thing at a time to see what is giving you those two volts.
 

redfishbluefish

Stay Positive, Stay Productive
View Badges
Joined
Mar 22, 2012
Messages
11,701
Reaction score
25,694
Location
Sayreville, NJ
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
My two cents......you're feeling the close cut (injury) of your nails too short.

Now I also question if that outlet is wired correctly. Doesn't matter what color probe, but set to volts AC (with some meters a capital V with a squiggly line over it), and put one probe in the long line outlet (neutral), and the other in the round outlet (ground). You should have zero volts.

Otherwise that couple volts you are seeing in your tank is most likely induced voltage (voltage generated by spinning magnets......ie, pumps).

Hope this helps.
 

Sagecritter4life

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Jan 21, 2017
Messages
370
Reaction score
370
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Chuckle...make sure not just static accumulation ;-) I live in arid dry low humidity part of country and when I stick my hand in aquarium it will jump a 1/4 inch spark as touch the water for the first time when start working in it as discharges off static I've accumulated just walking from one end of house to the other lol. I joke with my gf when I reach out touch her nose while humming "you light up my life" usually getting a negative effect ;-).
 
OP
OP
tutmatt3

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Could it just be that saltwater hurts your sensitive skin under your nails? That happens to me.
Ya, I confirmed by taking the same AQ water in a plastic cup and putting my finger in there, no shock sensation

If I have the slightest cut/abrasion/hang nail and I put my hand in I always get a shock feeling.
What I would do is use the ground prong and unplug one thing at a time to see what is giving you those two volts.

Hmm ok, so it's not just me. Good to know. When I was holding a razor blade since I was going to trim some glue, it was def. magnified

My two cents......you're feeling the close cut (injury) of your nails too short.

Now I also question if that outlet is wired correctly. Doesn't matter what color probe, but set to volts AC (with some meters a capital V with a squiggly line over it), and put one probe in the long line outlet (neutral), and the other in the round outlet (ground). You should have zero volts.

Otherwise that couple volts you are seeing in your tank is most likely induced voltage (voltage generated by spinning magnets......ie, pumps).

Hope this helps.

So when I use that method (one on long neutral, one on round ground), my wall socket gives me 8. Then when I plug the surge protector back, and check a socket on the surge, it gives me 54! (with everything else on on that surge)
Other random outlets throughout the house give me 8, 10, 18, 4, etc.

Chuckle...make sure not just static accumulation ;-) I live in arid dry low humidity part of country and when I stick my hand in aquarium it will jump a 1/4 inch spark as touch the water for the first time when start working in it as discharges off static I've accumulated just walking from one end of house to the other lol. I joke with my gf when I reach out touch her nose while humming "you light up my life" usually getting a negative effect ;-).
Hah, and that's how I would end up single again xD



I checked today & no shock sensation. I guess I'll have to wait for it to do it again before I can properly check.
 

alton

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
1,868
Reaction score
3,215
Location
Zuehl, Texas
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
What you are calling the Neutral is the grounded terminal (white wire/silver screw), what you are calling grounded is the grounding (green/bare wire/green screw), the small slot is the ungrounded (black/red wire/ gold screw) Between the grounding and grounded terminal's your voltage reading should be 0, anything else and you have either a floating neutral at your service and or a bad/missing grounding electrode, or the fact the grounding and grounded conductors are on the same bar in a sub panel in your home. While wearing the proper PPE you should have a reading of 120v +/- between the grounded terminal and the ungrounded terminal and also the exact same voltage between the grounding terminal and the ungrounded terminal. If you are getting voltage between the grounded and grounding, or if the voltage is not the same when involving the ungrounded circuit with the other two call an electrical contractor.
 
OP
OP
tutmatt3

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
What you are calling the Neutral is the grounded terminal (white wire/silver screw), what you are calling grounded is the grounding (green/bare wire/green screw), the small slot is the ungrounded (black/red wire/ gold screw) Between the grounding and grounded terminal's your voltage reading should be 0, anything else and you have either a floating neutral at your service and or a bad/missing grounding electrode, or the fact the grounding and grounded conductors are on the same bar in a sub panel in your home. While wearing the proper PPE you should have a reading of 120v +/- between the grounded terminal and the ungrounded terminal and also the exact same voltage between the grounding terminal and the ungrounded terminal. If you are getting voltage between the grounded and grounding, or if the voltage is not the same when involving the ungrounded circuit with the other two call an electrical contractor.
Yup, getting a reading between grounded/grounding (50 if I remember), and voltage also is not the same when comparing.
 

Brewer06Ky

New Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
Messages
5
Reaction score
6
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Had a similar problem when the tank was on a concrete floor and a generator was wired In to switch on for back up power. Not 100% sure what was causing the neutral to feed stray voltage. But to fix it I ended up isolating my grounds and neutrals in the breaker box. Then running a separate grounding rod from the breaker box for the grounds. Your neutrals and grounds go to the same place in your breaker box. I read somewhere if there is a large amount of the neutrals in contact with the grounds it cans feed voltage back. A simpler solution would be to run a copper wire to a ground rod and tie it in to just the ground probe. Hope this helps.
 
OP
OP
tutmatt3

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Had a similar problem when the tank was on a concrete floor and a generator was wired In to switch on for back up power. Not 100% sure what was causing the neutral to feed stray voltage. But to fix it I ended up isolating my grounds and neutrals in the breaker box. Then running a separate grounding rod from the breaker box for the grounds. Your neutrals and grounds go to the same place in your breaker box. I read somewhere if there is a large amount of the neutrals in contact with the grounds it cans feed voltage back. A simpler solution would be to run a copper wire to a ground rod and tie it in to just the ground probe. Hope this helps.
Thanks for that info! I'm Def too nervous to mess with the breaker box, will probably have to call in a professional

What harm would happen if left untouched?
 

redfishbluefish

Stay Positive, Stay Productive
View Badges
Joined
Mar 22, 2012
Messages
11,701
Reaction score
25,694
Location
Sayreville, NJ
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Here's were my brain is right now on this outlet. If this outlet is otherwise working normal.....you plug something in and it works fine, I'd first look at the ground wire. If it looks good with this outlet, I'd go back to the next one in the circuit and check that one, and so on. Again, if the outlet otherwise works normal, that voltage you're seeing is "phantom voltage." JMTC
 

Brewer06Ky

New Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 15, 2017
Messages
5
Reaction score
6
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Everything in our case was wired correctly from the best I could tell it was all new and I done 90% of the work. The first fish in the tanks freaked out trying to get out of the tanks. I isolate the grounds to a new rod problem solved.
 

alton

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
1,868
Reaction score
3,215
Location
Zuehl, Texas
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Thanks for that info! I'm Def too nervous to mess with the breaker box, will probably have to call in a professional

What harm would happen if left untouched?
A floating neutral is never a good thing, it is better to be safe than sorry. I had a friend who had a similar situation, but much worse. His was caused by combining the grounded and grounding wires on the same bar at a sub panel along with his service ground being 200' away from that panel. The two issues were his tank shocking him with the ground probe installed, and he was getting shocked while taking showers in the upstairs bathroom. Since he had a poor service ground, his grounding probe was using his sump as a grounding means placing current in to his tank. Also his security contractor had installed his panel upstairs and ran a water pipe ground, since he had no ground to speak of, and the grounding conductor with the water pipe ground being bonded, he had current and voltage through out his plumbing.
 
OP
OP
tutmatt3

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Hmm, I'm thinking it's phantom voltage, but might have to reach out & have a professional check it out.
What would be the resolution if indeed there is wiring issues? Just the electrician making changes @ the box, or worse?

Obviously hard to say, but I know my parents would freak the hell out when they see me bringing in an electrical contractor (when to them the house was working perfectly fine) after getting my aquarium set up haha.
My aquarium will be the problem in their eyes lol
 

alton

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
1,868
Reaction score
3,215
Location
Zuehl, Texas
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
If you are getting 50 volts between the grounding and grounded terminals at a duplex receptacle, things are not fine. By you testing for your aquarium you found the issue, you did not create it. I just want to make sure you are testing at the wall receptacle, not a receptacle on a plug strip correct?
 
OP
OP
tutmatt3

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
If you are getting 50 volts between the grounding and grounded terminals at a duplex receptacle, things are not fine. By you testing for your aquarium you found the issue, you did not create it. I just want to make sure you are testing at the wall receptacle, not a receptacle on a plug strip correct?
As noted, when testing the wall, I get 8
When testing a power strip used for the aq (with everything on), I get 54

In the same wall socket
 

alton

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
1,868
Reaction score
3,215
Location
Zuehl, Texas
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
POWER STRIP.JPG
PLUG.JPG
my wall plug .3, power strip 1.3. I would check other duplex receptacles throughout your home and try another power strip. Remember wear proper PPE while using a meter
 
OP
OP
tutmatt3

tutmatt3

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
607
Reaction score
367
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
POWER STRIP.JPG
PLUG.JPG
my wall plug .3, power strip 1.3. I would check other duplex receptacles throughout your home and try another power strip. Remember wear proper PPE while using a meter
Thanks so much! I'll go around testing Today!
Sorry, ppe?
 

A worm with high fashion and practical utility: Have you ever kept feather dusters in your reef aquarium?

  • I currently have feather dusters in my tank.

    Votes: 64 36.8%
  • Not currently, but I have had feather dusters in my tank in the past.

    Votes: 59 33.9%
  • I have not had feather dusters, but I hope to in the future.

    Votes: 25 14.4%
  • I have no plans to have feather dusters in my tank.

    Votes: 26 14.9%
  • Other.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
Back
Top