sorry, long post. Having issue with maintaining alk w/high ca

[atitagain]

Sorry to do a copy/paste but i posted this on another forum and didn't any useful help besides "get used to dosing"

this is a cut/paste of my thread from another forum below:

current tank params:
ca 470
alk if i do nothing 6 dkh, w/kalk drip (currently kalk drip is off due to high ca)
mg 1320
phos 0 (hana)
nitrate 2

here is goes:


tank is mixed reef with LPS and SPS and a few softies. SPS totals 6 pieces and all are currently looking and growing great. My 2 monti pieces grow pretty fast, within two days or so i can see the growth spread on the "base" covering rock. I normally run kalk drip and tank has been stable. Once the SPS "woke" up and started the growth above my alk has been difficult to maintain. I use red sea blue bucket and do weekly water change of 4 gs on my 30G cube (~25 total gallons).


I was on vacation for 1.5 weeks and the tank got a little out of params, not blaming the wife....but..haha. I've been fighting to keep balance since I returned.


I tested alk yesterday after work and it was 6. I added red sea part B in the amount 7ml so it should have raised the alk level to 6.7. I test this morning and alk was back down to 6 even.


My calcium got out of whack and was 490 last night. I did dose part A and messed up the dose...my fault (a week ago). I took the kalk drip off all last night and calcium was 475 this morning.


I added 5ml of part B this morning to raise alk to 6.5 and planned to add another .5 about noon to bring to 7.


I aslo plan to do a 4g WC today in efforts to balance things back out.


I am assuming that the high calcium level is lowering the alk. So the water change intent is to help lower ca. I plan to leave the Kalk off until I get it balanced.


with dripping kalk, normally my calcium stays around 420-430 but alk always wants to drop......is this normal with growing SPS? Am I doing it correctly by adding the part B solo since ca is holding but alk is dropping?




here is todays review: (next day)


i tested tank and WC water before doing the water change.


WC water: 420 Ca and 8.1 Alk (red sea blue bucket)


Tank water: 475 Ca and 7 Alk


16% water change so post water change my levels should read


465 Ca and 7.2 Alk


here is my plan for going fwd:


tested alk 3hrs after WC and my math was correct, Alk at 7.2

test sunday in the morning and see if/how much it drops without apex running kalk. I am hesitant to add/raise alk today since it was already raise 1.2dkh from 6 this morning with WC and red sea part B


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ok, I tested this morning without running kalk at all yesterday or today:


alk was 6.6

ca stayed the same @ 465


The tank used .6 alk in 16 hrs and didn't use any calcium. My plan is raise alk by 1 dkh today, slowly over the course of the day to bring it up to 7.6 total. By tomorrow morning it should consume .6 and be at 7. Tomorrow I will added more part B to raise it 1 dhk and it should bring the tank to 8. It should consume the same .6 so the following day I would only have to raise it .6 to maintain 8 dhk.


my question is: should I keep kalk off and do the alk dosing to bring the Ca level down (through tank consumption) and then when it's balanced start my kalk drip again to maintain the levels?



ok, so I added enough red sea part B (10ml) to raise the level in my tank 1dhk from the tested 6.6 this morning @ 1000. tank has 25g so the calculation is pretty easy since it's 1ml = .1dkh. It's now 900 pm and I tested again and my alk was 6.7


can my 25g tank really be using 1.7-2 dkh a day? there are only 6 frags on SPS and some LPS...all growing. If this is the case why isn't the calcium being used at even rate?


please someone help. I don't want to mess up my tank nor do I want to let alk drop to an level low enough to affect my corals.

corals
seasons greeting monti that is growing fast (about 3"x3"
sunset monti that is growing fast (2"x2") growth is enough to cover the large square plug in a month
green slimmer 2 branches 1.5" each. (in a month it covered the frag plug)
neon green/purple birds nest (2" but grew a few new branches in a month)
green/purple bonsai gawf (it was glued to frag and now has total overgrown the frag and maybe put
1/4 in height on all branches)
pink unknown sps (2"x2") growth is about the same as the rest above
5 headed frog spawn
4 headed orange hammer
2 headed green/purple hammer
4 total 2" acans
2" chalice




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30G jbj all-in-one, Tunze 9004, 1.5" sand bed/30# rock, 2x Kessil A160we, Vortech MP10, Tunze ATO, Apex Jr with PM1 module, In-Tank media basket


Current Tank Info: 30g jbj rimless, vortech wavemaker, kessil 160 + controller, tunze skimmer

 

[atitagain]

i have also validated my alk tester (hana) with red sea, they both show the same readings

 

[johnyboy]

. Most important thing is to go SLOW. Take your time raising the alk because you can cause a lot of damage. Been dosing esv alk and calcium for a while by hand and everything was stable for many months until the last two months my alk has been very low. I decided to go with a dosing pump to create stability and all my levels are back to normal thank god. Maybe get rid of the solutions your using (kalk and red sea) and go with something new like esv 2 part and put it on a dosing pump. [emoji1360]

 

[atitagain]

. Most important thing is to go SLOW. Take your time raising the alk because you can cause a lot of damage. Been dosing esv alk and calcium for a while by hand and everything was stable for many months until the last two months my alk has been very low. I decided to go with a dosing pump to create stability and all my levels are back to normal thank god. Maybe get rid of the solutions your using (kalk and red sea) and go with something new like esv 2 part and put it on a dosing pump. [emoji1360]

i stopped the kalk over the last few days because I thought it would "maintain" the ca level where it is currently at 470. Ca is staying put but alk is dropping each day in the rates stated above.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

i stopped the kalk over the last few days because I thought it would "maintain" the ca level where it is currently at 470. Ca is staying put but alk is dropping each day in the rates stated above.

That is what you first see when underdosing both calcium and alkalinity. You just cannot detect the drop in calcium as easily with a kit becuase it is much smaller on a percentage basis.

 

[Mr.Rocc]

Im not the most experienced but I had an issue with this as well. All I did was leveled out my parameters including mg. Then waited two days and tested again. I started dosing small amounts and tested again 3 days later until i found a consistency. Its just what worked for me.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The tank used .6 alk in 16 hrs and didn't use any calcium.

For a drop of alkalinity of 0.6 dKH, the expected drop in calcium is about 4 ppm, which you would not detect with a kit, but is likely happening anyway.

 

[atitagain]

Thanks randy, so by math in roughly 10 days, ca should be a balanced level!

To confirm, leave kalk off and daily dose part B to keep alk up while ca is dropping?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

It loos to me that limewater doesn't meet the demand in your tank.

I'd plan to use a two part in addition to the limewater, and I'd dose both parts.

If you want, you can let calcium decline a bit before starting that part, but I personally would just stick with equal parts dosing based on the alk demand unless calcium is already too high (meaning, say, above 550 ppm).

 

[atitagain]

It loos to me that limewater doesn't meet the demand in your tank.

I'd plan to use a two part in addition to the limewater, and I'd dose both parts.

If you want, you can let calcium decline a bit before starting that part, but I personally would just stick with equal parts dosing based on the alk demand unless calcium is already too high (meaning, say, above 550 ppm).

randy thank for you help, again, trying to make sure i understand.

from getting home this evening:
tested alk 6.7, I added 4ml of part A and no issues. I added 2 of 4 ml of part B and it clumped together and didn't dissolve like normal. I test my mg and it was 1230, Ca is at

I hooked up my kalk drip again, and read your article on precipitation (not that i understood it all) and maybe I am more confuse now.

I don't know where to go from here. Should i do a larger 30% WC to try to bring back balance? Leave kalk drip on and then let it run it's course for a few days? Test and then adjust?

I also discovered tonight that when I was gone and the wife did the tank maintenance instead of changing the GFO, She added another bag with 6 tablespoons of BRS GFO in my media basket and left the old GFO bag in there as well. I have since removed the second bag of GFO a few hours ago.

 

[atitagain]

well, I am making up 8G for a WC so I guess I will see if a 30% brings everything back in balance/levels. I will drip kalk like normal and test levels tomorrow morning and then 2 days from WC day/time and see what the result is

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Can you expand more on what this means?

" I added 2 of 4 ml of part B and it clumped together and didn't dissolve like normal."

 

[atitagain]

Can you expand more on what this means?

" I added 2 of 4 ml of part B and it clumped together and didn't dissolve like normal."

2 of 4 means I was planning on adding 4ml total. I dosed 2ml and instead of dispersing like a silk cloud like normal it turned in small flake like substance.

I changed 30% of the water last night and tested before bed. Ca was 440 (correct reduction w/30% change) and alk was 7.11.
Kalk drip is on, it's controlled by apex and BRA doser. It's runs every hour for 15 minutes for 23 hr a day. So 552 ml in 23 hr period. Tank evaps roughly 1/4 gallon a day in winter. That dose amount is .15 gallons.

I tested alk this morning and it went from 7.11 to 6.66. I dosed 4 ml of ca and 4ml of Red Sea part B. Alk dispersed like a normal silk cloud.

I plan to test after work and see where alk is. I can up the kalk dosing to try match evap closer or leave and daily dose part a/b

I would have to run dose pump 24 minutes of every hour for 23 hours a day

 

[atitagain]

so I adjusted my apex to dose 900 ml of kalk over a 24 hour period. That should be pretty close to what the total eval is a day. I did the adjustment around noon today via apex app from work. At 1900 i tested alk and it was 6.9 so the talk held .3 of the .4ml i dosed this morning. I will test it again tomorrow morning and see what it is, make adjustment from there.

 

[atitagain]

just to follow up so everyone can actually get a closure to a thread. So the 30% WC seemed to be the starting key to restoring balance. I also figured out that my talk dose wasn't enough to maintain my alk/ca levels. I've upped my kalk to almost keep up with total evap rate. My levels are holding with maybe minor adjustments to alk