Do damsels really deserve all the bad rap?

[Lavey29]

So I have a well established reef with an eclectic group of inhabitants that includes a springer damsel, 6 line and other wrasses, coral beauty, dottyback, anthia, midas blenny, etc.... adding fish to this group can be difficult because they have a well established neighborhood. I've always liked azure damsels with the yellow tail but like other damsels they get a bad rap sometimes. I saw 2 at my LFS, didn't know if they were a mated pair or just good buds. I took a chance and dropped them in the tank. Pretty much every fish went after them first 2 days but these little guts stood their ground like little bad @$$s. Now they have fully been accepted into the reef neighborhood and it's kind of wierd because it looks like the larger springerie damsel is trying to form a triad with them now. I'm always amazed watching the behavior of the critters in my tank.

So I have to wonder why damsels always seem to get all the hate? I know some seem pretty fierce but for me certain subspecies seem perfectly fine 8n a community tank.

 

[exnisstech]

I think too many get placed into smaller tanks, many lacking a good rockscape for hiding and breaking up line of sight and those are the ones we hear about. I think often aggression that is reported comes from smaller tanks with poor rock scapes. I have a yellow tail, yellow belly, and 3 talbot damsels in one tank and they get along just fine. Two of the talbots appear to be a pair and often the yellow tail and yellow belly will swim together. They all have their own place in the rock work. I keep sixlines in two tanks also and they bother no one.

 

[Gumbies R Us]

When I was a kid, my parents had a damsel in their tank, and they never had issues with it. As others have said, people started putting a bunch into a small area, causing territorial aggression. Clowns get a bad rep for being aggressive, but we have never once had issues with ours.

 

[EuphyllinOHk]

Following because I'm curious too. I think I'd want the springeri damsel as well. Maybe the history of damsels being the cycle pilot for a lot of old school reefers (and some newer reefers) has left some long lasting scars. Maybe they are little monsters.

If I had to guess, damsels are territorial-ly mean. I've read about divers observing some seriously dedicated territory defense when they mate. I've also read of a group of 5 azures deciding to forcibly become a group of 1 in a 300g... I think the issue in aquariums arrises when owners can't provide a "territory" adequate for the fish. Granted, we can't sit them down and give them a stern talking to, but I feel as if aquascaping needs to be tailored to the fish to give them a better chance at making peace with their neighbors.

Couldn't say for sure as I've never had one (yet... maybe never?)

 

[FUNGI]

my 4 stripe attacks my hand every time I put it in the tank.....so IMO, yes, most damsels are aggressively territorial.....

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I had several blue damsels (Chrysiptera cyanea, I think) over the years and do not recall any issue. The pictures below show my 90 gallon tank (may have been a 120 by then) with the blue damsels (and two pairs of clowns)

 

[areefer01]

So I have to wonder why damsels always seem to get all the hate? I know some seem pretty fierce but for me certain subspecies seem perfectly fine 8n a community tank.

The onus is on the hobbyist to provide an environment for which the selected fish can thrive. Likewise the hobbyist also has to do a bit more research than posting on a forum, asking Alexa, Siri, CoPilot, or AI to answer compatibility or stocking questions. Not directed at you - just a generalization. Social media makes these questions easier today compared to years past when we met face to face and read books.

It also goes without saying that some Genus are better suited to communities than others. Often damsels in the Genus of Chrysiptera are recommended than others. Allens, Talbots, Azures, Rolland, Starcki, etc.

Also of note is that even when setting up environments for say a Chrysiptera damsels they may have another side of the story such that all fish are, well, different. Add in courtship and spawning behavior can change attitudes or aggression and here we are.

One last thing - bad rap is also attributed to A, beginner fish, and B, a fish used to test saltwater setups, cycle, which bring us back to C, a newbie fish. On the other hand ask a scuba diver what they see over a healthy reef.

TL; DR - hobbyist just needs to understand their needs and setup an environment for which they can thrive and coexist. I personally keep 11 Lyretail Damsels in my 210 gallon without trouble. No guarantee but one can be prepared.

 

[Fish Fan]

I think the little yellow tail is an underrated fish. I believe they are no more aggressive than a typical Clownfish.

 

[Mark Goode]

I bought a small hippo tang once; my springeri damsel killed it.

 

[Lavey29]

I think the little yellow tail is an underrated fish. I believe they are no more aggressive than a typical Clownfish.

One did kick my mated clowns out of their hammer host but the clowns just moved into another hammer condo a foot away with no issues.

 

[Lavey29]

The onus is on the hobbyist to provide an environment for which the selected fish can thrive. Likewise the hobbyist also has to do a bit more research than posting on a forum, asking Alexa, Siri, CoPilot, or AI to answer compatibility or stocking questions. Not directed at you - just a generalization. Social media makes these questions easier today compared to years past when we met face to face and read books.

It also goes without saying that some Genus are better suited to communities than others. Often damsels in the Genus of Chrysiptera are recommended than others. Allens, Talbots, Azures, Rolland, Starcki, etc.

Also of note is that even when setting up environments for say a Chrysiptera damsels they may have another side of the story such that all fish are, well, different. Add in courtship and spawning behavior can change attitudes or aggression and here we are.

One last thing - bad rap is also attributed to A, beginner fish, and B, a fish used to test saltwater setups, cycle, which bring us back to C, a newbie fish. On the other hand ask a scuba diver what they see over a healthy reef.

TL; DR - hobbyist just needs to understand their needs and setup an environment for which they can thrive and coexist. I personally keep 11 Lyretail Damsels in my 210 gallon without trouble. No guarantee but one can be prepared.

Very accurate response that I agree with. Proper environment is critical to having a successful reef neighborhood of fish even those that might not be the most community friendly. Your large tank afforded you many options my display tank is only 65g but heavily stocked with rocks and mature corals so the fish can all have defined areas and out of line of sight from others they may not want to swim socially with. It is also critical that they all have their own space at night to sleep covered and protected like they do in the ocean to avoid predators.

 

[Lavey29]

I think too many get placed into smaller tanks, many lacking a good rockscape for hiding and breaking up line of sight and those are the ones we hear about. I think often aggression that is reported comes from smaller tanks with poor rock scapes. I have a yellow tail, yellow belly, and 3 talbot damsels in one tank and they get along just fine. Two of the talbots appear to be a pair and often the yellow tail and yellow belly will swim together. They all have their own place in the rock work. I keep sixlines in two tanks also and they bother no one.

So true

 

[Lavey29]

I bought a small hippo tang once; my springeri damsel killed it.

Bummer but probably depends on the environment as the other poster stated

 

[Lavey29]

Following because I'm curious too. I think I'd want the springeri damsel as well. Maybe the history of damsels being the cycle pilot for a lot of old school reefers (and some newer reefers) has left some long lasting scars. Maybe they are little monsters.

If I had to guess, damsels are territorial-ly mean. I've read about divers observing some seriously dedicated territory defense when they mate. I've also read of a group of 5 azures deciding to forcibly become a group of 1 in a 300g... I think the issue in aquariums arrises when owners can't provide a "territory" adequate for the fish. Granted, we can't sit them down and give them a stern talking to, but I feel as if aquascaping needs to be tailored to the fish to give them a better chance at making peace with their neighbors.

Couldn't say for sure as I've never had one (yet... maybe never?)

The group becoming one is interesting. It's like only the strongest fish will keep the blood line of the species going in the ocean.

 

[Lavey29]

my 4 stripe attacks my hand every time I put it in the tank.....so IMO, yes, most damsels are aggressively territorial.....

Or he just perceives you as a large predator invading his home.

 

[Lavey29]

I had several blue damsels (Chrysiptera cyanea, I think) over the years and do not recall any issue. The pictures below show my 90 gallon tank (may have been a 120 by then) with the blue damsels (and two pairs of clowns)

Now that is a cool looking reef. A perfect simulation of the actual ocean reef.

 

[BriDroid]

I have one Springeri in my little 10 gallon cube. He was added to help with some flatworms that I had early on. I would LOVE to add another fish, but I'm really afraid that he won't let that happen

He isn't aggressive towards any of the snails, hermit crabs and the one golden banded shrimp that is in there. He doesn't attack my hand when I put it in there, but I think another fish would be a different story. So, he lives alone in his little reef kingdom.

 

[timmyrules]

I don’t think they are as bad as people make the out to be…if given the proper space…they are wonderful and rewarding to own. I’ve had multiple over the years… they have always been peaceful and good tank mates imo.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Now that is a cool looking reef. A perfect simulation of the actual ocean reef.

Thx.

 

[SomeHappyFish]

In my 30G Cube I currently have Blue Spotted Watchman, Yellow Clown, Sixline and a Springeri Damsel and I haven't see ANY aggression or Territorial behaviour except from my Watchman.

Sixline ? Model citizen
Damsel ? Model citizen

I have had more issues with a Midas Blenny then these "aggressive fish" but I guess every fish have their own personality. They both came from the same LFS and from the same tank but weeks apart.

If I had another fish, which I have no idea what. I will add it near night time, dump a lot of food, add the fish then close the lights and see what happens over the next few days.