Dr Tim's cycling nitrite not going down

[bombilate]

Hi guys I'm currently cycling using Dr Tim's and ammonia but I seem to be stuck on nitrite levels... I can't test ammonia at the moment as my test kit doesn't pick up the bottled ammonia only organic waste ammonia so I have been cycling based from the nitrite readings I have added ammonia on day one and on day 3 as nitrite was below 1ppm I didn't dose again on the next dose day as nitrite was pretty much 1ppm so it said not to dose if nitrite or ammonia is above 1ppm. I'm on day 10 now and my nitrite hasn't dropped since about day 4 it's really hard to tell if it's 1ppm or 0.8ppm the colours are so similar and my chart doesn't go past 1ppm so could be even higher tbh. I'm using JBL test kit which was very expensive so I figured it would be good enough to cycle with. I'm not sure what to do now do I add more ammonia and see if nitrite drops or do I wait it out but could be waiting forever

 

[ScottJ]

This is really helpful
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/the-supreme-guide-to-setting-up-a-saltwater-reef-aquarium.138750/

 

[Formulator]

I can't test ammonia at the moment as my test kit doesn't pick up the bottled ammonia only organic waste ammonia

This doesn’t make any sense. Ammonia is a molecule. It always has one nitrogen atom and 3 hydrogen atoms (NH3). In our aquariums it exists in equilibrium with ammonium (NH4) and some test kits indirectly measure ammonia by measuring the total ammonia nitrogen (NH3 + NH4), but whether it was generated by decay or added directly is meaningless. What test kit?

 

[bombilate]

This doesn’t make any sense. Ammonia is a molecule. It always has one nitrogen atom and 3 hydrogen atoms (NH3). In our aquariums it exists in equilibrium with ammonium (NH4) and some test kits indirectly measure ammonia by measuring the total ammonia nitrogen (NH3 + NH4), but whether it was generated by decay or added directly is meaningless. What test kit?

JBL test kit it says nh4 on the test. I even tested a few drops ammonia in 5ml of tap water and it says 0

 

[Formulator]

JBL test kit it says nh4 on the test. I even tested a few drops ammonia in 5ml of tap water and it says 0

when you add ammonia to the aquarium a majority of it is immediately converted to ammonium. This is dependent on the pH of your water. There should be a conversion table in your test kit instructions. Regardless, your test kit is perfectly capable of measuring ammonia nitrogen relevant to your cycle.

 

[Uncle99]

Rock, sand, saltwater, flow, heat plus Dr.Tims.
I like to add 2 other different bacteria blends for diversity.

Wait 4-5 days then add your first fish.

 

[bombilate]

when you add ammonia to the aquarium a majority of it is immediately converted to ammonium. This is dependent on the pH of your water. There should be a conversion table in your test kit instructions. Regardless, your test kit is perfectly capable of measuring ammonia nitrogen relevant to your cycle.

Nope it doesn't pick up Ammonia the Dr Tim's bottle says ammonium on it IV tested many times and using different water and different levels of ammonia but my kit says 0 every time. I even tried adding a few drops of ammonia into 5ml of tank water in a vial and the kit literally wouldn't read it even as 0 it just stopped the chemical reaction all other times it's just pale green which is 0 but when I add a few drops to the test tube with just water in it stays clear doesnt even come up to 0

 

[bombilate]

Rock, sand, saltwater, flow, heat plus Dr.Tims.
I like to add 2 other different bacteria blends for diversity.

Wait 4-5 days then add your first fish.

I'm already on day 10 and way to high nitrite to add fish

 

[Formulator]

Nope it doesn't pick up Ammonia the Dr Tim's bottle says ammonium on it IV tested many times and using different water and different levels of ammonia but my kit says 0 every time. I even tried adding a few drops of ammonia into 5ml of tank water in a vial and the kit literally wouldn't read it even as 0 it just stopped the chemical reaction all other times it's just pale green which is 0 but when I add a few drops to the test tube with just water in it stays clear doesnt even come up to 0

Then your kit is broken or your dr tims bottle is not really ammonia.

Ammonia (NH3) when dissolved in water acts as a weak base and forms the positively charged ion ammonium (NH4+). Ammonium is also commonly called the ionized form of ammonia. The amount of ammonia that is converted to ammonium depends on the pH of the water; the equilibrium will change and cause either ammonia or ammonium to be produced depending on the pH.

H2O + NH3 ⇌ OH– + NH4+

So when you put some drops of ammonia in water, a majority of it turns into ammonium which your test kit should be able to measure.

 

[Formulator]

I'm already on day 10 and way to high nitrite to add fish

Nitrite is not toxic. You need to measure ammonia to be sure of cycling. I suspect you are not using the test kit correctly or it is a bad kit. Measuring ammonium is still a valid way to measure ammonia indirectly as per my technical explanation above.

 

[Dburr1014]

I'm already on day 10 and way to high nitrite to add fish

Nitrite in our systems are non-toxic.
Maybe your thinking of freshwater systems?
Have you tested your nitrates?

 

[PotatoPig]

H2O + NH3 ⇌ OH– + NH4+

So when you put some drops of ammonia in water, a majority of it turns into ammonium which your test kit should be able to measure.

Adding to this:

The test kits that test in solution (ie you mix it all together) react with one side of the reaction (iirc the NH4) dropping it’s concentration to zero, which pulls some of the remaining NH3 over, which continues until all the ammonia is reacted. I’m not sure if it’s even possible to test only NH4 in this way because you have to somehow stop the NH3 converting to maintain equilibrium.

The seachem badge works differently as its another reversible reaction, but is so small that when it pulls NH4 it doesn’t pull enough to meaningfully alter the concentrations in the water

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi guys I'm currently cycling using Dr Tim's and ammonia but I seem to be stuck on nitrite levels... I can't test ammonia at the moment as my test kit doesn't pick up the bottled ammonia only organic waste ammonia so I have been cycling based from the nitrite readings I have added ammonia on day one and on day 3 as nitrite was below 1ppm I didn't dose again on the next dose day as nitrite was pretty much 1ppm so it said not to dose if nitrite or ammonia is above 1ppm. I'm on day 10 now and my nitrite hasn't dropped since about day 4 it's really hard to tell if it's 1ppm or 0.8ppm the colours are so similar and my chart doesn't go past 1ppm so could be even higher tbh. I'm using JBL test kit which was very expensive so I figured it would be good enough to cycle with. I'm not sure what to do now do I add more ammonia and see if nitrite drops or do I wait it out but could be waiting forever

Disregars nitrite levels which are more freshwater specific. If ammonia is at .025 or below and nitrate is max 20 or less- you are cycled

 

[bombilate]

I just tested again Ammonia is saying 0 but it said 0 on day one 2 hours after adding ammonia ammonia shows 0 every time I assume it's faulty kit. I just added 2drops to some tap water so it should be around 4ppm as it's 1 drop per litre and I used half a litre I then tested that and still 0 so the kit is not working. I assumed if I went based on nitrite instead of be able to cycle based on that as the instructions say if ammonia or nitrite is below 1ppm etc

 

[Dburr1014]

I just tested again Ammonia is saying 0 but it said 0 on day one 2 hours after adding ammonia ammonia shows 0 every time I assume it's faulty kit. I just added 2drops to some tap water so it should be around 4ppm as it's 1 drop per litre and I used half a litre I then tested that and still 0 so the kit is not working. I assumed if I went based on nitrite instead of be able to cycle based on that as the instructions say if ammonia or nitrite is below 1ppm etc

Test nitrAtes.
If you have some, it's all working correctly.

 

[bombilate]

This is my readings so far if it's any help

 

[PotatoPig]

Test nitrAtes.
If you have some, it's all working correctly.

Note to OP: If the test shows sky high nitrAtes don’t freak out, it could just be nitrites interfering with the test.

 

[bombilate]

Test nitrAtes.
If you have some, it's all working correctly.

I have nitrate but I thought it's false reading due to high nitrite

 

[bombilate]

Note to OP: If the test shows sky high nitrAtes don’t freak out, it could just be nitrites interfering with the test.

That said, it’s still hard to imagine it’s even possible for a tank with livestock and macro algae to not be cycled after being up this long.

I have no livestock it's been cycling about 10 days

 

[PotatoPig]

I have no livestock it's been cycling about 10 days

Sorry, I’m following two of these and got yours mixed up.

But the initial paragraph stands - from the numbers you post the 40ppm nitrate isn’t really possible because not enough ammonia has been added to cause it so you are getting some interference.

As others have said though - nitrite isn’t the same issue in reef tanks as it is in freshwater. If you have nitrites then your ammonia is being processed which of the critical part.