Is there special QT for Bellus Angels?

[Dburr1014]

My LFS store called and told me my 2 bellus angels are in.
They are about 2/2.25 inches.
He said they look well and swim together.

I have been doing a lot of research for QT on angels.
Some classify these as sensitive to copper and some not.
Some use metro with copper.
Now I'm confused, lol.

Hoping I can get some feed back on QT protocol for these 2 females.

@Jay Hemdal

 

[vetteguy53081]

My LFS store called and told me my 2 bellus angels are in.
They are about 2/2.25 inches.
He said they look well and swim together.

I have been doing a lot of research for QT on angels.
Some classify these as sensitive to copper and some not.
Some use metro with copper.
Now I'm confused, lol.

Hoping I can get some feed back on QT protocol for these 2 females.

@Jay Hemdal

They generally quarantine well and can be placed in coppersafe at treatment level 2.25 with added aeration with focus on water quality
I recommend Hanna brand copper test kit to monitor level

 

[Jay Hemdal]

My LFS store called and told me my 2 bellus angels are in.
They are about 2/2.25 inches.
He said they look well and swim together.

I have been doing a lot of research for QT on angels.
Some classify these as sensitive to copper and some not.
Some use metro with copper.
Now I'm confused, lol.

Hoping I can get some feed back on QT protocol for these 2 females.

@Jay Hemdal

The main thing is making sure the tank is large enough, and to understand that this species has an inherently high failure rate (apparently due to collection practices).
They handle coppersafe and praziquantel fine, I wouldn’t use ionic copper on them. I’d skip the metro.

 

[Dburr1014]

Perfect, thank you both.

They are small, 2~2.5". I have a 20 gallon tank. If that is too small I have another 15 gallon but they will be seperated.
I have an ammonia badge.
I am using coppersafe.
QT has been running for a month, I'm sure it's all set to go.
Airstone and a small powerhead is in also.

 

[Dburr1014]

I picked up my two Bellus today. They look very healthy.
They are already eating frozen food.
My lfs already had them in some copper so I transferred them to my QT and bumped up the copper a little more. Tomorrow I will make sure it's over 2.0 with copper safe. They are out and about swimming together.

 

[Dburr1014]

Day 5 and they eat 3 times a day.
Mostly out and about when I approach the QT. One I saw picking on the other, not bad, just a couple pecks and swam away.
These gals look so healthy.
Hard to get a decent Pic.

 

[Dburr1014]

@Jay Hemdal
@vetteguy53081
@MnFish1

An issue has come up.
I see spots on both angels. They are located on the dorsal and causal fins at the tips. They look to be raised slightly like a grain of sand, almost that color too.

One is still eating, the other looks like it didn't eat this morning or afternoon. I do not see any rapid breathing. One angel will sometimes chase the other but it's only for a second or two and then goes the other direction.

I first received them this past Thursday, and they are in quarantine.
I have done one water change and ammonia badge is still yellow. I think my copper went a little bit under 1.5ppm and I'm working on that to get it back up now.

Any ideas? First thing that came to my mind is flukes but I am definitely not versed in these things.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal
@vetteguy53081
@MnFish1

An issue has come up.
I see spots on both angels. They are located on the dorsal and causal fins at the tips. They look to be raised slightly like a grain of sand, almost that color too.

One is still eating, the other looks like it didn't eat this morning or afternoon. I do not see any rapid breathing. One angel will sometimes chase the other but it's only for a second or two and then goes the other direction.

I first received them this past Thursday, and they are in quarantine.
I have done one water change and ammonia badge is still yellow. I think my copper went a little bit under 1.5ppm and I'm working on that to get it back up now.

Any ideas? First thing that came to my mind is flukes but I am definitely not versed in these things.

That looks more like aggression - is the doing the chasing the one that is still eating? Aggression can be pretty subtle and will be greater when you are not in the room watching them.

There could be multiple issues though - coppersafe and copper power need to be above 2.0 to begin to work. The standard dose is 2.25 ppm

 

[Dburr1014]

That looks more like aggression - is the doing the chasing the one that is still eating? Aggression can be pretty subtle and will be greater when you are not in the room watching them.

There could be multiple issues though - coppersafe and copper power need to be above 2.0 to begin to work. The standard dose is 2.25 ppm

Yes, the chaser is still eating. They both have the same spots in about the same area. The spots were not there a few days ago.

Coppersafe is now at 2.0ppm

Here is a video of it helps.
Edit: At about 29 seconds you get a great shot of the fins.
I can make a partition for the tank.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Yes, the chaser is still eating. They both have the same spots in about the same area. The spots were not there a few days ago.

Coppersafe is now at 2.0ppm

Here is a video of it helps.
Edit: At about 29 seconds you get a great shot of the fins.
I can make a partition for the tank.

If the tank is large enough, I think dropping in a tank divider would be a good idea.

 

[Dburr1014]

@Jay Hemdal
The fish has been seperated with a divider since Thursday. Copper was up over 2ppm also.
She still wasn't eating.
Friday I made the call to switch to TTM. Saturday she started eating at every meal. She seemed to be a normal fish and healthy. Today was transfer day.

New clean tank, everything was cleaned, new water. Up to temp and sg matched. Switched them over with no problems but I saw this...



Not sure what this is, same fish. It's raised up slightly kinda red right near the tail. She still eats and is not breathing heavy.
I don't really have any meds but chemiclean, ivermectin, fenbendazole and I don't think they will work this this. I have a petco near me and my lfs closes at 7pm est and they are a ways from me.
Any ideas and what to use?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal
The fish has been seperated with a divider since Thursday. Copper was up over 2ppm also.
She still wasn't eating.
Friday I made the call to switch to TTM. Saturday she started eating at every meal. She seemed to be a normal fish and healthy. Today was transfer day.

New clean tank, everything was cleaned, new water. Up to temp and sg matched. Switched them over with no problems but I saw this...



Not sure what this is, same fish. It's raised up slightly kinda red right near the tail. She still eats and is not breathing heavy.
I don't really have any meds but chemiclean, ivermectin, fenbendazole and I don't think they will work this this. I have a petco near me and my lfs closes at 7pm est and they are a ways from me.
Any ideas and what to use?

The picture isn't super clear, but it could be either trauma from handling it during TTM, or it could be Uronema. Hopefully not uronema, as there is no effective treatment for that.

Uronema / Red Band Disease - Hemdal

Red Band Syndrome in Marine Fishes: Caused by the Protozoan; Uronema sp. Jay Hemdal Introduction: This moderately common disease of certain species of marine fish is so often misdiagnosed that most aquarists apply incorrect treatment methods...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Dburr1014]

The picture isn't super clear, but it could be either trauma from handling it during TTM, or it could be Uronema. Hopefully not uronema, as there is no effective treatment for that.

Uronema / Red Band Disease - Hemdal

Red Band Syndrome in Marine Fishes: Caused by the Protozoan; Uronema sp. Jay Hemdal Introduction: This moderately common disease of certain species of marine fish is so often misdiagnosed that most aquarists apply incorrect treatment methods...

www.reef2reef.com

Hmmm, not the best news.
I just got back from my lfs and picked up pimafix and melafix.
I'm guessing these won't work.
The article says it's not contagious. So if the other is fine should I remove him back to the other tank?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hmmm, not the best news.
I just got back from my lfs and picked up pimafix and melafix.
I'm guessing these won't work.
The article says it's not contagious. So if the other is fine should I remove him back to the other tank?

Pimafix and Melafix are more like tonics than actual medications, so they usually don't work well for aggressive infections.

If it is Uronema, it isn't super contagious, but fish of the same species, acquired at the same time would be the most likely to come down with it (or already be carrying it themselves). You see this when people buy a group of green chromis; frequently a number of them contract this disease at the same time.

 

[Dburr1014]

I went for a second opinion over at humble.fish.
They also think it's uronema.

Formalin or Chloroquine Phosphate are the options. And a third treatment but I'll get to that in a minute.

Formalin, I don't want to mess with that for obvious reasons. Besides, it will also burn the red sores and that is bad.

Chloroquine phosphate also is no good when the fish already has a red sore. It's to late.

The site mentions the third treatment, still being tested and repeated and tested again. The list is building of fish that have been saved. It may not work for me but it might. I have done 2 baths 48 hours apart so far.

She started Monday with a red, raised sore. After the first bath, the redness went away except what looked a knife cut down the center. The next day, no redness at all.
This was post first bath. Most redness is gone.


Today was second bath. I took a video and lifted the best picture I could get from it.
This looks more like peeling skin. Zero redness, looks like it's healing. To early to call I realize but I'm hoping for the best.


What is the treatment.
Melafix. API Freshwater melafix.
20ppm per gallon bath for minimum 5 minutes but 30 is best.
Followed up with antibiotics in the QT. All I had was chemiclean and I have a respiratory virus at the moment couldn't really go anywhere to get anything, so it had to do.

I can't believe this treatment has worked as well as it did, the fish are still eating and swimming around. I'm keeping their tanks pristine by feeding a little bit less just to make sure they eat when I feed them and try to eat it all. If there's any leftovers I'll pull it out. I've been cleaning their tanks and everything in it or touched the water with vinegar and letting it completely dry out, all with this respiratory virus. And I'll admit it's been hard and trying it times these past few days and we'll find out what the final ending will be in a week or two.

Does it look like it's healing to you too?

 

[LAReefer4Life]

It does look like its improving and good on you for making water quality the top priority. You should also soak their foods in selcon or vitamin supplement to help boost immune system.

 

[Dburr1014]

Day after 2nd melafix bath for uronema.
Symptoms first showed Monday the 20th. 1st bath Monday night.

 

[Dburr1014]

After 3 melafix baths and now dosing metroplex and erythromycin to the QT, things have greatly improved. Both eating fine with metroplex, selcon and HUFA mixed in the food. She might end up with some scaring but that's okay.