Giant porcupine puffer with trapped air!

[Jesse Gassaway]

Huge Porcupine puffer (around football size) showing signs of a broken swim bladder or something similar(I don't think he has one)! The bubble is very large maybe the size of my fist but he won't release it! if he floats upside down he just takes in air from the gil closest to the side the bubble tilts toward! I currently pinned him under some rock (gently) so he can't float to the surface but I can still see him breathing normal (I've been doing this since 3AM, its not 10AM no change)!

Anything that anybody can do including coming over to help would be insanely appreciated and compensated!

Here's what I've tried so far as well as solutions I've heard
-research told me I should hold him vertical and try to shake or "burp" the bubble out and if that doesn't work to try to tickle his belly till he fully puffs under water! Does anybody have an opinion on how to tick him off to puff without too much stress? Because right now he's letting me handle him completely as this bubble capsizes him at the surface even if he resists

-Another solution I've read that is seeming more and more like the only quick fix is to use a needle and large chambered syringe and to let it gather in a fleshy area and to manually draw the air out to fix it!
Anybody in the San Diego area have experience with this or could refer me to someone that can help ASAP?

-What do you guys think about using a small piper full of water and pushing water into his mouth to rid of the air bubble, obviously not my first choice?

-last off his body is showing lots of color change which I'm assuming is stress, but I've noticed his butt hole is also a little bit more relaxed and open than I would like, is it possible he's trying to pass something that's stuck? I tried to rule this out when I saw the bubble move throughout the entire body but I still assumed that there could be digestional issues as well!

Anybody that can help I would appreciate it times a million, I'm sorry I'm a new user posting such a serious topic, I was referred here from a user on my local forum that said you are all a very smart group! I will check this thread constantly this morning, feel free to text or call as well no matter who you are!

Cheers
-Jesse
(760)716-0994

 

[cowboy]

I've had my puffers do this before I simply burped him have never tried a syringe and needle and I would use the pipe to fill him with water. But what I will do is tag a couple people that might have more insight for you.
@Humblefish @melypr1985

 

[melypr1985]

I've never seen this before in a puffer but I think @Lionfish Lair would be a great resource. Here is a link to a video telling how to vent a swimbladder, but I'm not sure how much this will help you.
Venting a Swim Bladder: Black Cap Basslet

 

[Humblefish]

Puffers sometimes swallow air and it can take severals hours for the air to evacuate. You can "burp" him like @cowboy describes; but I prefer to put the puffer in a plastic "critter keeper" on the bottom of the tank. You may need to put a small rock or something on top of it to keep it weighted down.

Make sure the container is vented and a PH blowing through the vents helps with O2.

 

[Lionfish Lair]

Burping works pretty well. I've never burped a porc, but I've burped frogfish. I would definitely choose something other than pinning him under a rock. I get that it's gentle and porc skin is really resilient, but I wouldn't want to risk a scratch that could get infected. Especially not now where he must be experiencing some stress. I've put fish in critter keepers and it works awesome. I had one demersal fish that walked upside down inside the container while he was recovering... it was rather unsettling to see him scurrying around in there like that. Kind of like a scary movie O.O

I bet there are videos on youtube that show burping.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Huge Porcupine puffer (around football size) showing signs of a broken swim bladder or something similar(I don't think he has one)! The bubble is very large maybe the size of my fist but he won't release it! if he floats upside down he just takes in air from the gil closest to the side the bubble tilts toward! I currently pinned him under some rock (gently) so he can't float to the surface but I can still see him breathing normal (I've been doing this since 3AM, its not 10AM no change)!

Anything that anybody can do including coming over to help would be insanely appreciated and compensated!

Here's what I've tried so far as well as solutions I've heard
-research told me I should hold him vertical and try to shake or "burp" the bubble out and if that doesn't work to try to tickle his belly till he fully puffs under water! Does anybody have an opinion on how to **** him off to puff without too much stress? Because right now he's letting me handle him completely as this bubble capsizes him at the surface even if he resists

-Another solution I've read that is seeming more and more like the only quick fix is to use a needle and large chambered syringe and to let it gather in a fleshy area and to manually draw the air out to fix it!
Anybody in the San Diego area have experience with this or could refer me to someone that can help ASAP?

-What do you guys think about using a small piper full of water and pushing water into his mouth to rid of the air bubble, obviously not my first choice?

-last off his body is showing lots of color change which I'm assuming is stress, but I've noticed his butt hole is also a little bit more relaxed and open than I would like, is it possible he's trying to pass something that's stuck? I tried to rule this out when I saw the bubble move throughout the entire body but I still assumed that there could be digestional issues as well!

Anybody that can help I would appreciate it times a million, I'm sorry I'm a new user posting such a serious topic, I was referred here from a user on my local forum that said you are all a very smart group! I will check this thread constantly this morning, feel free to text or call as well no matter who you are!

Cheers
-Jesse
(760)716-0994

Im really glad you came over. Great folks here. Good luck.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Burping a puffer. Is this correct?

 

[Lionfish Lair]

Yup, it looks like that's what they're doing. I can't watch the video, but you basically hold them vertically and massage them upward. Don't use the tips of your fingers, but like the whole palm of your hand.

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

I've had my puffers do this before I simply burped him have never tried a syringe and needle and I would use the pipe to fill him with water. But what I will do is tag a couple people that might have more insight for you.
@Humblefish @melypr1985

Maybe you can help me with the situation if youve had to do it in the past! Was yours a porcupine puffer? and if so how big was it? Mine is so large that It really takes both hands to hold him verticle without the boyancy bringing him up. how did you massage it? and for how long? the longest session ive tried so far is 5 minutes and it didnt seem like anything changed excecpt for his stress (trying to move) did it just suddently release randomly when you burped them? or could you tell it was coming to the opening? hes so large that I cant really rub up on him toward the front or I catch his spines. and the pipe hasnt worked yet but its also a small pipette (actually an air blower for a camera cleaner set) maybe if I run a tube with good flowing water almost directly into his mouth? @Humblefish @melypr1985 any chance you can bring me a solution on this one? his breathing is still pretty normal but hes got that stressed look in his eyes and is very bloated. I also tried feeding him a soft mussel without shell and he did close his mouth around it before spitting it out so I know his energy is there somewhere! Thank you!

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

Yup, it looks like that's what they're doing. I can't watch the video, but you basically hold them vertically and massage them upward. Don't use the tips of your fingers, but like the whole palm of your hand.

Hey! I was just wondering if you had any sort of input on the time that it might take to massage it, and if its mouth is the only place it can expel water or if its gills are able to as well? if Ive done this multiple times and its done nothing should I give up and let him rest? is there anything I can put in the tank as well to help? or is there anything in the water that could be giving him some sort of paralysis? I have a sargeant major damsel with him thats his best friend and he seems fine!

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

Burping works pretty well. I've never burped a porc, but I've burped frogfish. I would definitely choose something other than pinning him under a rock. I get that it's gentle and porc skin is really resilient, but I wouldn't want to risk a scratch that could get infected. Especially not now where he must be experiencing some stress. I've put fish in critter keepers and it works awesome. I had one demersal fish that walked upside down inside the container while he was recovering... it was rather unsettling to see him scurrying around in there like that. Kind of like a scary movie O.O

I bet there are videos on youtube that show burping.

I could only find the one video posted in this thread on burping examples but hes so large that it seems like I need more hands or something to really massage it right, plus the quils make it difficult!

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

Burping a puffer. Is this correct?

Is this your video? did this end up helping at all?

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

Puffers sometimes swallow air and it can take severals hours for the air to evacuate. You can "burp" him like @cowboy describes; but I prefer to put the puffer in a plastic "critter keeper" on the bottom of the tank. You may need to put a small rock or something on top of it to keep it weighted down.

Make sure the container is vented and a PH blowing through the vents helps with O2.

Ahh I didnt see this reply please forgive me, Im at the point where patience seems like the only virtue, maybe having a syringe on site in case he looks like hes gonna die if I dont act fast? right now he seems like hes breathing decent, just insanely bloated. let me know if a picture would help!

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

I was told that adding this to a post can really help find support, if youre out there #ReefSquad any advice sooths my soul

 

[melypr1985]

I was told that adding this to a post can really help find support, if youre out there #ReefSquad any advice sooths my soul

I'm sorry, but I've never encountered this. The reefsquad might have some answers for you and I would certainly advise you to listen to @Lionfish Lair and @Humblefish on this one along with the others that have experience with this. I'll follow along and see what i can learn from this situation. I can honestly tell you that the best thing you can do is to stay calm. Panic will kill more often than anything else.

 

[Humblefish]

Ahh I didnt see this reply please forgive me, Im at the point where patience seems like the only virtue, maybe having a syringe on site in case he looks like hes gonna die if I dont act fast? right now he seems like hes breathing decent, just insanely bloated. let me know if a picture would help!

He just has a bunch of trapped air inside of him, I doubt he will die from that. The advantage of putting him in a critter keeper is he won't hurt himself while his body naturally expels the air.

 

[jsker]

Feed him some peas, and that will clean him out. Read this please link

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

I'm sorry, but I've never encountered this. The reefsquad might have some answers for you and I would certainly advise you to listen to @Lionfish Lair and @Humblefish on this one along with the others that have experience with this. I'll follow along and see what i can learn from this situation. I can honestly tell you that the best thing you can do is to stay calm. Panic will kill more often than anything else.

Yea Im starting to calm down and just let him relax again. Im going to give it some time. I think the only change i might make is holding him deeper under the water so the bubble wants to rise more! thank you so much for your help. Ill keep this updated

 

[Jesse Gassaway]

He just has a bunch of trapped air inside of him, I doubt he will die from that. The advantage of putting him in a critter keeper is he won't hurt himself while his body naturally expels the air.

yea Im going to give him a few hours before I try to touch him again. Is it possible that the bubble inside of him is from some sort of swim bladder or maybe even like a hernia or any other rupture inside the fish? Is there a way to manually open the release? Hes a mighty big fish that I might be able to work with. And Im going to make some sort of shelter that will keep him from the surface, do you think it matters if I have him flat or face up or anything? just while Im letting him rest?

 

[Humblefish]

yea Im going to give him a few hours before I try to touch him again. Is it possible that the bubble inside of him is from some sort of swim bladder or maybe even like a hernia or any other rupture inside the fish? Is there a way to manually open the release? Hes a mighty big fish that I might be able to work with. And Im going to make some sort of shelter that will keep him from the surface, do you think it matters if I have him flat or face up or anything? just while Im letting him rest?

Can you post a photo of him, showing his current condition?