Mindstream
- Thread starter Murica
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What doesn't sit well with me is that they charged customers the full $1,000 when orders were placed even though they didn't have a unit to ship to them. After 7 years of development, they must have known that readings were not stable and that they didn't have the ability to manufacture the product they were selling. I can't see any other reason for them to start selling the device, knowing it didn't work properly and having manufacturing issues, than to grab money to put in their pockets before shutting down the company. I don't see how anyone can defend their actions! I'm glad I cancelled my order and got a refund in early November.
JoshH
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From what I've read the overall system worked. Did it need some tweaking and adjusting, absolutely. But what system hasn't needed tweaking or fixing after a release? (Think, every Neptune product out there from the Apex 2016 forward, Triton's new milk cartons, Innovative Marines Nuvo 30L's, Red Sea 750xxls and so on). I think the $1000 upfront was a feeble attempt to add a new production line (but unfortunately I don't think even with all the preorders they could come remotely close to affording a larger production line). I am glad you managed to get a refund and that's awesome but to sling an accusation like fraud around here is speculative at best. Defend them, not SO much other than trying to look at it from another perspective, hope that the technology lives on under a new banner, absolutely...
Bleigh
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Not to mention the recently added tariffs on equipment like this. I’m assuming they’re having it made over seas.
JoshH
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Certainly could play a roll, but as I understand it the disks themselves were being produced (or atleast assembled) in the US which in and of itself is insanely expensive and scaling up production to meet demand would cost a fortune. I can't speak for the units themselves though..
Joe Rice
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The tricky (impossible?) thing to figure out from our perspective outside the company is to understand just how close they were to having a product that worked and could be sold for a profit. It's all the more difficult to understand because the 80/20 rules applies here - the last 20% of the product development requires 80% of the work. A product that appears largely done may, in fact, be so or it may be that we're just not privy to the hard problems that remain to be solved.
For instance, imagine that they had it all working except that it was costing $50 to produce a disk they were selling for $40. It wouldn't be crazy to launch and take the loss for a while and hope you could figure out a way to produce the disks for much less. But that could turn out to be a very hard problem and yet, to us outsiders it might seem like the product was basically working. Just an example - I'm not in any way speculating that this was the case.
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Daniel@R2R
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I am really hoping someone will pick this up and run with it. My unit has been very consistent, and I'm still happy with it. I hate that the countdown is on for only a few more days of monitoring. 
I'd love to see this tech continue to be utilized.
I'd love to see this tech continue to be utilized.JoshH
Tank Status: Wet...ish, growing things....
I am really hoping someone will pick this up and run with it. My unit has been very consistent, and I'm still happy with it. I hate that the countdown is on for only a few more days of monitoring.
Daniel make sure you let Coralvue know your thoughts
This is what I was getting at, are there going to be some faults in any release? Definitely, but there are units out there running as intended so there has to be some merit to the technology.
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adamsfour
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Just found this.
Step Ahead Innovation Shuts its Doors, MindStream Future Uncertain | Reef Builders | The Reef and Saltwater Aquarium Blog
When the MindStream aquarium water monitor was first announced by its creator, Step Ahead Innovations, the device seemed so ahead of its time that it almost came off like a futuristic concept product.
reefbuilders.com
Brian and Mindstream and what was Step Ahead finally are emailing customers. Not good news but at least they are talking again. Again hoping that they sell those patents and that Seneye takes this and runs with it.
Torx
Active Member
Just got the same email full of lies from the get go. They had working units and have been beta testing since 2013.
I am never happy to see a company go under but we all saw this coming. now customers are left with useless units, refunds won't be given...
I am never happy to see a company go under but we all saw this coming. now customers are left with useless units, refunds won't be given...
JoshH
Tank Status: Wet...ish, growing things....
Brian and Mindstream and what was Step Ahead finally are emailing customers. Not good news but at least they are talking again. Again hoping that they sell those patents and that Seneye takes this and runs with it.
It certainly looks like they are already talking with someone, which is probably why they haven't been talking much lately (And I only mean in the last week or two not prior to that). Promising information atleast!!
JoshH
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I think refunds or some kind of compensation will HAVE to be given out for this technology to continue on which it seems like it might... We will see what the future brings for Mindstream and whomever picks it up.
adamsfour
Active Member
I for one have some issues with the announcement. 1) It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know no money coming in means no money going out. 2) They clearly knew way before they stop taking orders that the titanic was sinking. 3) based on the limited reviews there were a number of issues so it wasn’t all roses. 4) the comment about starting a new company is a bit concerning as it historically a scheme for avoiding dealt from old company as old customer have no claim against the new company. I am glad they have surfaced. Time will tell if it’s all total BS.
JoshH
Tank Status: Wet...ish, growing things....
I can only speak for the last comment in that they aren't starting a new company, they are getting an established company to take over the product itself. I don't think that strategy would work in this case atall as every consumer out there would know it's either a reimagining Mindstream or the exact same one being released and it would never get off the ground if previous customers weren't satisfied in some way...
Joe Rice
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Excellent response - thansk for postingBrian and Mindstream and what was Step Ahead finally are emailing customers. Not good news but at least they are talking again. Again hoping that they sell those patents and that Seneye takes this and runs with it.
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I would ask you to document this. I would suggest that anyone that bought a unit with a subscription - that wasn't able too get a refund from their credit company - either has a bad credit card company - or didn't ask. But - If you have more information - I'm hoping your will post it. When you said 'refunds won't be given' you really have no firsthand knowledge right>?
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