Ok folks...opinions requested on initial livestock stocking order

[Sagecritter4life]

As a newbie to salt I am so tired of arguing with myself on where to start next that the mirror broke lol...I have any empty DT+sump cycled been up 30 days that I'm ghost feeding a little every few days for bacteria maintenance and feel pretty good about that so far...possibly over analyzing situation.

Have my separate two QT's (1 coral/1 fish) with nothing in them yet except all the equipment needed for startup thanks to humble, melpyr and others suggestions.

One quandary comes in with CUC.....would you just put the cleaning crew in DT right off as it is fishless and bypass QT tank? Or do they carry other pests/eggs besides ich that I should be keeping out of DT and kept in fish less QT for observation also.

Corals will be 76 days in QT and fish same timeframe in their own QT once I get brave enough to purchase them..chuckle..so in theory any ICH potential from CUC being directly put in tank would have ran its course......right...??

Or do I have the order all newbied up...lol and if so your opinions/experiences on order of advancement.

Thoughts and wisdom by those more experienced greatly appreciated...chuckle trying to start slow and pest free as possible but even though correct its a pain in rear lol and causing mental over temp ;-) and cloudiness in my mind...grr

 

[Smo]

You could add a small number of CUC to your DT now but it would have to run fallow for 76 days prior to adding fish. However, you could begin prophylactic treatment of initial fish during this time in a QT greater than 10 ft away. Then add the fish after the fallow period. Be really careful to avoid cross-contamination between DT and QT(s).

 

[eatbreakfast]

Agreed. As long as the system is fishless for 76+ days after cuc is added the risk will pass.

 

[mcarroll]

It's worth remembering that the risk is actually with your fish being immunocompromised. They're built to be around parasites and other pathogens when they are kept healthy.

Keeping your fish healthy is a big question at the beginning when you and the fish are both new, so I'm not saying do anything different than planned. QT them and feed live foods as much as you can to get them healthy and built-up for introduction to the display!!!

But...

Many folks underestimate the amount of stress they place on their fish in QT and in the display. (See below on "Resistance".)

Many folks also underestimate the food requirements most fish have (live foods, near-live frozen foods, probiotics, etc).

Once you're past the 76 days.....it's all on you and your fish's immune systems to keep them healthy.

Mainly, keeping them healthy is done by way of stress management and nutrition.

If they aren't kept healthy on an ongoing basis, then 76 days is no guarantee of anything. In reality, 76 days is only an estimate anyway, and only against one common pathogen. You fish can be carriers of a number of other microorganisms, some of which don't care about 76 days. Like velvet.

So you and your fish had better be prepared!!

This is a great read for when you're reviewing your tank's stress and nutrition levels:
Circular 919/FA005: Stress - Its Role in Fish Disease

The opening "checklist" from that doc....be sure to read the other two thirds! :

What Causes Stress?
Stress is a condition in which an animal is unable to maintain a normal physiologic state because of various factors adversely affecting its well-being.

Stress is caused by placing a fish in a situation that is beyond its normal level of tolerance. Specific examples of things that can cause stress (stressors) are listed below.

Chemical Stressors

1. Poor Water Quality - low dissolved oxygen, improper pH
   
2. Pollution - intentional pollution: chemical treatments - accidental pollution: insect spray, spills
   
3. Diet composition - type of protein, amino acids (ed: add fats on here!)
   
4. Nitrogenous and other metabolic wastes - accumulation of ammonia or nitrite
   

Biological Stressors

1. Population density - crowding
   
2. Other species of fish - aggression, territoriality, lateral swimming space requirements
   
3. Microorganisms - pathogenic and nonpathogenic
   
4. Macroorganisms - internal and external parasites
   

Physical Stressors

1. Temperature: This is one of the most important influences on the immune system of fish.
   
2. Light
   
3. Sounds
   
4. Dissolved Gases
   

Procedural Stressors

1. Handling
   
2. Shipping
   
3. Disease Treatments
   

Alarm Reaction ("Fight or Flight" Response)

1. Increases in blood sugar are caused by a secretion of hormones from the adrenal gland. Stored sugars, such as glycogen in the liver are metabolized. This creates an energy reserve that prepares the animal for an emergency action.
   
2. Osmoregulation is disrupted because of changes in mineral metabolism. Under these circumstances, a freshwater fish tends to absorb excess water from the environment (over-hydrate). A saltwater fish will tend to lose too much water to the environment (dehydrate). This disruption requires that extra energy be used to maintain osmoregulation.
   
3. Respiration increases, blood pressure increases, and reserve red blood cells are released into the circulation.
   
4. The inflammatory response is suppressed by hormones released from the adrenal gland.
   

Resistance
An animal is able to adapt to stress for a finite period of time. During this period the animal may look and act normal, but is depleting energy reserves because of the extra requirements placed upon it.

Exhaustion
The animal's reserves have been depleted and adaptation fails because the stress was too severe or lasted too long.

 

[mcarroll]

I would also recommend going more-slowly than you see most folks go and compared to what you seem to have planned so far.

I would start very small and very slow so you have time to learn and make mistakes without a tank full of livestock on the line.

Start with the CUC.

After a month or so, add a fish or two.

After another month, add a coral or two.

Learning the ins and outs of fish and coral care ought to be enough to keep you busy for the remaining 10 months of the year. I would try hard not to add much if any new livestock until year 2.

(That only sounds crazy cuz everyone else sets up their tanks way way way too fast.....you have much higher odds of success AND not having a catastrophic failure the slow way.)

(This might be a fun read: Is "Going Slow" The Most Controversial Reefing Topic?)