Prazi resistant flukes experience thread

[Pbh-reef]

Watch for secondary bacterial infection which is not uncommon after fluke treatment.

Glad to hear its going well

Hmmm what would be signs of that other than red marks? In the absense of Red makes If the wrasse still won’t eat anything besides live pods should I dose furan 2 + kanaplex? Or should I only treat for bacteria if the wrasse stops eating all together? @Humblefish would love your opinion on this too

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

I dont think it is unusual for a possum wrasse to be a tough keeper. I've had a Tanaka and a yellow band. Both ate a little frozen, but relied heavily upon pods to survive. You could hatch bbs if you need an easier and cheaper substitute for copepods.

Red spots white patches etc could be signs of a bacterial infection

 

[Pbh-reef]

I dont think it is unusual for a possum wrasse to be a tough keeper. I've had a Tanaka and a yellow band. Both ate a little frozen, but relied heavily upon pods to survive. You could hatch bbs if you need an easier and cheaper substitute for copepods.

Red spots white patches etc could be signs of a bacterial infection

Huh what is odd is it ate frozen brine at the LFS and the first few days in my qt. As time has progressed and it went through copper and then GC it has become a pickier water - now it won’t even eat live black worms. Maybe a new tank with 0 meds in the water and the fenbendazole will help

 

[TheRealDmorty217]

I have used clout that is made by fritz but recently discontinued and I have also tripled the recommended dosage of praziquantel for treatments every 5-6 days for 4 weeks with success, never doing a water change in between treatments for whatever that’s worth.

 

[Pbh-reef]

I have used clout that is made by fritz but recently discontinued and I have also tripled the recommended dosage of praziquantel for treatments every 5-6 days for 4 weeks with success, never doing a water change in between treatments for whatever that’s worth.

Yes I saw your post in another thread about using clout, thanks for sharing it here. It is a shame it was discontinued.

 

[Pbh-reef]

Update on the wrasse: still only eating live pods. I hope things turn around soon because I fear she’s losing weight and it’s hard to feed enough pods.

@GoldeneyeRet - how long after treatment before the fish started eating and acting normal?

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

Mine all looked good right away. Maybe you could try to hatch some baby brine shrimp as a replacement for pods.

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

Is it in unmedicated water now? No ammonia? Any signs of flukes or infection? Plenty of aeration? Is it swimming around hunting?

Sometimes a rally bath will help after flukes.

 

[Tamberav]

I have battled FW Prazi-resistant gill flukes that could live without hosts for at least a year (I know because I collected some into a 5ml test tube for that duration). The only thing that worked was Cupramine. Prazi resistant monogeans are the reason why I quarantine everything now.

Never tried Formalin though.

They were some species of Gyrodactylus. These things were absolutely evil

I had these or something like them and found I could kill them with prazi at 3x the recommended dose (or maybe it was 4x, was awhile ago). I tried the fallow period which DID NOT WORK. I had to nuke the DT/tear it down.

My fish BARFED with prazi that high of a dose although they survived, the ones that didn't live were already on their way out from huge fluke infestation. I didn't know fish could projectile vomit. I didn't have anything particularly sensitive though like wrasse or anthias. I didn't find FW dip particularly effective, maybe if I had dipped longer.

The fish were absolutely covered in flukes head to toe, it was kind of crazy. It was a high nutrient heavy fed tank so not sure if they could live of debris or just outlast typical fallow periods.

 

[Hermie]

Update on the wrasse: still only eating live pods. I hope things turn around soon because I fear she’s losing weight and it’s hard to feed enough pods.

@GoldeneyeRet - how long after treatment before the fish started eating and acting normal?

Are you sure that you are dealing with Flukes? I don't mean to come across as rude, I just mean I couldn't see how you diagnosed that in the thread (pics/microscope etc).

Just to add, the thing about (gill) flukes, is that by damaging a fish' gills they are effectively damaging the fish's circulatory system. So even after the flukes are killed, their gills are still inflamed/fighting secondary infections etc, so it will take a while for the gills to heal. This is just to say that I would not expect a gill fluke infested fish to have a ton of energy immediately after treatment. And in that sense, it's hard to see behaviorally, in the near term, that a gill-fluke infested fish was succesfully treated. I don't mean to steer the thread towards one diagnosis, just add some info.

 

[Pbh-reef]

Is it in unmedicated water now? No ammonia? Any signs of flukes or infection? Plenty of aeration? Is it swimming around hunting?

Sometimes a rally bath will help after flukes.

Yes the water's unmedicated and no sign of ammonia on the badge and aeration should be good and it is swimming around and hunting. The wrasse refuses to eat anything except pods that are on the back wall/glass, it basically has stopped eating from the water column. I may try to get brine shrimp from an LFS but I worry that the water the shrimp is sold in could be cross-contaminated which is the last thing I want after almost 2 months of QT, obviously buying a shrimp breeding dish is an option. My tiny apartment has basically become a small public aquarium/fish hospital at this point.;Dead

Are you sure that you are dealing with Flukes? I don't mean to come across as rude, I just mean I couldn't see how you diagnosed that in the thread (pics/microscope etc).

Just to add, the thing about (gill) flukes, is that by damaging a fish' gills they are effectively damaging the fish's circulatory system. So even after the flukes are killed, their gills are still inflamed/fighting secondary infections etc, so it will take a while for the gills to heal. This is just to say that I would not expect a gill fluke infested fish to have a ton of energy immediately after treatment. And in that sense, it's hard to see behaviorally, in the near term, that a gill-fluke infested fish was succesfully treated. I don't mean to steer the thread towards one diagnosis, just add some info.

Not rude at all @NotASpammerDude - I am pretty sure it is flukes (did a FW dip and some came off in December, saw head shaking and gills spasms as well. I haven't seen those behaviors since doing the febendazole bath. But that makes sense that the fish wouldn't be at 100% right away. I also suspect but can't confirm internal parasites because I've not seen the wrasse poop for a long time. Maybe I will try the ruby reef rally bath that @GoldeneyeRet (and it seems @Humblefish) suggest. And I get not wanting this thread to be about 1 fish, I guess my hope is that the thread will be a place where people can get help treating praziquantel resistant flukes and also serve as a collection of anecdotes that the disease treatment experts can use to develop QT practices. I'm starting to wonder if the next time I buy fish I may start with a 12 hour febendazole bath as my first treatment to knock flukes out and then transfer to copper, although I'd want people with more experience to offer feedback on that! I guess my ultimate hope is that some of the info in the thread helps develop and disseminate a new best practice for flukes in general and praziquantel resistant ones in particular

Finally, I so wish this QTing was easier and that the flukes had been wiped with GC. Its hard to have a difficult case the very first time I QT.

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

Just get some brine shrimp eggs and hatch them in a soda bottle. Easy as can be.

 

[Pbh-reef]

Just get some brine shrimp eggs and hatch them in a soda bottle. Easy as can be.

Is it literally soda bottle with salt water and shrimp eggs? No need for aeration?

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

I use an air pump, but I dont hatch them often so im no expert.

Search r2r , I know there are some simple instructions on here somewhere.

 

[ckalupa]

For purchased brine shrimp- I would not add the shrimp water when you buy them. Get a “brine shrimp net” and scoop them (“pour” into net and rinse with rodi before adding to the fish tank.

Or your own hatch works.

 

[Pbh-reef]

For purchased brine shrimp- I would not add the shrimp water when you buy them. Get a “brine shrimp net” and scoop them (“pour” into net and rinse with rodi before adding to the fish tank.

Or your own hatch works.

Thanks! How did your fenbendazole treatment go?

 

[ckalupa]

I did not yet begin that. I did a second dose cycle on the general cure for now and are completing a copper power preventative treatment. Will assess again as the next week goes as the copper cycle winds down? They all stopped showing symptoms of flukes so maybe that second treatment worked? i lowered salinity to 1.020 along with this GC treatment though. Possibly something that helped attack the flukes? I did it within the copper cycle with no issues (lots of air and agitation though and check daily with Hanna).

The male swallowtail angel’s eye cleared up (separate post) completely. Metro component likely did that trick.

 

[ckalupa]

I will say I am starting to feel like a pharmacist with All the different meds I have on hand these days! But with $1500 in fish sitting in there I am not taking chances!

 

[ckalupa]

Also worth noting my Gem tang had a small single white spot on his rear side quarter that never seemed to drop off- and that just disappeared suddenly this GC cycle also. Feeding them all focus with GC too.

 

[Pbh-reef]

I will say I am starting to feel like a pharmacist with All the different meds I have on hand these days! But with $1500 in fish sitting in there I am not taking chances!

Haha I mean I have a 10 gallon reef and 2 inexpensive fish and I also feel like a pharmacist.