Randy Recommended DIY Two Part Recipes

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

There are a whole lot of different DIY recipes around now, and I thought I lay out the differences and my recommendations.

In all cases, food grade, USP (pharma) grade, or Analytical Reagent/ACS grades are all good choices for materials. Lower or ungraded materials may be fine, but its more of a risk.

The best three, IMO, are:

A. Baking soda for alk part, calcium chloride for calcium part, and Balling Part 3 to balance all other ions. This is a low pH recipe. it is my DIY #2 with a changed part 3.
B. Baked baking soda (washing soda, sodium carbonate) for alk part, calcium chloride for calcium part, and Balling Part 3 to balance all other ions. This is a high pH two party, and can be twice as potent as A. It is my DIY #1 with a changed part 3.
C. Sodium hydroxide for alk part, calcium chloride for calcium part, and Balling Part 3 to balance all other ions. This is the highest pH alk part possible, and can be made higher in potency than the others (if required).

Next step down in desirability, but also in cost:

D. Baking soda for alk part, calcium chloride for calcium part, and my DIY Part 3 to balance magnesium/sulfate/chloride. This is a low pH recipe. Tt is my full DIY #2.
E. Baked baking soda (washing soda, sodium carbonate) for alk part, calcium chloride for calcium part, and my DIY Part 3 to balance magnesium/sulfate/chloride. This is a high pH two party, and can be twice as potent as A. It is my full DIY #1.
F. Sodium hydroxide for alk part, calcium chloride for calcium part, and my DIY Part 3 to balance magnesium/sulfate/chloride.. This is the highest pH alk part possible, and can be made higher in potency than the others (if required).

 

[homer1475]

Question on your DIY 2 parts......

I have always used your DIY 2 part for recipe 2(baking soda, and calcium chloride). I do weekly WC's with regular purple box IO. My mag levels are always relatively normal/high. Should I still be dosing a part 3 regardless of MAG levels for ionic balance even though MAG levels are always well within normal ranges?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Question on your DIY 2 parts......

I have always used your DIY 2 part for recipe 2(baking soda, and calcium chloride). I do weekly WC's with regular purple box IO. My mag levels are always relatively normal/high. Should I still be dosing a part 3 regardless of MAG levels for ionic balance even though MAG levels are always well within normal ranges?

Significant water changes go a long way to reducing concerns about ionic balance coming from use of sodium carbonate and calcium chloride. Decades ago, Craig Bingman modeled that here:

Aquarium Frontiers Biochemistry of Aquaria

"Minor water exchanges (2 to 5 percent) can be an appreciable help in cases where calcification is slow. Cases where small water exchanges are done take longer to achieve steady-state values than when larger water exchanges are made. For the 2- and 5-percent monthly cases, the values have not yet reached steady-state values even after 60 partial water exchanges (monthly for five years.) At the highest calcification rates, large monthly water exchanges (on the order of 20 percent or more monthly) are required to prevent large deviations from natural seawater ionic ratios."

 

[MexiReefer]

Hi @Randy Holmes-Farley ,

I just cannot figureout by myself how much of balling part C should I add when using your recipe (A). Is it based on the amount of Part #1 added, or is it based on the amount of salt water I remove from my tank to keep salinity stable? I know that both are related, morte alk and Calcium Chloride, more salt into the tank and more dilution I should add (i.e. more saltawater I should remove), but this is as far as I have been able to go.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hi @Randy Holmes-Farley ,

I just cannot figureout by myself how much of balling part C should I add when using your recipe (A). Is it based on the amount of Part #1 added, or is it based on the amount of salt water I remove from my tank to keep salinity stable? I know that both are related, morte alk and Calcium Chloride, more salt into the tank and more dilution I should add (i.e. more saltawater I should remove), but this is as far as I have been able to go.

Base it on the amount of alk added. That's not better than basing it on the amount of calcium added, but you cannot do both.

Are you sure you are using Recipe in A above, which is my recipe #2 (unbaked baking soda), rather than the sodium carbonate/soda ash version?

If based on my DIY #2, then you dose the Part C at the same rate that TM uses it in their balling recipe since my DIY and Balling Parts A and B from TM are close in potency.

Balling Zwischenseite | Produktinformationen

www.tropic-marin-smartinfo.com

"Separately add equal amounts of all three solutions successively to the tank water daily "

 

[MickeyCT]

Piggybacking on this with a similar question. If using your soda ash DIY version (recipe #1, or B above) how much Balling Part 3 to start with? Would it be half the amount of alk being added since the alk is twice as potent?

I'm actually getting ready to switch to the higher pH version with sodium hydroxide but I assume the starting amount for part 3 would be the same regardless of using B or C above. Currently using Kalkwasser at 4-5 liters per day but just can't get pH up over 8.0.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Piggybacking on this with a similar question. If using your soda ash DIY version (recipe #1, or B above) how much Balling Part 3 to start with? Would it be half the amount of alk being added since the alk is twice as potent?

I'm actually getting ready to switch to the higher pH version with sodium hydroxide but I assume the starting amount for part 3 would be the same regardless of using B or C above. Currently using Kalkwasser at 4-5 liters per day but just can't get pH up over 8.0.

Twice as much as the alk part. Same for the hydroxide version.

 

[MexiReefer]

Thanks a lot Randy

 

[MexiReefer]

Base it on the amount of alk added. That's not better than basing it on the amount of calcium added, but you cannot do both.

Are you sure you are using Recipe in A above, which is my recipe #2 (unbaked baking soda), rather than the sodium carbonate/soda ash version?

If based on my DIY #2, then you dose the Part C at the same rate that TM uses it in their balling recipe since my DIY and Balling Parts A and B from TM are close in potency.

Balling Zwischenseite | Produktinformationen

www.tropic-marin-smartinfo.com

"Separately add equal amounts of all three solutions successively to the tank water daily "

Sure, I am using un baked baking soda

 

[serwobow]

Hi @Randy Holmes-Farley ,
thanks for this incredible archive of useful work. I have a general question about these alkalinity solutions:

if exposed to air for a long time (months), wont they all eventually become the same pH after they achieve equilibrium with the CO2 in the atmosphere? And doesn't this mean that they have the same effect on tank pH, since they will all essentially become sodium carbonate solutions of the same pH?

I am wondering this because most people have their solutions open to air exchange for long periods of time because they are hooked up to dosing pumps. There are some additional precautions necessary when using the sodium hydroxide version, so it seems like it's only worth it if the pH boosting nature of it is stable over time. I realize you probably answered this at some point in the past, so sorry for that. Thanks.

 

[Outlaw Corals]

Question on your DIY 2 parts......

I have always used your DIY 2 part for recipe 2(baking soda, and calcium chloride). I do weekly WC's with regular purple box IO. My mag levels are always relatively normal/high. Should I still be dosing a part 3 regardless of MAG levels for ionic balance even though MAG levels are always well within normal ranges?

What do you consider high ? I like to keep my magnesium at 1500, at 1500 it’s great for growth especially if you have torches they love it at 1500

 

[DanyL]

Hi @Randy Holmes-Farley ,
thanks for this incredible archive of useful work. I have a general question about these alkalinity solutions:

if exposed to air for a long time (months), wont they all eventually become the same pH after they achieve equilibrium with the CO2 in the atmosphere? And doesn't this mean that they have the same effect on tank pH, since they will all essentially become sodium carbonate solutions of the same pH?

I am wondering this because most people have their solutions open to air exchange for long periods of time because they are hooked up to dosing pumps. There are some additional precautions necessary when using the sodium hydroxide version, so it seems like it's only worth it if the pH boosting nature of it is stable over time. I realize you probably answered this at some point in the past, so sorry for that. Thanks.

If you make a solution of Sodium Carbonate which is concentrated beyond the solubility of Sodium Bicarbonate, I believe that for it to become Sodium Bicarbonate once again it’ll need to either become a super saturated solution or fall out of solution.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I agree that they will slowly equilibrate, but I am not sure how fast that happens, or where exactly the final equivalence point is. i agree with the solubility issue Dany mentions.

 

[serwobow]

If you make a solution of Sodium Carbonate which is concentrated beyond the solubility of Sodium Bicarbonate, I believe that for it to become Sodium Bicarbonate once again it’ll need to either become a super saturated solution or fall out of solution.

I did not think of this. Thanks. I guess this means that a sodium carbonate solution will actually be pretty stable even with exposure to air.

 

[Armt350]

Is this an improvement over your "improved DIY two part" recipe #2? My system generally sits around PH 8.4

I'm currently dosing:
ALK: Sodium Bicarbonate (baking soda) solution (78g/Liter RODI)
Calc: Calcium Chloride Dihydrate (66g/liter RODI)
the 3A recipe of Epsom Salt/Magnesium chloride

If I understand this right, I would be cutting out the 3A and replacing it with Balling part C?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Is this an improvement over your "improved DIY two part" recipe #2? My system generally sits around PH 8.4

I'm currently dosing:
ALK: Sodium Bicarbonate (baking soda) solution (78g/Liter RODI)
Calc: Calcium Chloride Dihydrate (66g/liter RODI)
the 3A recipe of Epsom Salt/Magnesium chloride

If I understand this right, I would be cutting out the 3A and replacing it with Balling part C?

Yes, replacing my part 3A with balling Part C is an improvement, and I would recommend it, but a drawback is that it no longer supplements magnesium against consumption by corals.

Perhaps I will come up with a hybrid where some magnesium is added to the balling part C or the calcium part, but for now just realize magnesium may dip a bit over the long term.

 

[Armt350]

Yes, replacing my part 3A with balling Part C is an improvement, and I would recommend it, but a drawback is that it no longer supplements magnesium against consumption by corals.

Perhaps I will come up with a hybrid where some magnesium is added to the balling part C or the calcium part, but for now just realize magnesium may dip a bit over the long term.

So seeing that, I may add Epsom salts to the calcium chloride Dihydrate.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So seeing that, I may add Epsom salts to the calcium chloride Dihydrate.

No, that will precipitate calcium sulfate. Magnesium chloride could, however, and is better ionically balanced anyway in this scenario.

 

[Armt350]

No, that will precipitate calcium sulfate. Magnesium chloride could, however, and is better ionically balanced anyway in this scenario.

Ah ok, I was taking your statement of ...
"There will likely be a precipitate that forms even if you fully dissolve both ingredients separately. That precipitate is calcium sulfate (calcium as an impurity in the magnesium chloride and sulfate from the Epsom salts). It is fine and appropriate to dose the precipitate along with the remainder of the fluid by shaking it up before dosing."

To mean I shouldn't be concerned with that specific precipitate and it could be dosed. Magnesium chloride will be used then.

Any issue with using Magnesium Chloride hexahydrate(MgCl2 6H2O)?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Ah ok, I was taking your statement of ...
"There will likely be a precipitate that forms even if you fully dissolve both ingredients separately. That precipitate is calcium sulfate (calcium as an impurity in the magnesium chloride and sulfate from the Epsom salts). It is fine and appropriate to dose the precipitate along with the remainder of the fluid by shaking it up before dosing."

To mean I shouldn't be concerned with that specific precipitate and it could be dosed. Magnesium chloride will be used then.

Any issue with using Magnesium Chloride hexahydrate(MgCl2 6H2O)?

A small amount from impurities is fine, but you’ll make a huge amount of mud adding Epsom salt to calcium chloride (try it on a small scale).