Yellow Butterfly Pyramid disease ID - strange dark markings/spots across whole body taking turn for worse

[jibson]

Hi Guys,

So got my first pyramid butterflyfish the other day and sadly he arrived in very bad condition. He wasn't swimming upright and had lots of strange markings on him. He also had some of the flesh of the mouth slightly rotting.

I put him in my quarantine tank (which has very clean water, no ammonia, well cycled etc, with no medication in).

A day or so later I woke up to find him dead with so many more of these spots, wondering what it could be

As the store I purchased the fish from was aware it was shipped in bad condition, they sent me another one. This new one has come in better condition but have just started noticing these brown markings (obviously less now) and a few slightly larger white bumps on the main body.

See below for the pyramid that didn't make it with all the dark spots and let me know what you think it is/treatment (I'm in UK so anything I can get here would be amazing) for the pyramid I got replaced, as I don't want to see him suffer the same fate as the other one!

I'm thinking maybe flukes? Apparently eggs are quite common.

Thanks very much:

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi Guys,

So got my first pyramid butterflyfish the other day and sadly he arrived in very bad condition. He wasn't swimming upright and had lots of strange markings on him. He also had some of the flesh of the mouth slightly rotting.

I put him in my quarantine tank (which has very clean water, no ammonia, well cycled etc, with no medication in).

A day or so later I woke up to find him dead with so many more of these spots, wondering what it could be

As the store I purchased the fish from was aware it was shipped in bad condition, they sent me another one. This new one has come in better condition but have just started noticing these brown markings (obviously less now) and a few slightly larger white bumps on the main body.

See below for the pyramid that didn't make it with all the dark spots and let me know what you think it is/treatment (I'm in UK so anything I can get here would be amazing) for the pyramid I got replaced, as I don't want to see him suffer the same fate as the other one!

I'm thinking maybe flukes? Apparently eggs are quite common.

Thanks very much:

A microscope would have come in handy with dead one
How are you acclimating fish and for how long?
Offer low light for a few hours and I assume fish is in quarantine?
If so, are you treating with anything?
What is tank ammonia and nitrate level?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

This species almost always comes in with Neobenedenia flukes. They also arrive with mouth damage pretty often (and that keeps them from feeding well).

Normally, you cannot see Neobenedenia on a fish (except on the eyes) but when a fish dies with them, they also die, and that might be what you are seeing in the photo.

Half salinity (1.12 sg or 16 ppt salinity) for 35 days works well for these flukes.

Jay

 

[jibson]

A microscope would have come in handy with dead one
How are you acclimating fish and for how long?
Offer low light for a few hours and I assume fish is in quarantine?
If so, are you treating with anything?
What is tank ammonia and nitrate level?

Thanks for the quick reply, wish I did have one

When I received the fish I acclimated to the fish for no longer than around 20 minutes as the water salinity matched my tank, with normal drip (obviously 30 min heat acclimiation as well) and then put him in the clean tank where he is alone. I left him in the dark (large towel over the tank) for rest of day and today slowly turned up lights). I'm currently not keeping lights on for many hours to keep him low stress

Not currently treating with anything, was wondering what you may suggest in this situation - what do you think of lowering salinity or flubendazole?


You are correct in thinking this is a quarantine tank.


As for the params, 0 ammonia measured by hannah pocket checker + alert badge just incase, nitrate is 1


Thanks so much again for your help, your opinion is greatly appreciated

 

[jibson]

This species almost always comes in with Neobenedenia flukes. They also arrive with mouth damage pretty often (and that keeps them from feeding well).

Normally, you cannot see Neobenedenia on a fish (except on the eyes) but when a fish dies with them, they also die, and that might be what you are seeing in the photo.

Half salinity (1.12 sg or 16 ppt salinity) for 35 days works well for these flukes.

Jay

Hi @Jay Hemdal , thanks so much for the quick reply

I will try this method slowly tomorrow, but I do also have some spare flubendazole - do you think this would be less stressful or more dangerous to try with this sort of strain of flukes? Or shall I just stick with half salinity

Thanks again very much

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi @Jay Hemdal , thanks so much for the quick reply

I will try this method slowly tomorrow, but I do also have some spare flubendazole - do you think this would be less stressful or more dangerous to try with this sort of strain of flukes? Or shall I just stick with half salinity

Thanks again very much

You could attempt its use as it does address gill flukes as well as nematodes and SOME protozoan infestations. It's absorbed by fish making it effective for internal issues mainly. better than no meds. Freshwater dip if I recall has little effect on them

 

[jibson]

You could attempt its use as it does address gill flukes as well as nematodes and SOME protozoan infestations. It's absorbed by fish making it effective for internal issues mainly. better than no meds. Freshwater dip if I recall has little effect on them

@vetteguy53081 Thanks again for the reply, so in which case do you think half salinity is the safest bet instead of flubendazole?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi @Jay Hemdal , thanks so much for the quick reply

I will try this method slowly tomorrow, but I do also have some spare flubendazole - do you think this would be less stressful or more dangerous to try with this sort of strain of flukes? Or shall I just stick with half salinity

Thanks again very much

You could do a 5 minute freshwater dip to confirm Neobenedenia first - if you see them in the dip afterwards, then I would go with hypo salinity…..
Jay

 

[MnFish1]

I would suggest - going forward - let the LFS keep the fish for a bit before going from shipping into your tank. The mortality of just-shipped fish is high as it is - and its just not a risk to take IMHO

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I would suggest - going forward - let the LFS keep the fish for a bit before going from shipping into your tank. The mortality of just-shipped fish is high as it is - and its just not a risk to take IMHO

That’s a really good point - you don’t want to buy a “double bounced” fish! I always suggest letting the LFS hold the fish for 72 hours minimum, two weeks is better.
Jay