Best snails for brown algae/diatoms

[Johnny M]

66g reef with rr sump so ~50gDT. Going for 8.5 months, 3" sandbed ( caribsea arag-alive), no corals fish : 1-Rainford's goby, 1-McCoskers wrasse, 2 red blood shrimp, 5 nassarius, 3 cerith, 4 trochus, 4 astrea snails. I'm in my diatom phase. What other snails & how many more to help with the diatoms. The snails I have now mostly stay on rockwork, except for the nassarius & cerith - their in sandbed but don't eat diatoms. Ph ~7.9 ; alk ~9.1, Ca ~400, NH3~0, NO2 ~0 ; NO3 ~3-4ppm ; PO4 ~0.02. Recently added a reactor with gfo (phosban)/carbon (seachem); + uv sterilzer 10w. Skimmer - Aquamaxx HO 1.5 hooked up to CO2 scrubber.

 

[ihavecrabs]

trochus are best but I wouldn't add too many more than what you have. Dead CUC just fuel more problems

 

[Johnny M]

trochus are best but I wouldn't add too many more than what you have. Dead CUC just fuel more problems

Thanks. I don't think I'll add anymore trochus. My lfs recommends a few more cerith & 5-7 nerites bc they like to eat diatoms. But it's always good to ask on this forum first!!

 

[12gallonsofhex]

I bought 2 Trochus and 2 ceriths when my new tank went through its diatom bloom. The Trochus are it up, the ceriths only want to go to work when the tank is fed.

 

[absowry]

Are you doing water changes and topping off with rodi? A diatom bloom this late may indicate you're getting silicates added from somewhere.

I have a porcelain crab that tears up diatoms fwiw.

 

[Johnny M]

Are you doing water changes and topping off with rodi? A diatom bloom this late may indicate you're getting silicates added from somewhere.

I have a porcelain crab that tears up diatoms fwiw.

Doing wc 15% every week and using rodi top off water ( 0tds). I ordered a silicate test kit - salifert - coming by tomorrow.

 

[absowry]

Doing wc 15% every week and using rodi top off water ( 0tds). I ordered a silicate test kit - salifert - coming by tomorrow.

Have you been stirring up your sand bed lately?

 

[Johnny M]

Have you been stirring up your sand bed lately?

Yes. Every wc using a python .
I know nassarius do a good job of stirring it up but I think I'm at my limit of 5 for this size tank.

 

[Johnny M]

UPDATE : Did a 40% wc 2 days ago and yesterday diatoms started showing up and today just as bad as b4 wc. Also at the time added 6ml of Vibrant after wc. Today tested NO3 = <1ppm (Hanna checker); PO4 = 19ppb or .019ppm (HC) ; Si = 0.5ppm (Salifert kit). Yesterday also added IM Midsize media reactor ( Pro= Minimax) with new bag of phosban ( 50g) and 125ml Seachem Matrix carbon. A friend told me Si probably coming from rocks ( dry rock - Caribsea Life rock). Other than Si could diatoms be from such low NO3? I'm feeding 3x per day and only for 2 fish & 2 red fire shrimp and can't get them any higher. I wonder if the Probidio Bioclean bacteria i add every 2 weeks is keeping it low. The manufacturer says there is bacteria for NH3, NO2 & NO3. I'd be happy right now to have gha and lose the diatoms! Making up another sw batch & will do a 20-25% wc in a couple of days. At least using the python wc hose I can vacuum up the diatoms.
FTM - lighting is Kessil AP700 ; Schedule : 2hr. ramp up using mostly blues, then 6 hr. @ 34% intensity (color wheel ( for those who know the app) is on #3 for those 6 hours) at ~16,500K, then 2 hr. ramp down going to mostly blues again. I know it's a phase going thru 1st year but very frustrating and just doesn't look nice!!

 

[Atu]

UPDATE : Did a 40% wc 2 days ago and yesterday diatoms started showing up and today just as bad as b4 wc. Also at the time added 6ml of Vibrant after wc. Today tested NO3 = <1ppm (Hanna checker); PO4 = 19ppb or .019ppm (HC) ; Si = 0.5ppm (Salifert kit). Yesterday also added IM Midsize media reactor ( Pro= Minimax) with new bag of phosban ( 50g) and 125ml Seachem Matrix carbon. A friend told me Si probably coming from rocks ( dry rock - Caribsea Life rock). Other than Si could diatoms be from such low NO3? I'm feeding 3x per day and only for 2 fish & 2 red fire shrimp and can't get them any higher. I wonder if the Probidio Bioclean bacteria i add every 2 weeks is keeping it low. The manufacturer says there is bacteria for NH3, NO2 & NO3. I'd be happy right now to have gha and lose the diatoms! Making up another sw batch & will do a 20-25% wc in a couple of days. At least using the python wc hose I can vacuum up the diatoms.
FTM - lighting is Kessil AP700 ; Schedule : 2hr. ramp up using mostly blues, then 6 hr. @ 34% intensity (color wheel ( for those who know the app) is on #3 for those 6 hours) at ~16,500K, then 2 hr. ramp down going to mostly blues again. I know it's a phase going thru 1st year but very frustrating and just doesn't look nice!!

You are overreacting. Diatoms are a normal and healthy part of a reef tank. Let me copy part of a post I just wrote in another thread:

Diatoms are a kind of unicellular algae that has the characteristic of having an outer silica shell, so they need silica to grow, contrary to other algae. They are really fast growers, and for this reason they are dominant where silica is present, like river estuaries. They actually produce 20% of the oxygen around the world.
Why am I telling you this? Simply to let you know that if you have silica in your aquarium you are gonna have diatoms, and if you have diatoms silica is present.
Now, this isn’t something bad, I dose silica when diatoms aren’t present, so does Randy although I do not know his schedule. Silica is also used by sponges and other organisms and can be healthy for a reef tank. Also, it’s consumed really fast as shown in this article by Randy.

Silica can enter an aquarium via water changes (salt mixes do have silica present) and via RO water. A reverse osmosis membrane do not filter silica out (in the form of silicic acid) very well, the resin will. So a resin that’s beginning to get exhausted will let silica through. Not only will it let it through, it will leach the silicic acid trapped, so expect a burst of silicate as a first sign of a exhausted resin.
From Randy’s article about RO/DI systems:

“It turns out that silicate is found at the lower end of affinity for anion resins. Consequently, if the DI resin has been collecting silicate for a long period and is then depleted, a large burst of silicate may be released.”

By the way, this fast usage of the silica in an aquarium also means that it won’t get trapped in a sand bed in any usable form, so that’s not your problem here if indeed what’s growing are diatoms.
If you want to get rid of this, your culprits might be your salt mix (which I’m guessing you didn’t change), a higher frequency of water changes (which also I’m guessing you didn’t change) and the water you are using.

So, back to your case, first of all, don't worry. This is not a problem, this is merely aesthetics, over correcting might be a lot worse. Your culprits are the same as in the quoted message. Either you changed your salt mix with one with higher silica, your DI resin is getting exhausted or you are performing too many water changes for your silica to stay down.
Silica is consumed really really quick in a reef tank, if there is no input it should deplete in a matter of days.
Another possible sources of silica that I previously left out were foods and additives. Randy expands on this in his article.

Oh, by the way and since you asked, I think the best snails for this are collonista and stomatella snails. They usually are hitchhikers and they self-populate in a reef tank. They are really small so they don't disturb anything, and occasionally may serve as food to some fishes. At night my tank is full of this snails everywhere.
They won't touch your sand though.

 

[Johnny M]

Thanks for ur help. I've been using last couple months Tropic-marin classic salt. B4 that was using HW- Marine mix reefer salt. Di resin still good. Use same salt for Qt w/a few PVC pipes and when tested for Si it was 0. So Si must be coming from rock's in DT. Ok so back off in frequent wc's ,however had diatoms for almost a week now, doesn't look like it going away anytime soon.
Food : dry- PE pellets, frozen - alternating with Hikari baby brine, mini mysis, rotifiers, cyclopods, enriched brine shrimp, lrs reef frenzy. To that add Selco-Boost or Selcon or Vitachem.

 

[Johnny M]

Thanks for ur help. I've been using last couple months Tropic-marin classic salt. B4 that was using HW- Marine mix reefer salt, but it was leaving white film in mixing container. Di resin still good. Use same salt for Qt w/a few PVC pipes and when tested for Si it was 0. So Si must be coming from rock's in DT. Ok so back off in frequent wc's ,however had diatoms for almost a week now, doesn't look like it going away anytime soon.
Food : dry- PE pellets, frozen - alternating with Hikari baby brine, mini mysis, rotifiers, cyclopods, enriched brine shrimp, lrs reef frenzy. To that add Selco-Boost or Selcon or Vitachem.

 

[Atu]

May I ask how do you know that the resin is still good? Are you measuring TDS?

If the silica were to be coming from the rocks I would expect that you would have had this problem before, but this is a new thing, right?

There is also the chance that these are not diatoms. If you are able a pic would help a lot.

 

[Johnny M]

May I ask how do you know that the resin is still good? Are you measuring TDS?

If the silica were to be coming from the rocks I would expect that you would have had this problem before, but this is a new thing, right?

There is also the chance that these are not diatoms. If you are able a pic would help a lot.

Rodi unit is 5 stages. Bought unit from BRS. The di resin changes from blue to brown as it is used up and 3/4 of it is still blue. TDS meter came with and it shows 0. Checked rodi water for Si & is 0. This is the 1st time I'm having diatoms problem. Will update with photo a later. Out on road now.

 

[Johnny M]

May I ask how do you know that the resin is still good? Are you measuring TDS?

If the silica were to be coming from the rocks I would expect that you would have had this problem before, but this is a new thing, right?

There is also the chance that these are not diatoms. If you are able a pic would help a lot.

Here are 2 pix of diatoms on sand :

Sorry but but for some reason image uploaded sideways and don't know how to turn it. On my pc for some reason they look normal. *also don't have pix but it starts to grow on glass and remove every 2 days. Astrea & trochus snails rarely on glass so they don't do a good job eating it. On the rock work they do.

 

[Atu]

Well, they do look like diatoms. I wouldn't completely trust the color in the resin, but I would trust that plus the TDS reading. If silicates aren't getting in (I'm not sure about the food) then maybe they have been there all along and have been limited by something else, like iron.

In this thread people discuss diatoms and changing to a new salt mix, in this case, tropic marin. You might find it interesting.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=935370

Anyway, I think you shouldn't even worry about this. I think its healthier to live along a little algae and to have a little silicate. Although I know it isn't as pretty. Maybe you could get a fighting conch, which I've heard makes wonders for a sand bed.

 

[Johnny M]

Well, they do look like diatoms. I wouldn't completely trust the color in the resin, but I would trust that plus the TDS reading. If silicates aren't getting in (I'm not sure about the food) then maybe they have been there all along and have been limited by something else, like iron.

In this thread people discuss diatoms and changing to a new salt mix, in this case, tropic marin. You might find it interesting.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=935370

Anyway, I think you shouldn't even worry about this. I think its healthier to live along a little algae and to have a little silicate. Although I know it isn't as pretty. Maybe you could get a fighting conch, which I've heard makes wonders for a sand bed.

Great. Thanks so much for your advice. I was thinking about getting a fighting conch. Also after reading the thread u linked I'm surprised about Tm having a little silicate. Come to think of it I was using HW- Marine reefer salt and switched to TM a few weeks ago & now diatoms. Humm , maybe just coincidence? I have a friend that has a sw/fw maintenance business + he's been into sw/reef tanks and all he ever uses is IO. It's cheaper than TM but I've read on many forums that it leaves a residue in the sw mixing container. Anyone else have that problem?

 

[Atu]

I do not know it’s parameters, but the white residue might be due to high alkalinity and calcium causing precipitation of calcium carbonate.
It’s nothing to worry about, but your water mix might have a lower alkalinity and calcium concentration that what you might expect.
You might be able to keep more in solution if you work with cooler water, keep in mind that it’s solubility lowers as temperature rises, contrary to most cases.
Although I would prefer a water change with lower alkalinity than with lower temperature depending on the volume being changed.

 

[jtl]

My tank is going on 2 years old and I still get occasional Diatoms. I just stir up the sand before doing my weekly water change and it keeps them in check. It also seems to help to keep good flow to the area where they are growing. We keep a very clean tank so we stay on top of algae issues.

 

[Johnny M]

I do not know it’s parameters, but the white residue might be due to high alkalinity and calcium causing precipitation of calcium carbonate.
It’s nothing to worry about, but your water mix might have a lower alkalinity and calcium concentration that what you might expect.
You might be able to keep more in solution if you work with cooler water, keep in mind that it’s solubility lowers as temperature rises, contrary to most cases.
Although I would prefer a water change with lower alkalinity than with lower temperature depending on the volume being changed.

IO parameters: @35 ppt - pH : 8.2-8.4 ; Ca : 440 ; alk: 11 ; Mg : 1140
I would keep salinity @ 34ppt so above would be slightly lower. On their website they say once mixed w/no circulation & heat it could last a long time in covered container.

 

[Atu]

IO parameters: @35 ppt - pH : 8.2-8.4 ; Ca : 440 ; alk: 11 ; Mg : 1140
I would keep salinity @ 34ppt so above would be slightly lower. On their website they say once mixed w/no circulation & heat it could last a long time in covered container.

Alk 11 is really high, no wonder you are getting some precipitation. I would measure some fresh made water after the residue is form to check it's actual alkalinity after some of it precipitates.
I would just do that to know it's real value. Keep in mind that if you have an alkalinity of 9 and you're doing water changes with an alkalinity of 11 you are gonna have some alkalinity spikes, and I would avoid them. I know some people uses HCl to lower the alkalinity of a fresh batch of water before doing theirs water changes. I just use one that matches my alkalinity.
The precipitate is not biggie, no worries about it, but be careful with the alkalinity spikes.