How much Aluminum will it leach? Let's guess

[jason2459]

Going to do a quick 1 month experiment with marine pure ceramic 4"x8"x8" block.

I'm the poster child for ADD and curiosity killed the cat. This hobby is just to much fun as there's so much to play with.

I'm not going to see how it effects my nutrients (N and P). As unless I messed something up, I don't think I've had issues with those since 2010 after I got into feeding bacteria as a carbon source.

What I'm looking for is how much Aluminum will be in my tank after the 1st month. I won't know what form it will be in, if it's truly fully inert or not, but just that it's present. I will also be keeping an eye on my yellow Fiji leather and red mushrooms.

I think it's a perfect time for me to do this as my ATS died on me a few weeks ago. I am building out a new sump room and will bring it back online then. So, I know it won't uptake anything. I don't run GFO so it won't uptake any of it. I do have it and poly filters on hand at all times for those just incase situations.

I did put some GAC online a few days ago but will take it offline as well so I know it won't possibly uptake any Al. I will also keep my ozone generator offline.

I will continue to carbon dose, continue skimming, and continue daily ~1% automatic water changes. Those have been my core import/export mechanisms since around that 2010 time frame.

I have had possibly some trace amounts of Al in my system as detected by Triton.

I did a round of basic tests tonight and sending off a sample to Triton. I should have the block in tomorrow. After the block has been in my system for 30 days I'll send off another water sample to Triton.

If I get results back showing Al up to that set point amount in either before or after results I would not be surprised nor contribute it to the marine pure ceramic blocks.


This is also a good time for me to send off a sample to Triton. After all this testing I've been doing the past several months I had to get all new Salifert Ca, alk, and Mg kits. This will just give me a good quick cross check before I go back to testing multiple salt brands.


The tests from tonight
Salinity:
Apex 34.7
Veegee: 34+
Triton (calculated):

Temp: 79.7
pH: 8.22

Ca:
API: 480
Salifert: 475
Triton:

Alk:
API: 11
Hanna: 11.2
Salifert: 11.2

Mg:
Salifert: 1380
Triton:

Nitrates:
Red Sea Pro: 0
Salifert: 0
API: 0

PO4:
Hanna 736 ULR: 3ppb / 0.009198 ppm converted
Triton:

Side note: I'm also testing for Hanna Alk checker accuracy with what's supposed to be a bad reagent bottle. It's also been stored laying on its side which is supposed to be the worse for it. Seems accurate so far.

 

[CodyRVA]

Following. What visible impact would increased AL have on a system? I've been using several marine pure blocks for about 3 months now with seemingly no issues.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Following. What visible impact would increased AL have on a system? I've been using several marine pure blocks for about 3 months now with seemingly no issues.

If it is high enough (and possibly of the "right" form) it causes corals to close up, especially soft corals such as leathers.

Folks have seen that effect (at least in the old days) from aluminum oxide phosphate binders.

I discuss it here:

Chemistry And The Aquarium: Aluminum In The Reef Aquarium ? Advanced Aquarist | Aquarist Magazine and Blog
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/july2003/chem.htm

 

[CodyRVA]

If it is high enough (and possibly of the "right" form) it causes corals to close up, especially soft corals such as leathers.

Have Marine Pure products been proven to have this issue?

 

[jason2459]

Have Marine Pure products been proven to have this issue?

Depends on who you ask.

 

[JMLewis]

Very interesting, following along.

 

[jason2459]

One thing I already don't like is how delicate this stuff is. It came with a corner missing and rubs off easily in the hands.

I gently rinsed the block in rodi several times before gently placing it in the sump. There have been reports of these falling apart or erroding away which regardless of Al content or type does concern me.

 

[Jimbo]

I have one of these in my tank going on 8 months.....no erosion of any kind going on. I did just get a Triton test done that came back with high Al.

It'll be interesting to see your results

 

[Lonely reefer's]

I have one of these in my tank going on 8 months.....no erosion of any kind going on. I did just get a Triton test done that came back with high Al.

It'll be interesting to see your results

How does your corals look in you tank?
I have some in my biocube rear compartment

 

[JMLewis]

Never did a Triton test but removed the blocks I had in my tank and did several large water changes and my corals have never looked better. Parameters were rock solid only thing I could narrow it down to were the blocks. And beginning to think I was right.

 

[Live Water]

Following

 

[CodyRVA]

I have one of these in my tank going on 8 months.....no erosion of any kind going on. I did just get a Triton test done that came back with high Al.

Dang, i'll likely remove the stuff then. I have half Marine Pure and half Great Wave. Anyone ever use the Great Wave sintered glass media? I've had great success with it in the past, figured the Marine Pure would beat it, but apparently not...

 

[FarmerTy]

Following!

FWIW, I've run the blocks for 2 years now and do have elevated Aluminum according to Triton, 82 ug/l in 2014, 84 ug/l in 2015.

I've had zero issues with corals in my tank though I run a predominantly SPS tank. I keep no leathers and hardly any zoas or LPS.

 

[jason2459]

I'm on the cautious side of this product but have to admit many people use many variations of this product with no apparent negative effects. Though I don't know of any long term users? 5, 10, plus years.

It seems one must be very gentle with it and don't let anything rub against it over time.

In the end all it is there for is surface area for bacteria to grow. Its not magic and won't absorbe any nutrients. Some kind of export mechanism still needs to be inplace. If not, eventually what has been consumed by the bacteria will be released.

 

[FarmerTy]

I'm on the cautious side of this product but have to admit many people use many variations of this product with no apparent negative effects. Though I don't know of any long term users? 5, 10, plus years.

It seems one must be very gentle with it and don't let anything rub against it over time.

In the end all it is there for is surface area for bacteria to grow. Its not magic and won't absorbe any nutrients. Some kind of export mechanism still needs to be inplace. If not, eventually what has been consumed by the bacteria will be released.

I don't think the product has been out long enough to have user's experiences of 5+ years yet but eventually.

Not to try to contradict but it is an export mechanism. If put in low flow, it aids in denitrification and nitrate will be converted and released as nitrogen gas and exported out of the system. If put in high flow, it'll aid in nitrification and convert ammonia and nitrite into nitrate, though no real export from the system is occurring here, the conversion produces a compound that is more readily used by bacteria, algaes, clams, and corals.

Looking forward to your tests! I wonder if there is any way for us to differentiate what form of Al it releases into the system?

 

[jason2459]

I don't think the product has been out long enough to have user's experiences of 5+ years yet but eventually.

Not to try to contradict but it is an export mechanism. If put in low flow, it aids in denitrification and nitrate will be converted and released as nitrogen gas and exported out of the system. If put in high flow, it'll aid in nitrification and convert ammonia and nitrite into nitrate, though no real export from the system is occurring here, the conversion produces a compound that is more readily used by bacteria, algaes, clams, and corals.

Looking forward to your tests! I wonder if there is any way for us to differentiate what form of Al it releases into the system?

Nitrate is not the only thing bacteria consume that needs to be exported. They also consume phosphates and other trace elements you wouldn't want to build up in your system.

 

[HiddenUser]

Is the potential for leaching Aluminum and issue for the spherical media as well? Following along as I have a couple of gallons of the spheres in my sump mixed with some LR rubble.

 

[FarmerTy]

Nitrate is not the only thing bacteria consume that needs to be exported. They also consume phosphates and other trace elements you wouldn't want to build up in your system.

Agreed, though phosphates to a much lesser degree than nitrates or carbon for that matter.

I was just clarifying that it can be indeed used as an export mechanism for nitrates directly to nitrogen gas via bacterial interference.

 

[jason2459]

Is the potential for leaching Aluminum and issue for the spherical media as well? Following along as I have a couple of gallons of the spheres in my sump mixed with some LR rubble.

Potentially yes. Its made of the same material.

 

[FarmerTy]

I seem to recall that the manufacturer mentioned using alumina in the binding process for production so I would imagine it is in the material, no matter what form it is sold as, spheres or blocks.