My Dino fight, a losing battle

[reef’r]

Just figured I’d post this out of frustration I suppose, been battling Dino’s for 4-5 months. At one point I thought I had them gone but I was quickly corrected in that way of thinking and they’ve been a presence ever since. So far I have bought a microscope and confirmed type which was ostreopsis I believe, tried turning lights off which definitely knocks them back but they are quick to return, in my PE a tank blackout does nothing for them. I’ve let the tank go to the dumps by not cleaning glass, no water changes, feeding a lot, dosing nutrients, the Dino’s have not batted an eye. Most recently I’m day 6 into a 7 day experiment dosing hydrogen peroxide and have not seen any signs of it doing anything to any type of algae in the tank, I thought this was going to be the miracle solution, it did absolutely nothing. And lastly as of yesterday I put a green killing machine 9w UV in the tank. Supposedly good for up to 50 gallons and I’m sure I’m going to hear I should have went with the 24w version but so far instead of that thing doing anything to the Dino’s they have instead taken to growing all over it just like everything else in the tank. So yeah that about sums it up, pretty frustrated to say the least. Tank grows coralline algae, params are stable, yesterdays test showed P04 of .04 and N03 of 10+ but even still I’m not convinced increasing those numbers higher will do anything. Have not tried bottled bacteria or silicates, not sure I’m going to either.

 

[reef’r]

Couple pics

 

[strich]

What kind of macro algae have you got to outcompete it?
Post all your tank water stats too.

 

[PharmrJohn]

In addition to your parameters, what kind of flow do you have in your tank and what kind of flow do you have going through the UV fixture? And you JUST turned it on. Ya need to give it a little time.......

 

[Growing Reefs]

Huge water changes, and immediately dirty that new water once in tank reef roids raise phosphates and Oster feast Excell nitrates

 

[reef’r]

What kind of macro algae have you got to outcompete it?
Post all your tank water stats too.

The only algae I have in the tank is stuff that growing naturally. I added some pompom from algae barn when I initially started the fight, it all got torn to shreds from fish and snails and died off.

Water params
Salinity-35ppt
Alk-8.9
Ph-8.1/8.3
Calc-420/440
Mag-1280/1300
Phos-.04
Nitrate- >10

 

[reef’r]

In addition to your parameters, what kind of flow do you have in your tank and what kind of flow do you have going through the UV fixture? And you JUST turned it on. Ya need to give it a little time.......

I have a nero 5 and a jabeo sow-8 in the tank, plus a 400gpm return pump running full blast. Tank is a 38g AIO so flow is definitely plenty. The gpm through the UV is whatever the pump provides for it which I believe is around 37gph

 

[reef’r]

Huge water changes, and immediately dirty that new water once in tank reef roids raise phosphates and Oster feast Excell nitrates

And how would these Newley introduced nitrate and phosphate be any different than the ones already in the tank?

 

[reef’r]

Huge water changes, and immediately dirty that new water once in tank reef roids raise phosphates and Oster feast Excell nitrates

I dose phosphates and feed oyster feast every night. Not being a jerk, just asking

 

[PharmrJohn]

In terms of your UV flow rate, it largely depends on what you're trying to eliminate and wattage compared to the volume of your tank. The numbers given in other threads and random searches are all over the map it seems. But I can say that I don't think your flow rate is high enough. Concerning the pump you're using, are you taking into account the plumbing when calculating your final GPH value? Or is the value you are posting directly of the pump? Also, I would first try to get more water moving through it.....say, 3 to 4x total water volume turnover. That being said, I've seen numbers thrown around as low as 1.5x. And UV does not kill at the radiation level you have. It messes with reproduction. It's effect is 'static', rather than 'cidal'.

With your in tank flow, I'd make sure you have ample flow across your sandbed and aquascape. Not sure where you have your powerheads pointed, but that is important.

In addition, how long was your blackout period?

 

[PharmrJohn]

BTW, your parameters are fine. Just keep NO3 and PO4 above zero.

 

[reef’r]

In terms of your UV flow rate, it largely depends on what you're trying to eliminate and wattage compared to the volume of your tank. The numbers given in other threads and random searches are all over the map it seems. But I can say that I don't think your flow rate is high enough. Concerning the pump you're using, are you taking into account the plumbing when calculating your final GPH value? Or is the value you are posting directly of the pump? Also, I would first try to get more water moving through it.....say, 3 to 4x total water volume turnover. That being said, I've seen numbers thrown around as low as 1.5x. And UV does not kill at the radiation level you have. It messes with reproduction. It's effect is 'static', rather than 'cidal'.

With your in tank flow, I'd make sure you have ample flow across your sandbed and aquascape. Not sure where you have your powerheads pointed, but that js important.

In addition, how long was your blackout period?

The UV is an in tank UV so there virtually is no plumbing, the pump suction is connected to the UV with a 1/2” plastic 90* and there’s another 1/2” plastic 90* on the pump supply so given total GPH of what the pump can do I’d say is pretty close to what it’s actually doing. The power heads are opposing each other. One on the left side of the tank positioned more forward and the other on the right side positioned further back to create a “whirling’ effect around the scape. The Dino’s seem most attracted (if that makes sense) to objects in the tank and not my rock scape. They’re on the power heads, my frag rack, the power cords to the power heads, the UV, and in my substrate which is crushed coral so it’s all through it vs like sand when it would just be on top. I did do a quick search before purchasing the UV which stated flow rate was adequate for Dino but they also make two versions… with my luck the one I bought is less than ideal

 

[Growing Reefs]

And how would these Newley introduced nitrate and phosphate be any different than the ones already in the tank?

This is how I beat it dinos all the time in customers tanks. Dinos is phytoplankton removing as much as possible in water column and reintroducing new nitrate and phosphates will also help eliminate them! If u don't add them your gona be in same boat no nutrients.

 

[Growing Reefs]

I dose phosphates and feed oyster feast every night. Not being a jerk, just asking

Ok your heading right direction, now huge water changes to remove as much phytoplankton as possible

 

[muffinmanXL]

Huge water changes, and immediately dirty that new water once in tank reef roids raise phosphates and Oster feast Excell nitrates

Um, no.

 

[strich]

Um, no.

That kind of feedback isn't useful mate. Provide reasoning so people can understand your point of view.

 

[Kmst80]

In my opinion blackouts and hydrogen peroxide are a waste of time. The green killing machine is good for bacterial breakouts like green or brown water but again waste of time when battling dinos, since you have it already keep it running anyways since ostreopsis migrates into water at night.

Here is what did it for me after battling prorocentrum for 6 month:

1:Keep nitrates at 10 ppm and phosphates around 0.1 ppm. test daily and dose accordingly to keep those numbers up until you know what to do and you can test less frequently.
2o your normal waterchanges, just make sure nitrtates and phosphates are 10/0.1 after. You are trying to grow algae to outcompete dinos, still need those trace elements in the water.
3:Manual removal. Get a 5 micron filtersock and suck up as many of the dinos as you can as often as you can. I put the hose into the filtersock into the sump so the water stayed in the system. I did this every 2 or 3 days.
4: Dose Phytoplankton
5: Dose Silicates. They will cause diatoms to grow which will compete with the dinos. This was the final punch in my fight, but prorocentrum don't migrate into the water either.
6: Keep at it, don't give up.

Read this if you haven't already

A Dinoflagellate Treatment Guide

As the title suggests, this is intended as a short guide on what to do when you suspect dinoflagellates are trying to overtake your system. It is an attempt to boil down the protocols discussed across 11,000 posts in this "Are you Tired" thread...

www.reef2reef.com

Good luck

 

[reef’r]

In my opinion blackouts and hydrogen peroxide are a waste of time. The green killing machine is good for bacterial breakouts like green or brown water but again waste of time when battling dinos, since you have it already keep it running anyways since ostreopsis migrates into water at night.

Here is what did it for me after battling prorocentrum for 6 month:

1:Keep nitrates at 10 ppm and phosphates around 0.1 ppm. test daily and dose accordingly to keep those numbers up until you know what to do and you can test less frequently.
2o your normal waterchanges, just make sure nitrtates and phosphates are 10/0.1 after. You are trying to grow algae to outcompete dinos, still need those trace elements in the water.
3:Manual removal. Get a 5 micron filtersock and suck up as many of the dinos as you can as often as you can. I put the hose into the filtersock into the sump so the water stayed in the system. I did this every 2 or 3 days.
4: Dose Phytoplankton
5: Dose Silicates. They will cause diatoms to grow which will compete with the dinos. This was the final punch in my fight, but prorocentrum don't migrate into the water either.
6: Keep at it, don't give up.

Read this if you haven't already

A Dinoflagellate Treatment Guide

As the title suggests, this is intended as a short guide on what to do when you suspect dinoflagellates are trying to overtake your system. It is an attempt to boil down the protocols discussed across 11,000 posts in this "Are you Tired" thread...

www.reef2reef.com

Good luck

I was thinking about kind of just going back to doing my 10% a week water changes but then in this article it says to avoid unless absolutely necessary. It seems like the best thing to do for ostreopsis is a big UV and and as much as I hate to say it I don’t want to spend $3-400 on a UV and a pump, useful as it may be. I’m not exactly sure what to do next to be honest. I have GHA and coralline growing in the tank, my glass gets pretty dirty of just a couple of days, I’m feeding pretty heavily, have 10 fish In the tank and dosing phosphates…. Not sure what the heck else I can do lol maybe I’ll try the filter floss thing

 

[Kmst80]

I was thinking about kind of just going back to doing my 10% a week water changes but then in this article it says to avoid unless absolutely necessary. It seems like the best thing to do for ostreopsis is a big UV and and as much as I hate to say it I don’t want to spend $3-400 on a UV and a pump, useful as it may be. I’m not exactly sure what to do next to be honest. I have GHA and coralline growing in the tank, my glass gets pretty dirty of just a couple of days, I’m feeding pretty heavily, have 10 fish In the tank and dosing phosphates…. Not sure what the heck else I can do lol maybe I’ll try the filter floss thing

Remove the brown stuff manual as much as you can and as often. Dose silicates.Diatoms will start growing where the dinos are....its competition.The dinos will come back again and again and again but if you keep at it the day will come there are none. Then you can battle with the other algaes. My battle was 6 month but I beat it.
The other question you need to ask yourself is why you got them in the first place. In my case it was chemiclean I stupidly used for cyano. Noked the good stuff out in my tank. No more chemical algae treatments for me.

 

[Kmst80]

I was thinking about kind of just going back to doing my 10% a week water changes but then in this article it says to avoid unless absolutely necessary. It seems like the best thing to do for ostreopsis is a big UV and and as much as I hate to say it I don’t want to spend $3-400 on a UV and a pump, useful as it may be. I’m not exactly sure what to do next to be honest. I have GHA and coralline growing in the tank, my glass gets pretty dirty of just a couple of days, I’m feeding pretty heavily, have 10 fish In the tank and dosing phosphates…. Not sure what the heck else I can do lol maybe I’ll try the filter floss thing

By the way I got a 200 gallon so the uv for me would have been thousands of dollars.