Return Pump Choice - Flow Rate Confusion!

[Dr. D]

I'm setting up a 100g DT tank with a 33g sump (see my build thread). The tank, an eSHOPPS Mariner 100, has a listed max flow rate of 1250 GPH.

For my return pump, I bought a Sicce Syncra 9.0, with a max flow rate of 2500 GPH, figuring I could just dial it down. I could, but this morning I learned that the Syncra doesn't play well with my Hydros system (kraken/Launch/WE2), not even plugging into the 24v ports without DIY-Fu that I'm not interested in doing (It will work by just plugging it into a Kraken receptacle, but not elegantly). Hydros customer support suggests a Reef Octopus Varios-4, a compatible 24v pump with a max flow rate of 1050 GPH. (Larger Varios pumps are 36v, so again not good for the Hydros, whose force ports only handle 12v or 24v.) I'm thinking of returning the Sicce.

Now I realize I don't really understand return pump flow rate. I know what it is, obviously, but not how I should manage it. How close to the max flow rate should I be running? Is a max 1050 GPH return pump on a max 1250 GPH tank system even an option? How do you even know what you're pushing through the pipes? My question is about return pumps, not power heads.

Help!

 

[Pistondog]

I'm setting up a 100g DT tank with a 33g sump (see my build thread). The tank, an eSHOPPS Mariner 100, has a listed max flow rate of 1250 GPH.

For my return pump, I bought a Sicce Syncra 9.0, with a max flow rate of 2500 GPH, figuring I could just dial it down. I could, but this morning I learned that the Syncra doesn't play well with my Hydros system (kraken/Launch/WE2), not even plugging into the 24v ports without DIY-Fu that I'm not interested in doing (It will work by just plugging it into a Kraken receptacle, but not elegantly). Hydros customer support suggests a Reef Octopus Varios-4, a compatible 24v pump with a max flow rate of 1050 GPH. (Larger Varios pumps are 36v, so again not good for the Hydros, whose force ports only handle 12v or 24v.) I'm thinking of returning the Sicce.

Now I realize I don't really understand return pump flow rate. I know what it is, obviously, but not how I should manage it. How close to the max flow rate should I be running? Is a max 1050 GPH return pump on a max 1250 GPH tank system even an option? How do you even know what you're pushing through the pipes? My question is about return pumps, not power heads.

Help!

I think something adjustable like the varios is a good suggestion. There are other, cheaper pumps like current usa.
You never get the max flow out of a pump due to head and piping restrictions.
Shoot for 5 to 10x water volume for return pump.
You can measure return pump flow with a 5 gallon bucket and stopwatch.

 

[Dragen Fiend]

Its multi-stage and can vary.

Your max flow it based off the overflow baffle size>plumbing size>filtration thickness

For an example, your tank has 1inch plumbing that can handle a flow of about 960gph. Looks like this tank has 2 drain pipes. So technically its 1,920gph that can flow into your sump. However this can change depending on your overflow size. It can only allow so much water to pass through the baffles. So this could be the limited factor for the 1250 spec. Then of course what type of filtration you use can also slow down.

If the specs are accurate on the site.
Your tank can handle max 1250 GPH. So if your return pump is doing more than this. You run into a problem of a dry pump.


The varios pumps do indeed play nice with hydros from what I read. I would personally give yourself more wiggle room and get the Octo VariosS-6. This way your not running your pump at 100% all the time and you have more wiggle room to increase your max flow rate.

​

 

[BryanM]

I'm setting up a 100g DT tank with a 33g sump (see my build thread). The tank, an eSHOPPS Mariner 100, has a listed max flow rate of 1250 GPH.

For my return pump, I bought a Sicce Syncra 9.0, with a max flow rate of 2500 GPH, figuring I could just dial it down. I could, but this morning I learned that the Syncra doesn't play well with my Hydros system (kraken/Launch/WE2), not even plugging into the 24v ports without DIY-Fu that I'm not interested in doing (It will work by just plugging it into a Kraken receptacle, but not elegantly). Hydros customer support suggests a Reef Octopus Varios-4, a compatible 24v pump with a max flow rate of 1050 GPH. (Larger Varios pumps are 36v, so again not good for the Hydros, whose force ports only handle 12v or 24v.) I'm thinking of returning the Sicce.

Now I realize I don't really understand return pump flow rate. I know what it is, obviously, but not how I should manage it. How close to the max flow rate should I be running? Is a max 1050 GPH return pump on a max 1250 GPH tank system even an option? How do you even know what you're pushing through the pipes? My question is about return pumps, not power heads.

Help!

This link should help: https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/intro...-and-powerheads-for-the-reef-tank-part-1.626/

FWIW, I aim for 3x turnover from sump to DT, and around 20x from powerheads in the DT itself.

 

[exnisstech]

I've never ran a pump rated lower than the maximum flow rate of the system. I always run one rated higher and if it's dc dial it back and ac pump I control with a valve. I never measure flow. I adjust to get the water level in the tank and flow through the sump I desire. I depend more on my power heads for tank turn over and the return pretty much just for filtration and flow through my fuge and over the heaters.

 

[KStatefan]

You will never be close to the max flow rate published by the manufacture. That is a number with no head loss

 

[Dr. D]

Its multi-stage and can vary.

Your max flow it based off the overflow baffle size>plumbing size>filtration thickness

For an example, your tank has 1inch plumbing that can handle a flow of about 960gph. Looks like this tank has 2 drain pipes. So technically its 1,920gph that can flow into your sump. However this can change depending on your overflow size. It can only allow so much water to pass through the baffles. So this could be the limited factor for the 1250 spec. Then of course what type of filtration you use can also slow down.

If the specs are accurate on the site.
Your tank can handle max 1250 GPH. So if your return pump is doing more than this. You run into a problem of a dry pump.


The varios pumps do indeed play nice with hydros from what I read. I would personally give yourself more wiggle room and get the Octo VariosS-6. This way your not running your pump at 100% all the time and you have more wiggle room to increase your max flow rate.

​

Thanks. Is the fact that the Varios-6 is a 36v pump of any concern? I assume that means I can't plug it into a Hydros Force port (24v) on the Wave Engine, but would have to plug it directly into a 3-prong receptacle on the Kraken... if that's correct, I think I'd lose any control of the pump via the Wave Engine, which is one of the things I'm looking for (1: lose a power brick, 2: add Hydros control).

Am I on the right track? If so, wouldn't the Varios-6 be operating essentially the same way as the Syncra-9?

Apologies if I'm missing something.

 

[KStatefan]

Thanks. Is the fact that the Varios-6 is a 36v pump of any concern? I assume that means I can't plug it into a Hydros Force port (24v) on the Wave Engine, but would have to plug it directly into a 3-prong receptacle on the Kraken... if that's correct, I think I'd lose any control of the pump via the Wave Engine, which is one of the things I'm looking for (1: lose a power brick, 2: add Hydros control).

Am I on the right track? If so, wouldn't the Varios-6 be operating essentially the same way as the Syncra-9?

Apologies if I'm missing something.

I see no benefit of using a controller to control a return pump. Run it separately on with a back up power source.

 

[Dragen Fiend]

Thanks. Is the fact that the Varios-6 is a 36v pump of any concern? I assume that means I can't plug it into a Hydros Force port (24v) on the Wave Engine, but would have to plug it directly into a 3-prong receptacle on the Kraken... if that's correct, I think I'd lose any control of the pump via the Wave Engine, which is one of the things I'm looking for (1: lose a power brick, 2: add Hydros control).

Am I on the right track? If so, wouldn't the Varios-6 be operating essentially the same way as the Syncra-9?

Apologies if I'm missing something.

Ah yea forgot about 24v kraken. Do you not have any 10v ports available on your hydros setup? That way you can skip the kraken and just use the 10v port that varios has to control it with hydros. But yea you wanting less cables makes sense hence the kraken usage.

 

[Manose]

Thanks. Is the fact that the Varios-6 is a 36v pump of any concern? I assume that means I can't plug it into a Hydros Force port (24v) on the Wave Engine, but would have to plug it directly into a 3-prong receptacle on the Kraken... if that's correct, I think I'd lose any control of the pump via the Wave Engine, which is one of the things I'm looking for (1: lose a power brick, 2: add Hydros control).

Am I on the right track? If so, wouldn't the Varios-6 be operating essentially the same way as the Syncra-9?

Apologies if I'm missing something.

I run the varios 4 at 65% with a similar 100g tank Nyos opus 440 but I see you have dual returns split with random flow generators and that takes more pressure so I would......
Get the varios 6 and use its power brick and control but plug the controller into the 0-10v on your wave engine

 

[Manose]

Here is the controller and you can see it is made with a 0-10v input so you can control the speed of the varios 6 with the w/e

Here is the cable

Hydros Pump Adapter Cable - 10V Quad WE Pump Adapter

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www.saltwateraquarium.com

 

[Dr. D]

I run the varios 4 at 65% with a similar 100g tank Nyos opus 440 but I see you have dual returns split with random flow generators and that takes more pressure so I would......
Get the varios 6 and use its power brick and control but plug the controller into the 0-10v on your wave engine

Thank you, and thanks to ALL who responded withing such a short time. Varios 6 it is.

I continue to be blown away by the helpful community here. It's why I immediately became a Supporting Member-- it's already a bargain!

 

[MaddReefer]

I always run 2 external pumps, if one fails , u always have a backup. That being said, a varios 4 is fine for 100gallon tank. Probably 5to7 times turnover in sump.

 

[Freenow54]

I'm setting up a 100g DT tank with a 33g sump (see my build thread). The tank, an eSHOPPS Mariner 100, has a listed max flow rate of 1250 GPH.

For my return pump, I bought a Sicce Syncra 9.0, with a max flow rate of 2500 GPH, figuring I could just dial it down. I could, but this morning I learned that the Syncra doesn't play well with my Hydros system (kraken/Launch/WE2), not even plugging into the 24v ports without DIY-Fu that I'm not interested in doing (It will work by just plugging it into a Kraken receptacle, but not elegantly). Hydros customer support suggests a Reef Octopus Varios-4, a compatible 24v pump with a max flow rate of 1050 GPH. (Larger Varios pumps are 36v, so again not good for the Hydros, whose force ports only handle 12v or 24v.) I'm thinking of returning the Sicce.

Now I realize I don't really understand return pump flow rate. I know what it is, obviously, but not how I should manage it. How close to the max flow rate should I be running? Is a max 1050 GPH return pump on a max 1250 GPH tank system even an option? How do you even know what you're pushing through the pipes? My question is about return pumps, not power heads.

Help!

Not going to read other replies, My pump is a DC variable you need this because of the variances that would take you forever to figure out. pipe diameter and its flow resistance, along with the type of pipe, how many fittings, type material same calculation , valves same distance same barbed fittings same the list is endless need an engineer. you start with the claimed gallons per hour. Is it gph imperial ? Liters pr hour ? a good pump runs $500 where I am from great white north. Now with your new man in power add 25 % Thanks buddy