Are Chinese LED's bad/inferior?

Gladfelter · May 9, 2013

I just went with AI sols but really I would have gone cheaper but I really wanted.programmable......and the lightning storms are.really cool lol

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sanchoy · May 9, 2013

I have experimented taotronics / reefbreeders (aka ajm).

Both Chinese brands were able to prove success with sps corals in my large system.

Friend has ecotech radions and his growth is not as fast as mine. Par test on his radions proved inferior to cheaper Chinese Taos and reefbreeders. My conclusion is Chinese LEDs such as taotronics and reefbreeders outperform and are way less cheaper then some higher end ecotech / AI models.

Only downfall is the warranty is not as lengthy but the price alone covers a new fixture if it breaks. So far reliability is top notch.

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iTzJu · May 9, 2013

I have those exact same fixtures, purchased from the same seller over my 40B Frag tank and they are growing everything, colors are fantastic. I keep everything in there from high end zoas to high end acros. for effective coral growth, you just can't beat the price. I was looking into high end units before but like you wanted to save some money and researched the hell out of these chinese fixtures. from what I came up with, they grown corals as well as any other fixture. does it have all the fancy options? no, but lightning mode for an extra $400 is not worth it for me. you won't be disappointed with those fixtures.

bigfoot86 · May 9, 2013

Still won't trust chinese led units, Ill put my faith in Cree XTEs. Afterall, this isn't a cheap hobby, might as well go with quality and LEDs that are proven. You don't have to buy radions, there are more reasonable units out there that still incorporate the better leds.

Gladfelter · May 9, 2013

It not about the lightning. It's about controllablity. If you work 60+ hours a week knowing that you don't have to mess.with something is worth it

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Gladfelter · May 9, 2013

And frankly three photon 16s would cost me $900+, 2 Photon 36s would cost $940. I got three AI Sols and a controller for $960. Humm $20 more for Sols......and lightning I might add.

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sanchoy · May 9, 2013

Actually, define proven? LEDs has just emerged as new lighting technology within a few years. So no specific led brand has really proven they can last 6+ or more years of reliability they claim.

To say one brand of led is proven, is too early to claim.

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sherita · May 9, 2013

I guess my needs are more simple than most. Reefkeeper turns lights on, they come on. Lights grow coral. Reefkeeper turns lights off, they go off.

I live in tornado alley, I don't need artificial lightning.

iTzJu · May 9, 2013

sherita said:
I guess my needs are more simple than most. Reefkeeper turns lights on, they come on. Lights grow coral. Reefkeeper turns lights off, they go off.

I live in tornado alley, I don't need artificial lightning.

exactly, my biggest concern are my corals health and growth. if 2 fixtures that cost me less than 400 for both can keep them happy, im happy. I'm also looking into the future, these leds progress so fast that in two years we don't know what kind of fixtures will be available to us. I just couldn't justify spending over 1000 on fixtures that will be outdated within 6-12 months and then have to pay another 200 bucks to upgrade them? I'll wait. PEDs are up and coming and i bet we'll be discussing that when it breaks through in the reef scene.

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Gladfelter · May 9, 2013

Don't get me wrong, I'm going to order one of Reef Breeders Value fixtures for my frag tank. At the end of the day every persons tank is their tank, every persons cash is their cash. Either way everyone will probably have success.

Just as some don't see the need.on spending more money, some don't see the point in spending less

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Daniel@R2R · May 9, 2013

bigfoot86 said:
Still won't trust chinese led units, Ill put my faith in Cree XTEs. Afterall, this isn't a cheap hobby, might as well go with quality and LEDs that are proven. You don't have to buy radions, there are more reasonable units out there that still incorporate the better leds.

Hmm...based on the feedback in this thread, I'd say the chinese units have proven themselves--at least in the short term, and LEDs in generally haven't been proven long term (as was pointed out by someone else in this thread). If someone wants to buy name brand lights, then go for it, but don't do it because you think the others "don't work." Do it because the name brand light has some feature or something that you prefer over the bargain brand.

It's kind of like buying clothes. Maybe you buy your shirts at Abercrombie and I buy mine at Wal-Mart. you might say yours are name brand, but please don't try to say that your shirt "works" any better than mine.

They both perform the same function...yours just looks trendier.

bigfoot86 · May 10, 2013

Aahhh, but you only heard reviews from a handful of people that used Chinese LEDs, they are others out that MIGHT NOT complain about the use of the actually light (i.e. par), BUT the actual build of the housing, cooling, etc. Not denying that they can't be used, but goin with a company that offers great customer service, replacement parts and things like ACTUAL Cree LEDs rather than some knock off ones, it most likely more comforting. Agreed you can pay $200.00 every couple years after the lights lose their luster or some problem occurs OR you could spend a couple hundred more and have the lights last 3 to 4 times as long with product warranty, customer service and replacement parts at a fraction of the cost of buying a whole new unit. You do the math.

Daniel@R2R · May 10, 2013

bigfoot86 said:
Aahhh, but you only heard reviews from a handful of people that used Chinese LEDs, they are others out that MIGHT NOT complain about the use of the actually light (i.e. par), BUT the actual build of the housing, cooling, etc. Not denying that they can't be used, but goin with a company that offers great customer service, replacement parts and things like ACTUAL Cree LEDs rather than some knock off ones, it most likely more comforting. Agreed you can pay $200.00 every couple years after the lights lose their luster or some problem occurs OR you could spend a couple hundred more and have the lights last 3 to 4 times as long with product warranty, customer service and replacement parts at a fraction of the cost of buying a whole new unit. You do the math.

Again...it's difficult to make this argument considering LEDs haven't been around even 10 years yet, and much of the technology hasn't been around for more than a couple of years. We're still waiting on the research to tell us the results of which colors are best. You mention "knock off" LEDs in comparison to CREEs, but Bridgelux, Epistar, and Luxeon are all names that are known to be quality lights for keeping and growing coral. The "handful" of reviews in this thread are backed by thousands of others in hundreds of threads EXACTLY like this one. You also use the words "more comforting"...well that's subjective language reflecting your feelings...not the feelings of those. who have bought the Evergrow (or some other LED) fixture.

You also talk about how the lights might "lose their luster" after a couple of years...not sure what you're referring too because these are LEDs (light emitting diodes) their "luster" doesn't diminish over time. The bulbs work until the burn out without variation in par. Also not sure how you can say the CS for the name brand fixture is automatically better without some benchmark to compare it with...that seems like more of an assumption than a fact. There are US businesses that are selling and giving warranty on these fixtures...if anything goes wrong, they repair them in house, and a standard warranty is 3 years.

So, in short, your statement is more opinion and supposition than fact. Sorry.

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donwon4070 · May 10, 2013

I have had my cheap led for 10 months would like maxspect razor but everything grows great under the Chinese light

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Pappy · May 10, 2013

Savant said:
I thought I might have picked up the impression somewhere that Chinese LED setups are bad/inferior? Is this true?

And is this inferior and if so just wondering why. 120W LED Aquarium Lighting Full Spectrum Coral Reef Growing Moonlight Fixture $186.00

120W LED Aquarium Lighting Full Spectrum Coral Reef Growing Moonlight Fixture | eBay

Yes inferior and the spectrum is terrible IMO. I've seen them over people's tanks and their colors are terrible in comparison to a full spectrum Cree fixture. There was also a study recently posted that showed loss of efficiency and par. do they work? yes they do. if i had halides or t5's and was considering changing i sure wouldnt go with these as ive seen threads with many people complaining about how leds arent as good because they used crappy leds. Just my opinion and apologize if I offended anyone.

bhazard451 · May 10, 2013

Pappy said:
Yes inferior and the spectrum is terrible IMO. I've seen them over people's tanks and their colors are terrible in comparison to a full spectrum Cree fixture. There was also a study recently posted that showed loss of efficiency and par. do they work? yes they do. if i had halides or t5's and was considering changing i sure wouldnt go with these as ive seen threads with many people complaining about how leds arent as good because they used crappy leds. Just my opinion and apologize if I offended anyone.

That's another BS statement. Don't blanket 1 crappy blue/white fixture as all chinese lights being crappy. There's dozens of brands and different led layouts.

I've built my own Cree XTE, Luxeon, AND Semiled fixture. It was a very nice light that looked great, but it was overkill. I had to run it at 50% max and could still hit 300 par at the sandbed.

I'm now using the chinese lights with a ratio of leds that outputs the same exact look, using Bridgelux leds instead, hitting 380 on the sandbed at 100%, which is still high and ticks my brains off midday. 4500k for neutral white, 420-430nm violet, 660nm red, royal blue, and 475nm blue. It looks the same, grows coral the same, colors up the coral better (than a retail fixture without violets), because there is no Cree violet yet, and was less than the cost of my DIY build and covers a wider area. The only difference? You use two bridgelux leds at 2.5w, for every 1 Cree at 3-5W. A nice looking case looks a lot better than my DIY attempt as well. The build matched a Radion Pro in color, and beat it handily in output, so it costs around $900 to get that look on your own without DIY. The same good quality chinese light costs around $180. They are out there. The old ones can even be modified with new leds to fix their color and output (usually).

The Crees will actually lose intensity over time quicker getting 1500mah into them compared to two Bridgelux/Epistar at 700mah. Since the Crees were running at 5W, the fixture also gets hot to the touch. The Radion Pro gets hot to the touch too. The chinese lights barely get warm.

Would I have liked Cree instead? Sure, but not at double the cost. If they cost as much as the Bridgelux to use, it would be a no brainer to use Cree instead. The good Bridgelux/Epistar leds are not crappy by any means.

sanchoy · May 10, 2013

1: spend triple the price, get triple the warranty.

2: spend 1/3 the price. Get a lesser warranty.

So far both high end models and cheaper Chinese LEDs has proven they can grow corals. In some cases the par value on the so called inferior Chinese models outperform the high end and high priced American mades.

You just have a very good option. For me : lower price, higher performance out did the high end model with really high price that only included a few syncing options.

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bhazard451 · May 10, 2013

sanchoy said:
1: spend triple the price, get triple the warranty.

2: spend 1/3 the price. Get a lesser warranty.

So far both high end models and cheaper Chinese LEDs has proven they can grow corals. In some cases the par value on the so called inferior Chinese models outperform the high end and high priced American mades.

You just have a very good option. For me : lower price, higher performance out did the high end model with really high price that only included a few syncing options.

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Some US sellers are importing the lights and offering their own 1-2 year warranties on them. It just sweetens the deal. Again, not all companies are equal in customer service, so YMMV on that.

If you want extra features not available on these lights, you gotta pay for it. If not, these chinese lights are fantastic performance wise. I agree on that.

ReefLEDLights · May 10, 2013

Gladfelter said:
I just went with AI sols but really I would have gone cheaper but I really wanted.programmable......and the lightning storms are.really cool lol

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Please for the fish do not program the Lightning Storm...

I saw one you tube of a storm and the poor clown fish was sacred in a different place at every flash.

I have had friends showing this off only to find that expensive wrasse as carpet jerky the next morning...

Seriously it really freaks out the fish...

Bill

ReefLEDLights · May 10, 2013

bhazard451 said:
That's another BS statement. Don't blanket 1 crappy blue/white fixture as all chinese lights being crappy. There's dozens of brands and different led layouts.

I've built my own Cree XTE, Luxeon, AND Semiled fixture. It was a very nice light that looked great, but it was overkill. I had to run it at 50% max and could still hit 300 par at the sandbed.

I'm now using the chinese lights with a ratio of leds that outputs the same exact look, using Bridgelux leds instead, hitting 380 on the sandbed at 100%, which is still high and ticks my brains off midday. 4500k for neutral white, 420-430nm violet, 660nm red, royal blue, and 475nm blue. It looks the same, grows coral the same, colors up the coral better (than a retail fixture without violets), because there is no Cree violet yet, and was less than the cost of my DIY build and covers a wider area. The only difference? You use two bridgelux leds at 2.5w, for every 1 Cree at 3-5W. A nice looking case looks a lot better than my DIY attempt as well. The build matched a Radion Pro in color, and beat it handily in output, so it costs around $900 to get that look on your own without DIY. The same good quality chinese light costs around $180. They are out there. The old ones can even be modified with new leds to fix their color and output (usually).

The Crees will actually lose intensity over time quicker getting 1500mah into them compared to two Bridgelux/Epistar at 700mah. Since the Crees were running at 5W, the fixture also gets hot to the touch. The Radion Pro gets hot to the touch too. The chinese lights barely get warm.

Would I have liked Cree instead? Sure, but not at double the cost. If they cost as much as the Bridgelux to use, it would be a no brainer to use Cree instead. The good Bridgelux/Epistar leds are not crappy by any means.