Can fish recover from worms without treatment?

[Bume]

I've been feeding my reef tank for 21 days with metroplex and focus, soaking mysis. 2 of them seem to still be pooping worms, a tang and an anthias. Should I buy more medication or do they have a chance to recover on their own after treatment? I don't have a QT tank for them and I'm not sure I could trap them if I did.

 

[TheDragonsReef]

Are you sure theyre worms and not just stringy white poop? Some of my fish tend to have white poop after eating mysis and thats pretty normal if thats all your feeding

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I've been feeding my reef tank for 21 days with metroplex and focus, soaking mysis. 2 of them seem to still be pooping worms, a tang and an anthias. Should I buy more medication or do they have a chance to recover on their own after treatment? I don't have a QT tank for them and I'm not sure I could trap them if I did.

You won't see worms in a fish's feces unless you've killed them with a treatment. Sometimes, with discus that have Capillaria, you can see worms around the anus, otherwise, all that is ever expelled are microscopic tapeworm fragments or eggs.

Metroplex doesn't treat worms - just protozoans and some anaerobic bacteria. You shouldn't dose it for 21 days, I know the instructions say to, but their dose is also way off. The normal treatment length is 3 to 10 days, dose dependent. Metronidazole is very bitter - the old joke is, if your fish are eating the medicated food well, the dose is too low.

Are the fish showing ANY other symptoms?

My guess is that as @Dragonsreef said, you are seeing mucus. Here is a link to an article I wrote on that (the article is a PDF file on the right of the page):

Mucus - The Slime That Binds

Mucus: The Slime that Binds Jay Hemdal C. 2020 This article examines the various causes of excess mucus coatings on fish, as well as fecal mucus issues. ------------------- The mucus produced by the fish’s epidermal cells gives them their...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

 

[Bume]

You won't see worms in a fish's feces unless you've killed them with a treatment. Sometimes, with discus that have Capillaria, you can see worms around the anus, otherwise, all that is ever expelled are microscopic tapeworm fragments or eggs.

Metroplex doesn't treat worms - just protozoans and some anaerobic bacteria. You shouldn't dose it for 21 days, I know the instructions say to, but their dose is also way off. The normal treatment length is 3 to 10 days, dose dependent. Metronidazole is very bitter - the old joke is, if your fish are eating the medicated food well, the dose is too low.

Are the fish showing ANY other symptoms?

My guess is that as @Dragonsreef said, you are seeing mucus. Here is a link to an article I wrote on that (the article is a PDF file on the right of the page):

Mucus - The Slime That Binds

Mucus: The Slime that Binds Jay Hemdal C. 2020 This article examines the various causes of excess mucus coatings on fish, as well as fecal mucus issues. ------------------- The mucus produced by the fish’s epidermal cells gives them their...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

Thanks for the response, I quit the meds the day I saw your post and they all seemed to be doing better since then except the tang was still pale. He's still eating well but yesterday his dorsal fin started looking super stretched out, like he can't lower it and today it's starting to go translucent, like it's tearing apart and he can't lower it. Any idea what this might be?

 

[Bume]

I should add, nothing has changed in the tank, levels are stable. I'm feeding the tank red and green seaweed, mysis and pellet/flake food. Each type a couple times a week.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I should add, nothing has changed in the tank, levels are stable. I'm feeding the tank red and green seaweed, mysis and pellet/flake food. Each type a couple times a week.

So - what I see in the pics is a YT that has possible HLLE. This looks much different in YT than in other fish. Instead of the pits and holes around the face and lateral line that are typically seen, instead, YT show pale skin and soft fin ray erosion.

Has the mucus feces cleared up in the tang and anthias?

Jay

 

[Bume]

Yes, it seems to have cleared. I just can't seem to find anything online that would explain that fin locked open. I've read that HLLE is caused by poor nutrition and for at least a month I've been feeding all of these things. The YT is eating all of them. Can you think of anything else I could do?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Yes, it seems to have cleared. I just can't seem to find anything online that would explain that fin locked open. I've read that HLLE is caused by poor nutrition and for at least a month I've been feeding all of these things. The YT is eating all of them. Can you think of anything else I could do?

No, only to avoid using carbon, especially dusty, soft carbons. However, once they have been used, stopping carbon use may not stop the HLLE issue, and if it does, the fish may not heal from the damage already incurred.

The diet you present here looks really good, so that should not be an additional problem.

Jay

 

[Bume]

I'm not running any carbon and haven't for a couple years. Sounds like I'm doing the right things, I guess fingers crossed for this little fella, I'll let you know how it goes. I really appreciate the input, thanks for taking the time sir!

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Is there any actual proof carbon (or carbon dust) harms fish? I mean it's use is so common that anything going on in a tank could be correlated with carbon....

 

[clm65]

Perhaps soaking the food in Selcon may help?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Is there any actual proof carbon (or carbon dust) harms fish? I mean it's use is so common that anything going on in a tank could be correlated with carbon....

Yes - there are two peer reviewed studies that demonstrate the carbon connection. One by myself and one by Andy Stamper at Disney. My HLLE info is posted in the library section here (I’m on my phone and can’t link it for you).
Jay

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Yes - there are two peer reviewed studies that demonstrate the carbon connection. One by myself and one by Andy Stamper at Disney. My HLLE info is posted in the library section here (I’m on my phone and can’t link it for you).
Jay

Do you run carbon still?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Do you run carbon still?

Once in a great while, I'll use pelletized carbon, well-rinsed, in a reef tank with good foam fractionation....otherwise, no.

Jay

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Do you think BRS's high-end phx carbon is relatively safe? I run that 24/7 currently.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Do you think BRS's high-end phx carbon is relatively safe? I run that 24/7 currently.

I’ve not used it. Is it a pelleted carbon? Those are pretty safe if rinsed with RODI first.
Jay

 

[vetteguy53081]

Is there any actual proof carbon (or carbon dust) harms fish? I mean it's use is so common that anything going on in a tank could be correlated with carbon....

Its a known condition for years

 

[vetteguy53081]

Add to your diet. YT is a hebivore and need more than offered. The mega marine angel and any brine shrimp or mysis shrimp fed will mimic intestinal worms.
Some additional/beneficial foods are:
-Spirulina brine shrimp
- LRS Herbivore diet
- mysis shrimp
- small plankton
- Hikari Marine cuisine
- Formula 2 flake and frozen
- Hikari veggie marine

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Its a known condition for years

Like garlic treating ich is/was "known" or it was "known" to be impossible to keep goniopora? In other words, I don't think we "know" a lot of about this hobby...

I was asking if there was proof.... Jay answered my question... a few studies reviewed by others are at least some proof....

 

[vetteguy53081]

Like garlic treating ich is/was "known" or it was "known" to be impossible to keep goniopora? In other words, I don't think we "know" a lot of about this hobby...

I was asking if there was proof.... Jay answered my question... a few studies reviewed by others are at least some proof....

Garlic does not treat itch but rather boosts immunity system