Cost Of Equipment Is Out Of Hand

[Flippers4pups]

I do that. My first tank came from a forum member. My goal here is to push others to think twice before dropping the money and accepting the cost for the sake of cost.

But, like anything on the internet, it was a dumb idea.

Please keep the discussion civil and open minded.

 

[fernalfer]

At the risk of fanning a flame, I will have to disagree with this. Having both MP40's and 60's, they are definitely not the same. Kindof the same way a Mini Cooper definitely isn't a Cadillac Escalade

Not my point. What inside that MP60 cost wise was $333.00 more then what is inside the MP40?. And why what is put inside the MP40 is only $60 more dollars then what it cost to make the MP10?

And by the way Cadillac and Mini Cooper are two different companies. MP40 and MP60 are both Ecotech. The Powerheads are made the same way

 

[Thales]

I agree, the thing that gets me is the ecotech MP40 is $366.00 on BRS and the Ecotech MP60 is $699. Same powerhead, same design, nothing is different except one has a little more power. BUT.... $333.00 more power. What is in that MP60 that costs $333.00 more dollars to make it? Is their that much more difference between the MP60 and MP40 then their is between the MP40 and MP10? because the MP40 is only 60$ more then the MP10. But the MP60 is $333.00 more the the MP40. Don't get it........PRICE GOUGING MUCH

I don't agree with your assessment of 'a little more power' being the only difference. The flow is almost double and it isn't just a bigger MP40, the upsize isn't simple. And R&D and all other related costs are not cheap. And, really, and they need to make enough money to stay in business, something that a lot of companies that try to do things on the cheap don't do. But, really, if you don't want an MP60 don't buy one, there are plenty other pumps on the market.

 

[Saveafish]

Not to sound odd or out of place here. There are other high end pumps. Why all the hate on ecotech. I have Tunze at 350$ and the controller at 350. That's 700$

 

[ndrwater]

Not my point. What inside that MP60 cost wise was $333.00 more then what is inside the MP40. And why what was put inside the MP40 is only $60 more dollars then what it cost to make the MP10?

And by the way Cadillac and Mini Cooper are two different companies. MP40 and MP60 are both Ecotech

The 60 is more dissimilar to the other 2 than the 10 and 40 are similar to each other. I also know that the recent price adjustment addresses that issue.
It really boils down to what @Flippers4pups said earlier. Personal choice. It's really that simple. If less people bought "premium" products, and more bought one of the less expensive options, this whole discussion would be a moot point. In my opinion, it already should be...

 

[fernalfer]

I don't agree with your assessment of 'a little more power' being the only difference. The flow is almost double and it isn't just a bigger MP40, the upsize isn't simple. And R&D and all other related costs are not cheap. And, really, and they need to make enough money to stay in business, something that a lot of companies that try to do things on the cheap don't do. But, really, if you don't want an MP60 don't buy one, there are plenty other pumps on the market.

The MP60 can be 30 times more powerful then the MP40 but their is no way you can convince me that they needed $333.00 in parts to make this happen. If it was a completely different design i may somewhat agree. But they are exactly identical. Somehow Ecotech is able to get people to fork $333.00 more for what i don't know.

 

[fernalfer]

Not to sound odd or out of place here. There are other high end pumps. Why all the hate on ecotech. I have Tunze at 350$ and the controller at 350. That's 700$

This goes across the board for all companies. I just happened to pick Ecotech as an example

 

[Kampo]

you know I think equipment is expensive, but then I think of cost of livestock. and it makes sense to a point. that said i'll go the cheap diy route over expensive proven most of the time.

 

[Thales]

The MP60 can be 30 times more powerful then the MP40 but their is no way you can convince me that they needed $333.00 in parts to make this happen. If it was a completely different design i may somewhat agree. But they are exactly identical. Somehow Ecotech is able to get people to fork $333.00 more for what i don't know.

I'm not trying to convince you of anything. You may want to check about the designs though, to see if you are on point about them being exactly identical (you aren't but I am not trying to convince you of anything )

 

[BeejReef]

I don't agree with your assessment of 'a little more power' being the only difference. The flow is almost double and it isn't just a bigger MP40, the upsize isn't simple. And R&D and all other related costs are not cheap. And, really, and they need to make enough money to stay in business, something that a lot of companies that try to do things on the cheap don't do. But, really, if you don't want an MP60 don't buy one, there are plenty other pumps on the market.

People fork out 3x as much for a Mercedes as a honda. Either will "grow coral" just fine. [emoji2]

 

[fernalfer]

I'm not trying to convince you of anything. You may want to check about the designs though, to see if you are on point about them being exactly identical (you aren't but I am not trying to convince you of anything )

They are identical in design. I agree with you their is something different in the MP60 that makes it a more powerful powerhead. But $333.00 more. I doubt it. Heres one for you The MP10 is 1500GPH $299.00. The MP40 is 4500GPH $366.50 and the MP60 is 7500GPH $699.00

Now i can assume whatever was needed in the MP40 to make it 3000GPH more then the MP10 must of cost as much as it did to make the MP60 3000GPH more then the MP40. But why is the MP40 $60 more then the MP10 and the MP60 is $366.00 more then the MP40?

 

[BeejReef]

The 60 is more dissimilar to the other 2 than the 10 and 40 are similar to each other. I also know that the recent price adjustment addresses that issue.
It really boils down to what @Flippers4pups said earlier. Personal choice. It's really that simple. If less people bought "premium" products, and more bought one of the less expensive options, this whole discussion would be a moot point. In my opinion, it already should be...

It's another assembly line, or at least a separate retool and production run with those costs divided over relatively fewer units ( fewer 200g tanks than 90-120).

 

[Thales]

People fork out 3x as much for a Mercedes as a honda. Either will "grow coral" just fine.

Kinda

They are identical in design. I agree with you their is something different in the MP60 that makes it a more powerful powerhead. But $333.00 more. I doubt it.

They are not identical. At the very least one is bigger. Again, if you don't think it is worth it, don't buy it.

 

[joshwaggs]

Please keep the discussion civil and open minded.

What was not civil or open minded about that? I agreed with him, then made the accurate statement that expressing, even a reasonable opinion, on the internet was dumb.

 

[Hemmdog]

I think he’s just trying to say the mp40 and 60 r&d cost would be under the same expense. I’ll go hide now, this is heated lol.

 

[cyber_ecco]

I do that. My first tank came from a forum member. My goal here is to push others to think twice before dropping the money and accepting the cost for the sake of cost.

But, like anything on the internet, it was a dumb idea.

As a self employed person in business I'll give my 2 cents here. These companies are in the industry to make money. They aren't here to help the reef community grow etc. The price of goods are market driven. While I get what your saying and totally agree on that point my solution is I dont buy a product if its value to me doesnt meet up to what i have to pay. If their prices are too high they will not sell and they will either drop the prices to market value or they will fold. Its quite simple economics. You as a consumer control if you want to buy an item because the value you get out weighs the price you pay. Also it's not a level playing field. While one person makes $150k per year and someone makes $39k, that perceived value will be different. I totally get your train of thought, but while that price increase may seem ludicrous to you and me, it may not to someone else...and that's fine...we will just go get a Jebao version. Just being in a hobby doesn't entitle us to have the best high end equipment, nor is it needed to enjoy the hobby. I dont believe that a company should be blasted for trying to make more money. That is the purpose of a business. It's not a charity or non profit. They take all the risk of spending big money to start out with research and marketing manufacturing. Also do not under estimate costs of marketing. In my businesses its 70% of our overhead costs. All I am saying is there are lots of costs you dont see.

 

[Jacked Reefer]

The thing about this thread is I can think of multiple middle of the road products. And guess what, nobody buys them. Look up a coralbox rn-1 for me and tell me how many people use it? Almost exactly like a Nero but less than half the price. Reefbreeders LEDS are another fantastic example. Very rare but they are the product everyone is asking for on here. I can think of two cheap reef controllers right now. And dosing pumps. But I can’t think a single tank I have seen them utlized in.

 

[cyber_ecco]

As a self employed person in business I'll give my 2 cents here. These companies are in the industry to make money. They aren't here to help the reef community grow etc. The price of goods are market driven. While I get what your saying and totally agree on that point my solution is I dont buy a product if its value to me doesnt meet up to what i have to pay. If their prices are too high they will not sell and they will either drop the prices to market value or they will fold. Its quite simple economics. You as a consumer control if you want to buy an item because the value you get out weighs the price you pay. Also it's not a level playing field. While one person makes $150k per year and someone makes $39k, that perceived value will be different. I totally get your train of thought, but while that price increase may seem ludicrous to you and me, it may not to someone else...and that's fine...we will just go get a Jebao version. Just being in a hobby doesn't entitle us to have the best high end equipment, nor is it needed to enjoy the hobby. I dont believe that a company should be blasted for trying to make more money. That is the purpose of a business. It's not a charity or non profit. They take all the risk of spending big money to start out with research and marketing manufacturing. Also do not under estimate costs of marketing. In my businesses its 70% of our overhead costs. All I am saying is there are lots of costs you dont see.

And just to be clear...despite my opinion on this matter I would never pay that price for a water pump. Which is my right as a consumer. It doesn't mean others wont obviously...and that's great for them and the company. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[Flippers4pups]

What was not civil or open minded about that? I agreed with him, then made the accurate statement that expressing, even a reasonable opinion, on the internet was dumb.

Overall statement for everyone, directed towards everyone. Sometimes these kind of threads end up in members flaming each other.

 

[fernalfer]

Kinda


They are not identical. At the very least one is bigger. Again, if you don't think it is worth it, don't buy it.

Trust me i never would.