Does this look like ich?

[SallyWho]

My foxface has been a bit more cryptic than usual for a few days and this morning he just looks rough. Darker stressed coloration, cloudy eyes, and a few speckles of white here and there. He's hard to photograph so you can barely see one or two spots on his face, but there's a couple on his body and fins as well. Not a huge load, but noticeable. He still came out for food, but not as voraciously as usual. No new fish added in 2-3yrs (and they all went through quarantine first anyway), and the only recent additions are some frags from the LFS that came from a fishless frag tank. None of the other fish are showing any signs. I'll have to try to catch him regardless and put him in QT for treatment, but I want to make sure I treat him for the right thing. I'm pretty sure it's ich but I'd like to confirm with the hive mind! Thanks!

 

[vetteguy53081]

My foxface has been a bit more cryptic than usual for a few days and this morning he just looks rough. Darker stressed coloration, cloudy eyes, and a few speckles of white here and there. He's hard to photograph so you can barely see one or two spots on his face, but there's a couple on his body and fins as well. Not a huge load, but noticeable. He still came out for food, but not as voraciously as usual. No new fish added in 2-3yrs (and they all went through quarantine first anyway), and the only recent additions are some frags from the LFS that came from a fishless frag tank. None of the other fish are showing any signs. I'll have to try to catch him regardless and put him in QT for treatment, but I want to make sure I treat him for the right thing. I'm pretty sure it's ich but I'd like to confirm with the hive mind! Thanks!

Does not appear as ich and may be a simple sand grain BUT do keep an eye on it. Ich will move around a fish and multiply each 24 hours

 

[SallyWho]

Okay, I'll leave him where he is and see what kind of spot situation we have tomorrow. Thanks! If he has more spots then, should I freshwater dip him and put him in QT to start copper (I do have a copper Hanna checker)?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Okay, I'll leave him where he is and see what kind of spot situation we have tomorrow. Thanks! If he has more spots then, should I freshwater dip him and put him in QT to start copper (I do have a copper Hanna checker)?

tough to say if this is ich or not. Time will tell. If the spots come and go but genneraly increase in numbers from day to day, then it is ich.

You can skip the FW dip (unneeded stress) and just right into a coppersafe or copper power treatment at 2.25 ppm


Jay

 

[SallyWho]

tough to say if this is ich or not. Time will tell. If the spots come and go but genneraly increase in numbers from day to day, then it is ich.

You can skip the FW dip (unneeded stress) and just right into a coppersafe or copper power treatment at 2.25 ppm


Jay

So, uh, does Copper Power expire? I just checked my fish med drawer to make sure I had some, and I can't find an expiration date on the bottle. It's been tightly capped in a dark drawer though, so...maaaaaybe?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

So, uh, does Copper Power expire? I just checked my fish med drawer to make sure I had some, and I can't find an expiration date on the bottle. It's been tightly capped in a dark drawer though, so...maaaaaybe?

Good question - you may need to contact the company. The elemental copper itself won't expire, but it is bonded with an amine - and I don't know if that has an expiration date.

 

[SallyWho]

Well, it must not be ich because he doesn't have more spots after a couple days of close observation. Still has cloudy eyes and darker coloration, but eating all right. Wish those coupla few spots would disappear though- they make me nervous!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Well, it must not be ich because he doesn't have more spots after a couple days of close observation. Still has cloudy eyes and darker coloration, but eating all right. Wish those coupla few spots would disappear though- they make me nervous!

Be cautious - with ich's life cycle, it is very common for all of the trophonts to drop off at the same time at first (they are all on the same schedule). As the infection goes on, their timing becomes more spread out and you'll see increasing numbers of spots all of the time (if this is indeed ich).

 

[SallyWho]

Be cautious - with ich's life cycle, it is very common for all of the trophonts to drop off at the same time at first (they are all on the same schedule). As the infection goes on, their timing becomes more spread out and you'll see increasing numbers of spots all of the time (if this is indeed ich).

Thanks for the warning. I'll keep a close watch.

 

[SallyWho]

OPE. Hard to see them, but he's a little spotty today.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

OPE. Hard to see them, but he's a little spotty today.

If the spots come and go on a 24 to 36 hour cycle, it is most likely ich. Sand grains don’t stick around very long and other causes of white spots, like mucus plugs, tend to last longer.

 

[SallyWho]

Well, he's got me frustrated. He was looking particularly spotty two days ago, convincing me it was ich, so I moved him to QT and started dosing copper power. But the finny menace is so mad about being in QT that he does nothing but wear his angry colors and hide behind the sponge filter. He won't eat, and I can't see how the spots are progressing. I have to keep the lights low or else he tries to cram himself under the filter. He cares not a whit for the large PVC fittings and fake plastic plants. He was eating and swimming totally fine when I moved him. So now what? He needs to eat, and I need to assess his condition periodically.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Well, he's got me frustrated. He was looking particularly spotty two days ago, convincing me it was ich, so I moved him to QT and started dosing copper power. But the finny menace is so mad about being in QT that he does nothing but wear his angry colors and hide behind the sponge filter. He won't eat, and I can't see how the spots are progressing. I have to keep the lights low or else he tries to cram himself under the filter. He cares not a whit for the large PVC fittings and fake plastic plants. He was eating and swimming totally fine when I moved him. So now what? He needs to eat, and I need to assess his condition periodically.

Getting good photos for diagnosis is tough - I can't see enough here to make a clear diagnosis. Does the new tank have any sort of biological filtration? If not, that can be a problem. Do you have a test to check the ammonia level?

Ich won't cause a fish to stop eating until the disease has really progressed, and I don't see that here.

 

[SallyWho]

Getting good photos for diagnosis is tough - I can't see enough here to make a clear diagnosis. Does the new tank have any sort of biological filtration? If not, that can be a problem. Do you have a test to check the ammonia level?

Ich won't cause a fish to stop eating until the disease has really progressed, and I don't see that here.

He usually eats like a starving cat- I think he's just stressed as heck. There are a few palm-sized pieces of live rock rubble from my refugium in there to act as filtration (which will be discarded afterwards rather than added back, since I'm sure they'll be absorbing the copper). I'll pull out my old DSLR tomorrow and try to get a picture of him from across the room, but it'll still be under blues. The light fixture is older and designed for planted freshwater tanks so it only has three settings: off, blues, and blasting noon day sunlight. Even blocking the light with a towel over the glass lids doesn't keep him from trying to cram himself under the filter. But I'll do my best!

 

[SallyWho]

Getting good photos for diagnosis is tough - I can't see enough here to make a clear diagnosis. Does the new tank have any sort of biological filtration? If not, that can be a problem. Do you have a test to check the ammonia level?

Ich won't cause a fish to stop eating until the disease has really progressed, and I don't see that here.

I spent literally an hour being really quiet, patient, and squatting 10' away without a shred of dignity, and the only workable shots I got were these. The white spots are very fine and not easy to spot even in person. I circled the most visible areas. He's got one or two on his fins as well but I couldn't get a picture of those. And where there's white spots, there also appears to be tiny bumps? It reminds me almost of miniature pimples. If all he's got is acne, I'm going to laugh!

He ate a couple of pellets this morning, and after draping TWO towels over the glass lid to dim the light, he's out and swimming around. He acts totally normal! He's just lightly sprinkled with a few tiny white spots! I've been keeping a sharp eye on the other fish, and nobody else has shown any signs of illness.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I spent literally an hour being really quiet, patient, and squatting 10' away without a shred of dignity, and the only workable shots I got were these. The white spots are very fine and not easy to spot even in person. I circled the most visible areas. He's got one or two on his fins as well but I couldn't get a picture of those. And where there's white spots, there also appears to be tiny bumps? It reminds me almost of miniature pimples. If all he's got is acne, I'm going to laugh!

He ate a couple of pellets this morning, and after draping TWO towels over the glass lid to dim the light, he's out and swimming around. He acts totally normal! He's just lightly sprinkled with a few tiny white spots! I've been keeping a sharp eye on the other fish, and nobody else has shown any signs of illness.

In the second picture, there is a spot on the eye - that helps me confirm it is ich.

Regarding lighting - fish only need enough light to see their good by, your tank may be too bright to allow the foxface to feel comfortable. Can you reduce the level?

 

[SallyWho]

In the second picture, there is a spot on the eye - that helps me confirm it is ich.

Regarding lighting - fish only need enough light to see their good by, your tank may be too bright to allow the foxface to feel comfortable. Can you reduce the level?

It's just an on/off switch. I can add another towel between the light and the lid to further dim it. Thanks!

 

[SallyWho]

In the second picture, there is a spot on the eye - that helps me confirm it is ich.

Regarding lighting - fish only need enough light to see their good by, your tank may be too bright to allow the foxface to feel comfortable. Can you reduce the level?

Jay, I just read through the sticky thread re: ich management. I don't have the money to buy a UV filter or enough QT tanks to safely store & treat every fish for treatment while the display lies fallow. My recent leaky tank emergency proved that the tanks I have CAN hold every fish for maybe 2 weeks but not a one of them were happy about it (except the clowns, who did fine in a 10g). I'm treating the foxface with copper in QT already. Can I just do frequent water changes in the DT after stirring up the sand bed (to shake loose any ich forms hiding in there) and dose hydrogen peroxide? None of the other fish have shown any signs, but if one fish had it then they've all been exposed.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Jay, I just read through the sticky thread re: ich management. I don't have the money to buy a UV filter or enough QT tanks to safely store & treat every fish for treatment while the display lies fallow. My recent leaky tank emergency proved that the tanks I have CAN hold every fish for maybe 2 weeks but not a one of them were happy about it (except the clowns, who did fine in a 10g). I'm treating the foxface with copper in QT already. Can I just do frequent water changes in the DT after stirring up the sand bed (to shake loose any ich forms hiding in there) and dose hydrogen peroxide? None of the other fish have shown any signs, but if one fish had it then they've all been exposed.

Ich management has too many variables to be able to accurately predict how well it will work. In some cases, it doesn't work even if all methods are fully employed. In other cases, it works with just some of them in use. I guess, just try to do as many of the techniques as you can. Remember though - hyposalinity or coppersafe are both better treatments than "management" is.

 

[SallyWho]

Ich management has too many variables to be able to accurately predict how well it will work. In some cases, it doesn't work even if all methods are fully employed. In other cases, it works with just some of them in use. I guess, just try to do as many of the techniques as you can. Remember though - hyposalinity or coppersafe are both better treatments than "management" is.

Thanks! Out of curiosity, would using hyposalinity in conjunction with copper shorten the quarantine period for the foxface? A 29gal tank is pretty cramped for a 7" fish.