New Gyre knock off

[Falk]

Not everyone but I like to stick to the subject, title of this thread "New Gyre knock off"

I think my posts were relevant to the Gyre, Jebao and Intellectual property. Like the title of this thread.

 

[Rlynch818]

After my experience with the Gyre, this one couldn't possibly be much worse. My gyre lasted 3 weeks before motor died. Again, this is my experience only. I am sure other people have great success with them.

 

[Diesel]

I think my posts were relevant to the Gyre, Jebao and Intellectual property. Like the title of this thread.

I can say for 100% that you and I agree to disagree, I will leave it with that

 

[Falk]

I can say for 100% that you and I agree to disagree, I will leave it with that

I can say with 91.9% that you and I disagree because I am not even sure as to what. I am not pro Jebao by any means. I was just making points from my background as a patent attorney that most people do not understand what part of an invention is actually patented subject matter. The gyre (if a patent is granted) however, is pretty obviously an infringement since this is basically a clone and based on Maxspect's notice when the application published (Oct) Jebao is smart to wait to sell in US otherwise they would be liable for royalties from that date.

I also do not know who would pay $180 for the clone with no warranty.

 

[Diesel]

I can say with 91.9% that you and I disagree because I am not even sure as to what. I am not pro Jebao by any means. I was just making points from my background as a patent attorney that most people do not understand what part of an invention is actually patented subject matter. The gyre (if a patent is granted) however, is pretty obviously an infringement since this is basically a clone and based on Maxspect's notice when the application published (Oct) Jebao is smart to wait to sell in US otherwise they would be liable for royalties from that date.

I also do not know who would pay $180 for the clone with no warranty.

Now on that statement I agree for 91.9%.

 

[joshkirkland83]

I guess this warning is how they are getting around the patent issue.

Notice : CrossFlow Pump is NOT a WaveMaker ! You cannot using Normal WaveMaker compare with CrossFlow Pump. WaveMaker is create a wave on your tank in One Area (Very strong flow), but crossflow pump is generation a flow Only in your tank ! It;s will not very strong or create a wave in your tank! For Jebao RW15 Flow Gereration is more better than CP-40 on a center area! Do Not order if you not Agree on it

I can tell you 110% that i wouldnt run this thing in a puddle of water just based on this advertisement. None of the jebao crap is getting within 100ft. of my reefs.

 

[runzwithscissors]

Again with the Chinese knock offs. Granted, they may be infringing or they may not be (yep, in this case I may agree that they are pushing the boundaries). The only reason they may not be infringing are the rejection rate of about 98% of patents from USPTO.

I do run Jebao products in most of my tanks. That doesn't make me "anti American ". It makes it affordable for me to run 4 tanks instead of one.

If you believe the American produced products simply are the best.....PLEASE buy them. What many seem to ignore is that if the "alleged" knock offs are no good, then they will fail and people will return to buying "American" products.

A fair question is how many of these "American" products are made and assembled here in the US?

I have adopted the global economy. I have adopted the fact that China has been doing this for decades. I have adopted the reality that we are not going to change this practice. Granted it is a feel good moment to espouse buy American. But when I bought a car when my dad worked for General Motors, half of the parts were Canadian made (I love my Canadian neighbors) and it did not deter me from buying my "American" car.

Wavemakers have been out for years . For someone to now claim a patent on it seems a little absurd to me..

I spent many years in the Marine Corps. You will not find anyone more patriotic than I am. There is a reality check that we all need to go through, China is China..you nor I will affect what they do.

The handful of people who boycott their products are commendable. As for me, I am not ashamed to purchase what I believe to be best for me and my application.

Do the Chinese manufacturers press the infringement on patents? Certainly! Again, this has been going on for decades. Are their products better than US made? Nope. No argument from me there.

Two salient facts I believe we need to keep in mind. Patent infringement with China (most favored nation status) will keep them doing what they do. It's only our hobby, but many other products. Watch Shark Tank.....they espouse sending production to China for the cost.

Lastly, and on a personal note. I have a niece that is infected with the HIV virus. One of the drugs to inhibit AIDS was selling for $1.00 per pill. The "Most hated man In the world" bought that all important patent, a "patent"that many of you are touting, raising holy you know what for, and he raised the the price of that medication to $1,500.00. The decimal points are in the correct place. I pray for the day of a Chinese knock off.

 

[reefwiser]

The funny part is that the Jebao pumps are not that much cheaper than the Maxspect pumps. I learned years ago to buy the best and that means companies that supply customer support and repairs. I have Tunze skimmers that are 25 years old with the same pump running for 25 years. An I can still get parts. I am very watchful of the money I spend I work really hard to get it. That's 7 days a week and many 12 hour days doing difficult maintenance work. So when I come home I want equipment that is trouble free and reliable. I do not want to come home to issues. Did that years ago before I got start and started buying the best equipment on the market.

 

[runzwithscissors]

The funny part is that the Jebao pumps are not that much cheaper than the Maxspect pumps. I learned years ago to buy the best and that means companies that supply customer support and repairs. I have Tunze skimmers that are 25 years old with the same pump running for 25 years. An I can still get parts. I am very watchful of the money I spend I work really hard to get it. That's 7 days a week and many 12 hour days doing difficult maintenance work. So when I come home I want equipment that is trouble free and reliable. I do not want to come home to issues. Did that years ago before I got start and started buying the best equipment on the market.

Awesome! If you decide to upgrade can I get first dibs on them?[emoji39] always looking for the best at a good price!

 

[reefwiser]

I never sell my stuff. I just reuse them. I have been in the hobby since the age of 10 and 62 years old now.

 

[runzwithscissors]

Not quite as old, but started a few years prior. Love this obsession!

 

[runzwithscissors]

Not everyone but I like to stick to the subject, title of this thread "New Gyre knock off"

Unless I read the first post incorrectly (and I'm barely literate) the title did say what you quoted, and the first post said "Jebao did it again"

 

[runzwithscissors]

Just talked to a LFS owner in Houston and he told me that Jeabo can't import these to the US, thank God!

Fish steet store ships to the US, they sold out and are taking orders for March

 

[timkenagy]

For those that were following what I was saying.. Let's see if you get a response like this from Jaebo when you have issues with your knock off gyre pump..

 

[ksanfranfan]

*Sigh*
How do well managed companies deal with cheaper, lower quality clones? They either acquire a company to make cheaper versions of their products, or create a subsidiary. At some point almost every single premium brand does this. Litigating is the worst option. Litigating is best done only on products that share the same economic market segments.

A lot of successful startups, or smaller companies tend to believe that opening or buying a subsidiary dilutes their brand. In the real world. Dow Chemical produces to different market segments, microsoft, Apple, Exxon, GM, ext ext ext.

Gibson faced similar problems. Today if people want a gibson "clone" they buy an Epiphone. The Gibson example has been used in Colleges for decades. If people are copying your Premium product with lower quality versions, simply do the same under a subsidiary or acquisition company. The Epiphone drives sales of Gibson guitars, and the Gibson drives sales of the Epiphone. It is win win. It also prevents today's Jebao from becoming tomorrow's Samsung, or Nissan.

Someone may not be able to afford a Gibson today, but if they are going to play a cheaper version they want the one that is the next best thing. People may get a Epiphone now and in 10 years be in a different economic bracket and get a Gibson.

Gibson is made in the USA.
Fenders flagship guitars are made in the USA.

Both outsource cheaper versions, and prevent losing market share to clones. Those clones if given an opening will become the next Nokia, Samsung, Nissan, facebook ext and start eating your premium brands lunch.

Here is a simple test if you agree with me or not.

If Tunze got into the mid range market under a subsidiary and made a version of Jebao RW pumps, what brand pump would you want to buy, and what brand would you trust more in your tank. Tunze subsidiary or Jebao.

I usually don't comment in forums with a lot of debate. I would like to commend R2R for not supporting Jebao. It's one thing for a company to make a product that utilizes and produce similar functions as another product but it's another thing to out right copy and sell pretty much the same thing.
I agree with the statement Justiful made. I don't know everything that a company like Ecotech, for example has to go through as far as costs but I would think that there would have to be a way for them to make lower and mid end products. Not saying that they have to make cheap products. Since they first started they've come out with several revisions to their power heads and reduced the price on the old products before discontinuing them after they all sold out.
Obviously there were still a lot of people still willing to buy the previous models before the new quiet drive models. Although the previous models have a higher noise level I think many people would be willing to accept it for the type of product they are getting. These could be their mid range product lines. For a low range or entry level product they could reduce the features on some of their products. They could only have controllers that come with long and short pulse and continuos flow modes. Maybe no synchronization features to other products. Maybe they just don't want to be bothered with having to deal with having to too many product assemblies, I don't know. I do think that it would help. As some others have mentioned, there are going to be copy cat companies that try and under cut respective and innovative companies no matter what. Producing different product lines or subsidiaries but still maintaining a certain degree of quality and customer service makes it harder for other companies to compete.
I own Ecotech products myself as well as other quality products from reputable manufacturers. I feel bad for these companies that have to deal with companies like Jebao. I've seen products such as headphones being assembled in bedrooms of apartments in places like China in documentaries and being sold online as original pruducts to the U.S.
Anyways, I just thought that I would show my support for R2R not allowing the Jebao products to be recognized as a reputable product for our devoted hobbyists. Hopefully it will drive reputable companies to be more innovative and not less.

 

[barista88]

Thanks for all the info guys. Think it might be time to replace me jebaos

 

[Angler and Eels]

What's the GPH on the Jebao? I can't find it anywhere

 

[Diesel]

What's the GPH on the Jebao? I can't find it anywhere

That's a good question as nobody has the answer to that............. even jeabo

 

[Sabellafella]

Apparently this is working, Jeabo is keeping the knockoffs off the US market.

December 24, 2015
SENT VIA EMAIL ONLY
Re: U.S. Patent Application Publication No. 2015/0292507 A1
Title: CROSS-FLOW WAVE MAKING PUMP
By: Guangzhou Maiguang Electronic Science Technology Co., Ltd., d.b.a. Maxspect
Sheridan Law Ref. 81151.0001Dear Sirs:
Guangzhou Maiguang Electronic Science Technology Co., Ltd., d.b.a. Maxspect (hereinafter “Maxspect”) is the owner of a utility patent application, which includes claim coverage directed to a cross-flow wave making pump. As a reference, enclosed is U.S. Patent Application Publication No. US 2015/0292507 A1.

I note from two articles in ReefBuilders.com that industry intelligence indicates that Jebao Co., Ltd. or related entities have designed and may offer a Jecod CP-45, a Jecod CP-25, or other related equipment which is described and illustrated as a “Cross-Flow Wave Pump”. As a reference, enclosed are copies of the two articles as well as a portion of the website at the aboveidentified URL. This equipment may ultimately infringe one or more claims of the pending patent application of the above-identified U.S. patent application publication. Under the provisional rights provisions added to the Patent Act in 1999, a claimant can recover damages (after the patent issues) if it gives notice to the target of the claims after the pending application is published. See, 35 USC 154(d).

At this time, Maxspect would be pleased to discuss various options to provide you with the ability to avoid liability for infringement under provisional rights provisions related to the above-identified patent application. If you are of the opinion that you do not need to take any action at this time with Maxspect, it would be helpful if you could give us some insight into your reasons. Infringement may occur through making, using, or selling a product in conflict with the claims of the above-identified patent application publication. Maxspect may elect to seek damages from one or both of sellers or manufacturers of infringing products.

Please contact me at your earliest convenience to address this matter.

Sincerely,

James A. Sheridan Sheridan Law LLC



Better yet a friendly warning as in a "cease and desist letter" for the knockoffs to account holders from Maxspect/CV products is on it's place here.

unfortunantly they are getting shipped to the US . Fishstreet cannot ship to the US but i spoke to a bunch of people that already payed for them somewere else but are limited to what they can purchase. But $140 isnt worth it if you can tlk ur lfs into selling a gyre wholesale. They also cannot ship the wifi adaptment Nd are claiming "they have a innovated design of the gyre" witch is their excuse for all of this

 

[Sabellafella]

Its just wrong atleast with this. I dont kno much about patents and i happen to like maxspect. They spend crazy effort, time and money to get their manufacturing and patents finished with, but with any new technology wether or not it has to do with the hobby the people in china always have a nockoff, even if its patented in the US theyll make their way throught the black market