Clarification on UV “Clarifiers”

[Doctorgori]

1. Does anyone know if there is a functional or engineering difference between a UV “Clarifier” vs a UV “Sterilizer”? or is this a marketing thing or are they the same thing and the difference is just in the flow or volume
2. Can UV units be plumbed in “series” with thier functional efficiency being additive? in other words does 2ea 13W units plumbed in series effectively equal a 26W unit? (side note: I’m considering doing this for space and cost savings)
3. this is the unit Sicce UVC Clarifier ….Does anyone have one running on thier DT or QT? At this price and mfg (Sicce) , the cost of 3ea Sicce units is $450/39W …..$12/W ….might be worth it given the form factor, redundancy and perceived manufacture quality

Anyway, just looking for thoughts and opinions on “stacking” smaller UV units in “series” due to space limitations and take advantage of switching units on/of as needed
Edit: rather than adjusting flow, adjusting wattage…basically thinking 100GPH going through 3 units is the same as 33GPH through 1 unit …

 

[Malcontent]

No, there's no actual difference. The term is more of a counter-marketing term though.

According to the reasoning I commonly see online, two 13W units would only be as effective as a single 13W unit. Any microorganism that survives the first 13W unit instantly recovers its health without expending time or energy to repair the damage.

 

[Doctorgori]

Any microorganism that survives the first 13W unit instantly recovers its health without expending time or energy to repair the damage.

Hmmm, I’m not clear on how a UV actually sterilizes the organism. I thought it didn’t kill the bug per se but stopped it from reproduction..
So my thinking was exposing the pathogen or algae or whatever to more “bulb length” … more contact time….
OR is it bulb intensity/energy output that matters?

I’m asking…

 

[Malcontent]

Damage to DNA and RNA and other things. They can induce cell death or damage its replicative machinery beyond repair. Whether that's killing or sterilization depends on how you define whether a cell is dead or alive.

In reality, it should be pretty similar to a single 26W unit but most people would think that doubling flow rate and halving exposure time would be the same thing as halving wattage.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Agree, mere manufacturer term as some will aim at the unit eliminating cloudiness and algae outbreaks calling it a clarifier. In essence, its a Sterilizer which obtains same capabilities.

 

[blecki]

Close enough? There's some point where none of those estimates make sense - these organisms aren't wearing sunscreen in the wild and survive just fine there.

I'd just be wary of the 'clarifyiers' sold for fresh water tanks as the salt is so effective at blocking UV that you need an order of magnitude more power. The sterilizer on my reef is rated for swimming pools... believe you're going to get more bang for your buck and better effect buying one big Aqua Ultraviolet model - the cost/watt scales down quite a bit as they get larger.

 

[Doctorgori]

Appreciate that…and appreciate any input on this idea, here is a picture of the unit:

Supposedly this unit is submersible also. I have larger Red Sea units also that could use a sterilizer. So a few of these plumbed in series might fit in the sump and allow simpler plumbing free from leak worries….

 

[Doctorgori]

Close enough? There's some point where none of those estimates make sense - these organisms aren't wearing sunscreen in the wild and survive just fine there.

I'd just be wary of the 'clarifyiers' sold for fresh water tanks as the salt is so effective at blocking UV that you need an order of magnitude more power. The sterilizer on my reef is rated for swimming pools...

gheez, I don’t blame you… Ive must have purchased 5 Amazon Chinese based units from Amazon; none made it past 2 - 6 mos. …. and unbeknownst to most people: every UV purchase is really a annual “subscription” for purchasing replacement quartz sleeves, o rings and UV bulbs…. so you best check out mfg parts availability before buying (that’s a service announcement ) lol

 

[blecki]

Right. So. Like lights, pumps, etc - you can buy the cheap thing off amazon for lets say $100 and have it last a year or two. Or you can buy the expensive one for $300 and have it last ten*. I don't believe Aqua Ultraviolet is going anywhere soon - and their bigger units are made out of standardized PVC parts so they are fixable. Much safer bet that I will be able to get sleeves and bulbs for them in the future. They might be pricey up front but they have a lot of benefits by virtue of their primary business strategy NOT being undercutting other manufactures in the aquarium space. (They are a swimming pool UV company first.)

* Does not apply to powerheads in my experience. I can't get any of them to last more than a couple years. Kind of frustrating actually.

 

[threebuoys]

gheez, I don’t blame you… Ive must have purchased 5 Amazon Chinese based units from Amazon; none made it past 2 - 6 mos. …. and unbeknownst to most people: every UV purchase is really a annual “subscription” for purchasing replacement quartz sleeves, o rings and UV bulbs…. so you best check out mfg parts availability before buying (that’s a service announcement ) lol

UV sterilizers/clarifiers are really very basic as you know. The bulbs are pretty much interchangeable between different brands as long as the wattage and size of bulb are the same. All are a cylinder with an inner quartz sleeve to protect the actual bulb. Exposure time is the biggest factor, so the effectiveness of several in series would be additive.

I see you've had problems with some of the chinese brands, but I have been very pleased with my experience. $80 - $100 for a 36 watt has been perfect for me. My guess is all of the units are produced in China in the first place. I do change my bulbs about once a year. I've had two running for 3+ years.

 

[MnFish1]

1. Does anyone know if there is a functional or engineering difference between a UV “Clarifier” vs a UV “Sterilizer”? or is this a marketing thing or are they the same thing and the difference is just in the flow or volume
2. Can UV units be plumbed in “series” with thier functional efficiency being additive? in other words does 2ea 13W units plumbed in series effectively equal a 26W unit? (side note: I’m considering doing this for space and cost savings)
3. this is the unit Sicce UVC Clarifier ….Does anyone have one running on thier DT or QT? At this price and mfg (Sicce) , the cost of 3ea Sicce units is $450/39W …..$12/W ….might be worth it given the form factor, redundancy and perceived manufacture quality

Anyway, just looking for thoughts and opinions on “stacking” smaller UV units in “series” due to space limitations and take advantage of switching units on/of as needed
Edit: rather than adjusting flow, adjusting wattage…basically thinking 100GPH going through 3 units is the same as 33GPH through 1 unit …

Yes - dosage of UV as compared to the size of the tank. Some bacteria may be much more sensitive to UV (I.e. a bloom) - as compared to algae. I'm going to make a comment that I don't want to cause controversy. I think UV can be useful, but difficult to clean, and to insure it's doing anything. Many people have crystal clear and ich free tanks without them

 

[Gellisjr1]

1. Does anyone know if there is a functional or engineering difference between a UV “Clarifier” vs a UV “Sterilizer”? or is this a marketing thing or are they the same thing and the difference is just in the flow or volume
2. Can UV units be plumbed in “series” with thier functional efficiency being additive? in other words does 2ea 13W units plumbed in series effectively equal a 26W unit? (side note: I’m considering doing this for space and cost savings)
3. this is the unit Sicce UVC Clarifier ….Does anyone have one running on thier DT or QT? At this price and mfg (Sicce) , the cost of 3ea Sicce units is $450/39W …..$12/W ….might be worth it given the form factor, redundancy and perceived manufacture quality

Anyway, just looking for thoughts and opinions on “stacking” smaller UV units in “series” due to space limitations and take advantage of switching units on/of as needed
Edit: rather than adjusting flow, adjusting wattage…basically thinking 100GPH going through 3 units is the same as 33GPH through 1 unit …

To answer your first question. Yes there is a significate difference between a UV Clarifier and a UV Sterilizer when advertised or marketed correctly. The simple answer is the measurement of ultra violet light & radiation level output used.

UV Clarifiers work in the UV-A light spectrum or wavelength of light. Ultra violet light emits a radiation level measured in Nanometers and UV-A ranges from 315-400 Nanometers and has a longer wave length. Clarifiers are less expensive units compared to a sterilizer of the same wattage rating. Because these have a weaker radiation level they cannot kill off bacteria or pathogens but will kill off free floating algae.

UV-Sterilizers operate in the UV-C light spectrum or wave length of light. Ultra violet light radiation emitted in this light spectrum ranges from 100 - 280 Nanometers, has a shorter wave length. This spectrum is nearing X Ray level wave lengths and much more dangerous to humans. This level of light is emitted from the sun and is filtered out with the Ozone layer of the Earths atmosphere. So this level of light does not naturally reach the Earth surface. W/O Ozone layer we would all become French fries.

If you add a second UV Sterilizer in series it will still only be a 13 Watts. However putting a second one in series will only double the water exposure time to the UV's radiation. If your tank size requires a 26 Watt unit just use a single 26 Watt unit with the flow rate from the pump set correctly. Manufacturers will list the optimal flow rate for the UV sterilizer / clarifier being used. The flow rate will determine the contact time the water stays inside the sterilizer being effected by the radiation killing off bacteria, pathogens & free floating algae inside. The best way to measure flow rate is with a flow meter that can be plumbed into your aquarium plumbing on the manifold output side to the sterilizer. These are great additions if you have an aquarium controller such as an Apex or Hydros unit. A DC powered flow pump is tunable and can mathematically be figured out to a percentage or general flow rate. For example If you have a pump that will flow 500 Gph in theory should be close enough 75% = 375 Gph, 50% = 250 Gph and 25% = 125 Gph and can be further reduced to get a more accurate Gph flow rate that will actually do what it is supposed to do.

Don't get caught up in the marketing jargon and read the specifications and you will know if its a clarifier or an actual sterilizer that your buying.

 

[Doctorgori]

@Gellisjr1 that was thorough and had enough bandwidth for novice and intermediate levels.
I thought a few mfgs sorta played loose with the term but the UV-A vs UV-C draws a hard line..

Thank you

 

[Gellisjr1]

@Gellisjr1 that was thorough and had enough bandwidth for novice and intermediate levels.
I thought a few mfgs sorta played loose with the term but the UV-A vs UV-C draws a hard line..

Thank you

You are very welcome. My pleasure.

 

[Trillaman954]

You are very welcome. My pleasure.

Well what about a UV-“C” clarifier ?

 

[Gellisjr1]

Well what about a UV-“C” clarifier ?

What about a UV-C exactly? Please read my entire explanation above I covered both UV Sterilizer & UV-Clarifiers and what the difference is.

 

[Trillaman954]

What about a UV-C exactly? Please read my entire explanation above I covered both UV Sterilizer & UV-Clarifiers and what the difference is.

I purchased this product. Which claims it’s a in clarifier but uses Uv-c not uv-a

 

[Gellisjr1]

Sicce does not list any technical data about the light spectrum of the included bulb on the web sight. They do claim that it does have a UV-C bulb to kill off free floating algae, bacteria and pathogens. However with out specs on the specific bulb used, I would have to say IMO this is only a clarifier and not a true sterilizer. Given it's price point and stating, "Clarifier" on the box. The UV-C rating, I would say is a marketing gimmick w/o proof other wise.

 

[FishOkay]

Sicce does not list any technical data about the light spectrum of the included bulb on the web sight. They do claim that it does have a UV-C bulb to kill off free floating algae, bacteria and pathogens. However with out specs on the specific bulb used, I would have to say IMO this is only a clarifier and not a true sterilizer. Given it's price point and stating, "Clarifier" on the box. The UV-C rating, I would say is a marketing gimmick w/o proof other wise.

Huh, your really very wrong. Both Clarifiers and Sterilizers use UVC. Using UVA would be absolutely pointless for either uses. No clarifier is going to use a UVA bulb in it lol.
Also if a company says it uses UVC Germicidal bulbs and it turns out it isn't. It isnt just a marketing gimmick, it's straight up false advertising/marketing of their product and could get them in trouble. As it literally wouldn't do anything they claimed.

 

[Gellisjr1]

Prove me wrong. I've done my research.