Experience with algae scrubbers

[BanjoBandito]

I've had two or more algae turf scrubbers. They are usually DIY waterfall ones. Id rather grow the algae on that screen than in my display. Lol.
D

See I’m pretty sure that’s a myth. I didn’t have algae in the DT with or without it. More reefing scare tactics. When @Paul B shows back up he’ll tell you no algae in your display is bad. ‍

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

I grow red algae like macros in my display yes. Hair algae no

 

[mindme]

…if I rolled my eyes any harder they’d come out of my skull. I’ve done ICP tests from duplicate samples, same company and gotten different results. Unless you know how and when they calibrate then just send me money and I’ll make stuff up.

Yeah, so what? The notion that they need to be exact in the first place is in itself enough for me to roll my eyes.

You're just looking for something to complain about, because every single test in the world has a margin of error.

Oh no, it said I had 0.05 phosphate instead of 0.03. Ridiculous.

 

[mindme]

I would argue healthy reefs with full coral coverage don’t have algae,

This is extremely wrong.

 

[mindme]

See I’m pretty sure that’s a myth. I didn’t have algae in the DT with or without it. More reefing scare tactics. When @Paul B shows back up he’ll tell you no algae in your display is bad. ‍

I think it's just that most people have enough clean up crew in their DT that is appears like there is no algae in the tank.

If you looked at my tank you'd say it has no algae, but the refug is growing etc. But there is algae in my DT, it's just taken care of by the clean up crew faster than it can grow.

I'm not sure how anyone could not have algae in their DT unless they are using lots of algaecide.

 

[BanjoBandito]

Man, it’s late…I’m tired. This thread is beyond my initial requests - which was to quantify experiences with scrubbers with comparison numbers. I’m not interested in an internet fight right now @mindme if you’d have read the thread you’d know my phosphates have been .4-.3 and my scrubber running 18 hours - 24 hours a day for about two months have failed to budge my nutrient numbers. You’d also know that this is not what has been “advertised” by scrubber companies. Also, everyone is stating things they can’t back up. Also, apparently per Turbo scrubbers can remove trace elements that aren’t being tracked at a rate that normal water changes cannot replace leading to “phantom crashes” and other problems. I don’t have algae minus a few “tufts” in my display regardless of the skimmers photo period. I’m arguing full on GHA plague like Paul posted are not being prevented by scrubbers in the display at this point as this is not my experience. I’m sorry if I’ve come off wrong or you’ve misunderstood my original questions. I appreciate your internet gusto, but I really don’t have time for it. Message me and I’ll give you my phone number and we can hash it out offline, but this isn’t productive.

 

[mindme]

Man, it’s late…I’m tired. This thread is beyond my initial requests - which was to quantify experiences with scrubbers with comparison numbers. I’m not interested in an internet fight right now @mindme if you’d have read the thread you’d know my phosphates have been .4-.3 and my scrubber running 18 hours - 24 hours a day for about two months have failed to budge my nutrient numbers. You’d also know that this is not what has been “advertised” by scrubber companies. Also, everyone is stating things they can’t back up. Also, apparently per Turbo scrubbers can remove trace elements that aren’t being tracked at a rate that normal water changes cannot replace leading to “phantom crashes” and other problems. I don’t have algae minus a few “tufts” in my display regardless of the skimmers photo period. I’m arguing full on GHA plague like Paul posted are not being prevented by scrubbers in the display at this point as this is not my experience. I’m sorry if I’ve come off wrong or you’ve misunderstood my original questions. I appreciate your internet gusto, but I really don’t have time for it. Message me and I’ll give you my phone number and we can hash it out offline, but this isn’t productive.

Algae isn't the biggest deal. My 180g as I said has what looks like 0 algae, but on my 29g anemone tank, I just let the algae grow and harvest it about once a month for nutrient export. This is about 2 weeks since the last harvest, algae every where. Unless it's smothering your coral, it's just an eye sore...although I am surprised at how many people actually like the algae and the way it flows in the tank.

Stuff doesn't need to be exact or difficult. I haven't done a test on this tank in over 2 years outside salinity.

 

[BanjoBandito]

Again, I appreciate your comments but you can’t quantify anything. No testing means you can’t give solid facts when discussing nutrient reduction. We aren’t even quantifying “algae”. Is it macro? Is it ogra? Sea lettuce? GHA? What algae is “bad”? What algae is the scrubber preventing? How many people run a scrubber AND a refugium? Again, according to scrubber manufacturer pages and BRS this should be and can be a backbone system for nutrient reduction. All I’m saying is that in my experience that is a lie. I’m attaching a photo of my current tank that I tried to use a scrubber on as primary filtration (outside a skimmer) for reference.

 

[mindme]

Again, I appreciate your comments but you can’t quantify anything. No testing means you can’t give solid facts when discussing nutrient reduction. We aren’t even quantifying “algae”. Is it macro? Is it ogra? Sea lettuce? GHA? What algae is “bad”? What algae is the scrubber preventing? How many people run a scrubber AND a refugium? Again, according to scrubber manufacturer pages and BRS this should be and can be a backbone system for nutrient reduction. All I’m saying is that in my experience that is a lie. I’m attaching a photo of my current tank that I tried to use a scrubber on as primary filtration (outside a skimmer) for reference.

Ok Karen.

 

[BanjoBandito]

Ya, zero respect.

 

[mindme]

Ya, zero respect.

If you just want to sit around and complain and refuse to accept any information that stands in the way of your crying, be my guest.

Meanwhile, you saw my results.

And before Paul comes in talking a bunch of nonsense. I started my tank with dry rock/sand and a bottle of bacteria. Added the 2 clownfish with the bacteria, and added the anemone 2 weeks later. This what the anemone looked like 2 years ago when I added it.

 

[Glenner’sreef]

i run a icecap x large it fills up in 5 days lol

I’m purchasing the IceCap medium this week. Any tips? Thx.

 

[BanjoBandito]

If you just want to sit around and complain and refuse to accept any information that stands in the way of your crying, be my guest.

Meanwhile, you saw my results.

And before Paul comes in talking a bunch of nonsense. I started my tank with dry rock/sand and a bottle of bacteria. Added the 2 clownfish with the bacteria, and added the anemone 2 weeks later. This what the anemone looked like 2 years ago when I added it.

…what are you talking about? Tell me your agenda….what is this about? This is a scrubber post and you are talking about cycling dry rock and adding a nem….? I’m lost. Can you quantify for me the actual results from an algae scrubber being run in your tank or not?

 

[mindme]

…what are you talking about? Tell me your agenda….what is this about? This is a scrubber post and you are talking about cycling dry rock and adding a nem….? I’m lost. Can you quantify for me the actual results from an algae scrubber being run in your tank or not?

As I have told you multiple times, I do not run an algae scrubber. I do however allow the algae to grow in my anemone tank as a way of exporting nutrients the same way an algae scrubber would.

If this method was not properly removing the nutrients, my anemones would be dead as I rarely do water changes.

So if you want me to "quantify" it for you. My tank > Your tank.

And if you want your DT to not have algae, then buy a clean up crew.

I find very few things more annoying than people who demand high standards from everyone else and only use it as an excuse to avoid information.

 

[guysmiley]

I’m purchasing the IceCap medium this week. Any tips? Thx.

get some algae from your tank and scratch up your surfaces with coarse sand paper along the whole side of each plastic netting and smear it into it so algae spores are over it try to keep your lights on for 18 or so hours it creates a wicked mat = )

 

[Garf]

If you don't believe the results it's likely because you are being anal about them.

You obviously have no idea what I was on about.

 

[Paul B]

Also….I’m gonna call BS on “algae adding chemicals to the water”, they are great bacteria and micro fauna nurseries but adding chemicals? Huh? Can you back that up?

That is a definite "maybe". I would have to look through a very old book written by a chemist
"Guido Huckstead" "Water Chemistry for the Advanced Aquarist". But I choose to not do that right now as I have a big boating weekend starting in a few hours.

Like all my "advice" or criticisms, just do what you feel is right for you. I personalize like algae but not growing on my corals.

Have a great weekend.

 

[Paul B]

Just something interesting about algae on reefs.

The Importance of Algae on the Reef​

By Travis Burke. Last edited by Marios Alexandrou.
Table of Contents

• Which coral reef species eat the algae?
• What adaptations do these herbivores have for their diet?
• What is the effect of herbivores on the algae?

The bright sunshine of the tropics is great news for the group of mainly microscopic plants called algae. They prosper, especially in shallow waters, and as they photosynthesize, they produce sugars that attract herbivores to feast on them. Some species of algae grow as a covering on underwater substrates, but others, such as diatoms, live freely in the water column. Each type is food for reef animals, some of which have become highly specialized to reap this rich harvest. Compared with other marine environments, coral reefs have more than their fair share of plant-eating fish, and although only around one in five of these species is herbivorous, as many as half of all fish on a reef, measured by weight, may be herbivores.

Which coral reef species eat the algae?​

There are plenty of different types of herbivorous fish on coral reefs, including surgeonfish and representatives from other families — there are algae-eating damsels, blennies, butterflyfish, and angelfish. Compared to other food sources, algae is fairly low in nutrients, so grazing fish have to spend a proportionately greater amount of their day eating. Fish are not the only herbivores on the reef, either. Among the invertebrates, sea urchins are perhaps the most important of the grazers, along with a range of snails, shrimps, and even some hermit crabs.

What adaptations do these herbivores have for their diet?​

Grazing fish usually have deep, laterally compressed bodies and strong pectoral fins that allow them to maneuver around the reef and to hold station while they graze on the algal turf with their tails raised. These fishes usually have fairly small mouths and bite their food off the substrate with small, incisorlike, flat-edged teeth. Many carnivorous fish, on the other hand, suck in their food and then grind it up with the pharyngeal teeth found at the back of the mouth. To extract the most from their food, many herbivores have bacteria in the gut that help to break down the otherwise indigestible parts of the algae. Sea urchins rasp at the algal turf in a similar way to the fishes, although their mouth and tooth structure is very different. Snails, too, rasp at the algae with a specialized tonguelike structure called a radula, which scrapes against the substrate like a biological belt sander.

What is the effect of herbivores on the algae?​

The pressure on algae is intense. On shallow reefs, it has been calculated that herbivores make over 100,000 bites every day on every square foot of the substrate. In the process, the grazers can remove virtually all the algae that grows there. It might seem to be bad news for the algae but this is not entirely true. On reefs where for one reason or another there are few herbivores, the algae grows unchecked into thick covering layers. In these conditions, a handful of algae species take over; driving all others out of the habitat. Grazers have the effect of preventing these dominant algae species from taking over, allowing the other algae species to keep a foothold. The grazers benefit as well; the dominant algae species are among the least nutritious, so by keeping them in check and creating the conditions that allow other species to grow, the algae as a whole provides them with a better meal.

 

[BanjoBandito]

Thanks @Paul B ! Enjoy your boating adventure. I'll poke around the name/info you gave me and see if I can produce anything. I'm serious about going diving!

 

[Paul B]

Something about the chemicals released by algae:

'Taste' and 'smell' of coral reefs provide insights into a dynamic ecosystem​

(You can read the entire "Scientific article" from a few months ago this year

'Taste' and 'smell' of coral reefs provide insights into a dynamic ecosystem

Hundreds of molecules that are made by important members of the coral reef community were recently discovered by a team of scientists. Together, the compounds--modified amino acids, vitamins and steroids -- comprise the 'smell' or 'taste' of corals and algae in a tropical reef, and will help...

www.sciencedaily.com

February 2, 2022Source:University of Hawaii at ManoaSummary:Hundreds of molecules that are made by important members of the coral reef community were recently discovered by a team of scientists. Together, the compounds--modified amino acids, vitamins and steroids -- comprise the 'smell' or 'taste' of corals and algae in a tropical reef, and will help scientists understand both the food web dynamics and the chemical ecology of these ecosystems.

Together, the compounds -- modified amino acids, vitamins and steroids -- comprise the "smell" or "taste" of corals and algae in a tropical reef, and will help scientists understand both the food web dynamics and the chemical ecology of these ecosystems.

Although coral and seaweeds (limu) are fixed to the seafloor, these organisms interact via chemicals dissolved in the water. Despite knowing the importance of these molecules built during photosynthesis and released into the seawater environment, their quantity, energy content and structural diversity have always been a mystery to biologists.

Perhaps more importantly for reef food webs, the work showed that the combination of molecules released into the water by seaweeds were more chemically reduced.

Haas explained "Algae potentially provide more energy to bacteria in the reef than do corals, with implications for how increasing algae on reefs alters the transfer of energy through microbes into larger organisms in the reef ecosystem."