Uronema becoming big problem these days? (Aside from chromis)

[4FordFamily]

Well,

This giant quarantine batch has found a rare foe— or I thought rare at least.

Unless you’re a chromis or occasional butterfly you (or at least I have) never given a second thought to uronema. Admittedly I’ve mostly dismissed it until now aside from chromis and butterflies.

Now I’m having flashbacks to fish losses over the past 6 months. I started a large flame angel group and within days lost 11/12 and two butterflies. On a red fish it was tough to ID the culprit. I finally saw it on a fish yesterday. Classic red “slash marks” and everything starts to make sense. This was moving at a pace much faster than I remember for uronema. Some died within 24 hours. I thought we had a killer fish in quarantine, but we watched hours of video and NO aggression. I feel pretty dumb as my experience has led me to uronema in the past— I just didn’t think it common in other fish.

Hopefully we’ve contained it, but what an ordeal. It took out three wrasse, 11 flame angels, and two butterflies. In fairness, one or more of these fish may have died from something else, as they came direct from QM and I’ll publically admit I’m starting to wonder very much about the quality of their livestock.

As I reflect back I’ve lost a couple regal angels to similar symptoms. We blamed on infections, and they may have been as those are bad too now.

We are starting to see brook on fish other than clownfish on occasion as well now. It’s rough out there folks. I HIGHLY recommend you not toss fish in your DT unquarantined right now.

So @HotRocks and I are now seasoned ich, velvet, bacterial infection, and uronema veterans. Bacterial infections have grown exponentially over the past 6 months in our opinion (we quarantine a ton of fish) but I’m starting to wonder if Uronema is to blame for some of this. In fact, I highly suspect it is.

Just thought I’d share our struggles and observations so others can learn. We quarantine a large number of fish between all of our tanks and now stocking my 500G wall tank we are really in the trenches. It’s tough out there.

Is anyone else having similar issues?

This is an article about Uronema by the real seasoned fish disease master, @Humblefish.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/uronema-marinum.247940/

 

[Big G]

Rescued a small Foxface from a tank at Petco 5 weeks ago. The tank contained several mixed aggressive Chromis with active uronema symptoms. Knew the lone Foxface was a goner, so took him home and immediately treated him prophylactically for uronema as it wasn't showing symptoms yet. Happy to report, so good so far. But man that was hard to watch. The poor fish was in a very bad place. The Petco employee just shrugged when I pointed out the fish were all diseased and said "oh, is that what that is?" Yikes! :mad:

 

[4FordFamily]

Rescued a small Foxface from a tank at Petco 5 weeks ago. The tank contained several mixed aggressive Chromis with active uronema symptoms. Knew the lone Foxface was a goner, so took him home and immediately treated him prophylactically for uronema as it wasn't showing symptoms yet. Happy to report, so good so far. But man that was hard to watch. The poor fish was in a very bad place. The Petco employee just shrugged when I pointed out the fish were all diseased and said "oh, is that what that is?" Yikes! :mad:

A local LFS I rescued 4 fish from yesterday. A copperband I couldn’t turn down because it was eating voraciously and very large, a magnificent foxface, Caribbean blue tang, and a small Desjardini Sailfin tang. I couldn’t help it I was able to help them and I wanted them anyway.

But there was a purple tang there so badly afflicted with velvet, see photo below. I’m sure the fish I bought have it too but I’ll give them a chance. The store assured me this purple would survive because he is “in copper” (an amount they could not inform me because they didn’t know). After an argument with them and offering to buy it for a tiny fraction of the $180 they wanted I gave up. I’m sure it’s gone now

 

[Big G]

Man, that is really hard to watch. You know that tang had a shot at survival if you could just get it home. Hard to understand why they wouldn't or couldn't do the right thing. Awesome for the other fish

 

[4FordFamily]

Man, that is really hard to watch. You know that tang had a shot at survival if you could just get it home. Hard to understand why they wouldn't or couldn't do the right thing. Awesome for the other fish

I agree. That’s some of the worst velvet I’ve seen. The fish was wobbly and not able to easily keep itself upright. It was on its last leg.

 

[Humblefish]

I bet many fish are asymptomatic carriers of brook and velvet; since both diseases are rarely treated for prophylactically.

 

[Fastpitch]

Wow. I am starting to realize I am way out of my league. I am currently in my second quarantine with 5 (now 4 chromis) and a coral beauty.

I think I am regretting ever buying these chromis. At first I thought my first loss was stress from the GC + cupramine together. @Humblefish advised it was probably uronema and to treat immediately with metro. Never guessed that since the fish looked great until his final moments.

Now tonight, I look in on them, and two more have a strange shadow color (almost grey) on the exact tail half of their body. I have metro on order but wont arrive for two days.

So now I threw third round of GC in. What else can I do? Do I really want to put my DT at risk for these diseased vermin? What a headache.;Sour

 

[Humblefish]

So now I threw third round of GC in. What else can I do? Do I really want to put my DT at risk for these diseased vermin? What a headache.;Sour

A formalin or Rally bath can buy you some time. Or even a 5 min FW dip. Whenever I get chromis, I prophylactically treat for uronema starting on Day 1. I even feed metro soaked food daily because the disease can also spread internally.

 

[Fastpitch]

A formalin or Rally bath can buy you some time. Or even a 5 min FW dip. Whenever I get chromis, I prophylactically treat for uronema starting on Day 1. I even feed metro soaked food daily because the disease can also spread internally.

A formalin or Rally bath can buy you some time. Or even a 5 min FW dip. Whenever I get chromis, I prophylactically treat for uronema starting on Day 1. I even feed metro soaked food daily because the disease can also spread internally.

Only thing in my medical bag is GC, Cupramine, Focus and useless Paraguard. Looks like FW dip wins this round.

Once I get through this, that QT is getting nuked.

Rookie

 

[Big G]

Only thing in my medical bag is GC, Cupramine, Focus and useless Paraguard. Looks like FW dip wins this round.

Once I get through this, that QT is getting nuked.

Rookie

Jim, I know this will provide little solace, but even if the Chromis all initially survived, they have a really nasty habit of picking each other off one at a time until there is only one left. Kind of a "Highlander" "There can be only One" thing. So be of good cheer. Every day in this hobby you will learn something new.

 

[ZachR32]

I’ve seen multiple batches of QM anthias come in now and die within a couple days with the only symptoms similar to Uronema over the last 6 months. Never was able to confirm it, and honestly not sure of this disease in Anthias, but was the only culprit I could determine

 

[Fastpitch]

Jim, I know this will provide little solace, but even if the Chromis all initially survived, they have a really nasty habit of picking each other off one at a time until there is only one left. Kind of a "Highlander" "There can be only One" thing. So be of good cheer. Every day in this hobby you will learn something new.

No doubt.

 

[AbnormalReefer]

Yikes. Does that mean it’s a HUGE risk to add more chromis to my existing 4 established and healthy chromis? I had 5 but one succumbed to uronema. However, that was back in September. Everyone else has not had it since.

 

[Maritimer]

I’ve seen multiple batches of QM anthias come in now and die within a couple days with the only symptoms similar to Uronema over the last 6 months. Never was able to confirm it, and honestly not sure of this disease in Anthias, but was the only culprit I could determine

I suspect that anthias are among the more susceptible fish, along with Genicanthus (and possibly other?) angelfish.

~Bruce

 

[4FordFamily]

Yikes. Does that mean it’s a HUGE risk to add more chromis to my existing 4 established and healthy chromis? I had 5 but one succumbed to uronema. However, that was back in September. Everyone else has not had it since.

Seems to skip over some fish. I hypothesize that either the disease is becoming more deadly or the distribution system has worsened such that fish cannot fight it off any longer. I used to have chromis succumb and other fish remain asymptomatic. It seems no more. Sad state of affairs, really heartbreaking, and really frustrating.

Treat them with metroplex first and feed metroplex and “focus” soaked foods for 14 days and they will be free of uronema.

 

[4FordFamily]

I suspect that anthias are among the more susceptible fish, along with Genicanthus (and possibly other?) angelfish.

~Bruce

Yes I highly suspect that uronema is to blame for a lot more deaths than I thought. I was attributing a lot to bacterial infections (which are legit as well), but I am really starting to piece all of this together. It seems like one day there are no obvious symptoms and the next the fish is dead with one to two red “slashes” on the side and a stripe of redness above and below. Classic uronema.

I didn’t really consider it a threat since I didn’t keep chromis. Wrong I was!

 

[Rython]

It's definitely rampant in anthias. I've lost several anthias and a couple of wrasses that were co-QTd with anthias to suspected uronema.

 

[cancun]

Wow! I was following along! I am sorry about all the fish you guys lost! It makes you scared to even buy fish right now.... even if you QT the fish and they get it which is horrible for the fish, they die and you are out your money also....! That can get really expensive quick.... especially when you are talking Flame Angels and Regal Angels.

Out of curiosity....if it kills that fast why doesn't most of the fish deaths occur at the wholesaler....or at the very least the LFS? Or does it take longer in some fish species to develop and eventually kill the fish?

 

[User]

A local LFS I rescued 4 fish from yesterday. A copperband I couldn’t turn down because it was eating voraciously and very large, a magnificent foxface, Caribbean blue tang, and a small Desjardini Sailfin tang. I couldn’t help it I was able to help them and I wanted them anyway.

But there was a purple tang there so badly afflicted with velvet, see photo below. I’m sure the fish I bought have it too but I’ll give them a chance. The store assured me this purple would survive because he is “in copper” (an amount they could not inform me because they didn’t know). After an argument with them and offering to buy it for a tiny fraction of the $180 they wanted I gave up. I’m sure it’s gone now

[emoji3525][emoji3525][emoji3525]

I offered my local petco $20 for a YT with HLLE. It looked really bad, abd wasn’t eating. They refused, sticking with the $60 tag, because “that’s the sku, and it’ll perk up in a bigger tank” Three days later, they offered it fir $30, but it was motionless in the tank when we went to bag it. Didn’t even move when the guy picked it up. I’m pretty sure they just tossed it in the trash. Disgusting.

Is $180 typical for that size purple? I have a 3” reserved for $85

 

[4FordFamily]

Wow! I was following along! I am sorry about all the fish you guys lost! It makes you scared to even buy fish right now.... even if you QT the fish and they get it which is horrible for the fish, they die and you are out your money also....! That can get really expensive quick.... especially when you are talking Flame Angels and Regal Angels.

Out of curiosity....if it kills that fast why doesn't most of the fish deaths occur at the wholesaler....or at the very least the LFS? Or does it take longer in some fish species to develop and eventually kill the fish?

The short answer is that they keep the fish in low level medications to keep it at bay. In this case it could be metroplex. I know they do this with copper. Then they send the fish in med-free water and the ailments worsen quickly.

It could also be that the fish move in and out so quickly that the week it can take for it to “take over” is almost up by the time the bags arrive.

Also according to my LFS they’ve been losing fish at a much higher rate recently. Another LFS told me that fish are arriving very unhealthy about 50% more than over the past several years. He’s the manager of our biggest LFS in Indianapolis (The Reef). They’ve started quarantine because they said they really had no choice. I asked about his procedures the only that concerns me is it’s primarily observation for wrasse. But it’s a move in the right direction.