Why do people buy expensive ATO?

[santeeeyyy]

So, this might just prove how clueless I am, but I have to ask: Why are people shelling out $200, $300, or more for Auto Top-Off (ATO) systems? A quick search at BRS shows all the popular options: Smart ATO, ATO+, and a bunch of other fancy-sounding names. But at their core, these are just level sensors, a water pump, and maybe a leak sensor. Sometimes, two sensors.

Yet, they still don’t include a salinity sensor, or any "smart" feature to differentiate between topping off with RO or saltwater. You’re still manually ensuring your freshly made saltwater is at 1.026. So, what exactly are we paying for? Is it the marketing? The sleek design? The peace of mind? Snake oil?

Before you roast me, let me explain my setup. I’ve got a continuous automatic water change hooked up to my Apex. My salinity probe decides whether the top-off should use RO or saltwater to maintain levels within hi/lo sensor ranges. It’s been running flawlessly -- 2 years on my current tank and 5 years on my previous build—and it keeps salinity in check (within reason). Sure, I keep an eye on the salinity probe for bubbles and occasional recalibrations, but it’s been reliable and low-maintenance.



Pictures for proof:

And programming is quite simple literally:

So, seriously, what am I missing? Is there some magic feature I’m overlooking? Or is it just my approach that’s a bit “DIY unconventional”? Feel free to call me daft I’m genuinely curious what makes these systems worth the price for so many reefers.

I am a simple man, I spent 20 bucks on used ATO's, Got a JBL for like 5 bucks and a duetto ATO for 20. the dual sensors are really nice and it has memory where itll know how long to RO water go and if it overextends itll shut up and beep to let me know if its ok to keep going or somethings wrong

 

[Reefering1]

I have my rodi connected to a float valve. Into its 9th year now, never cleaned, never malfunctioned. Eats di resin but I deal with it.

 

[GARRIGA]

Considering the price of a one inch frag. What's another $300 spent on a reliable ATO?

 

[subodhs]

Considering the price of a one inch frag. What's another $300 spent on a reliable ATO?

When you say it like that... I'm speechless. (or poor or both). Very true.

 

[PharmrJohn]

Yeah, I'll be spending some $$ on it for a reliable pump and sensors. Also, I want it to look good. I figure I'm spending a small fortune on this upcoming build do what's another couple hundred bucks in the whole scheme of things......

 

[X-37B]

I have used Tunze for a long time.
I'm running 3 Ozmolator 3's which is their newest model.
Its well worth the $200 and comes with a 5 year warranty.
For the reliability it's worth the price, imo.

 

[iReefer12]

Not saying they do or don't make a great sensor as I've never used one, but your 14 year old sensor may be far superior than what they're producing today. Or it may be that their sensors are the same now as they were then.

I’m pretty sure they are the same now as they were back then. It’s pretty simple device using the pressure sensor.. I’ve bought a couple more since then for a frag tank and a skimmer overflow sensor. They make a nice product.

 

[Tamberav]

I would not trust a salinity probe.

I have the expensive tunze ATO but it is 10 years old now and older then the current Apex. My old Apex Jr didn't even come with a salinity port but pretty sure I had the ATO before I ever had a controller.

 

[ShakeyGizzard]

I decided on going cheap also, I use the EYEBALL method with just a small fraction of GUESS. I have a skimmer container (overflow) that collects my skim mate since the drain is at the bottom of the cup. I measure the amount in the overflow since its saltwater when it collects, then add a little for the water removed by my filter roller and add this salt water back to the sump. My gravity ATO with float valve covers evaporation. Salinity is remarkably stable. I do need to add a complex relay, $16 shut valve, and float switch to the skimmer container supply line to cover an adverse event of skimmer flooding if no one is home.

skimmer container

 

[petcellar]

So, this might just prove how clueless I am, but I have to ask: Why are people shelling out $200, $300, or more for Auto Top-Off (ATO) systems? A quick search at BRS shows all the popular options: Smart ATO, ATO+, and a bunch of other fancy-sounding names. But at their core, these are just level sensors, a water pump, and maybe a leak sensor. Sometimes, two sensors.

Yet, they still don’t include a salinity sensor, or any "smart" feature to differentiate between topping off with RO or saltwater. You’re still manually ensuring your freshly made saltwater is at 1.026. So, what exactly are we paying for? Is it the marketing? The sleek design? The peace of mind? Snake oil?

Before you roast me, let me explain my setup. I’ve got a continuous automatic water change hooked up to my Apex. My salinity probe decides whether the top-off should use RO or saltwater to maintain levels within hi/lo sensor ranges. It’s been running flawlessly -- 2 years on my current tank and 5 years on my previous build—and it keeps salinity in check (within reason). Sure, I keep an eye on the salinity probe for bubbles and occasional recalibrations, but it’s been reliable and low-maintenance.



Pictures for proof:

And programming is quite simple literally:

So, seriously, what am I missing? Is there some magic feature I’m overlooking? Or is it just my approach that’s a bit “DIY unconventional”? Feel free to call me daft I’m genuinely curious what makes these systems worth the price for so many reefers.

I had some troubles with ATOs for my build that I documented in my build thread. I ended up programming a DOS to do the ATO function for me and thus far has worked flawlessly for my situation. I've been really pleased.

Certainly wouldn't recommend getting an Apex just for an ATO, or even a DOS.... seems like it's really under utilizing the value of the pump for this use case. However, I had a head free and thought I'd give it a try.

I think that your set up is very intriguing. However, I've had trouble with bubbles causing erratic conductivity readings with my Apex, and feel like I'd have to watch it like a hawk if I tried this.

I was wondering if you could elaborate a little more on the programming for your AWC and ATO. I guess that VNEEDSALT and VNEEDRO are virtual outlets? How do you incorporate this into your auto water change program?

Sorry if it's a dumb question, but I'm still a bit new at this.

 

[Pridedcloth3]

Sounds like a solid system.

Let's break it down! As a comparison to my ato.

You say you're using an apex, sooo let's throw $600 for a used one.
I don't use an apex. But needed an Ato. So I paid $200 for an ato.

If I had an apex system, I would potentially look into a similar set up. Digging deeper still... you mention RO or saltwater. So now two Buckets of water rather than a single. I barely have space for one!

Additionally I prefer to buy/use specifically built items. No diy etc unless broken etc. So this answers the ease of use.

Essentially you answer your own question

Cost/overall need. Size/space limitations. Personal knowledge/diy ability.

You created a solution that fits your need nice product!

Dude I got my a3 on ebay for 300 last year. Then spent another 30 for the pmup v2. To add to it I find used working a2/3 all the time on ebay for around the same price as the jr new. Then as far as setup goes neptune is great at walking you through everything, even taking control of your pc and showing you exactly what to do while doing it for you.

 

[AydenLincoln]

To be honest...your set up looks way more complicated than any standard ATO's avaliable.

Remember these are designed to be stand alone - ie...tanks that are not running a controller like an APEX which is unaffordable to a lot of reefers.

This!^ I was like wait but he has an Apex lol! Which is 10x more complicated than a plug and set ATO.

 

[Cichlid Dad]

For me it's a pretty vital piece of equipment and I need piece of mind. I've seen to many posts and heard too many stories of cheap ATO's not working or dumping a ton of water into the system. I have a Tunze and as long as I keep the optic sensor clean and check the float for debris it hasn't failed. I like the two built-in safeties.

 

[klc]

I may be the unicorn here but I still use a litermeter for top off. It took me a few days to determine exactly how much evaporates then I started adjusting the daily dose until it was stable. I only have to adjust for seasonal changes maybe once or twice, and that is just an additional liter or subtracting a liter, I'm only at 7 liters a day so not a lot.

I used to use a Kamoer ATO that worked well, then I came into possession of a litermeter so I began using that instead.

 

[Bmr4Reef]

I think the OPs initial question was why spend big bucks for a sensor and a pump.

It didn't help when he introduced his setup. Not to mention using the conductivity probe to determine when and if to top off with saltwater.

I share OPs position in that I never once understood why people spent so much for a sensor and pump.

For the longest time, I used a single relay triggered by a set of float switches to correct for evaporation. The relay controlled 110v outlet that turned on and off a pump. That's essentially the same concept of most stand alone ATOs. However instead of paying upwards of $200, the same thing can be achieved with a few things off of the internet for a substantial fraction of cost.

Exactly. OP started off good then went off the deep end with his overly complex setup. His initial point still stands if you ignore his system.

I run a $70 AutoAqua Smart ATO Lite that uses an optical sensor. At first I kept a bucket inside the cabinet but would forget to refill it and it was also annoying to manage. So I ditched the stock pump and wired the sensor's output to a 12v relay that turns on a diaphragm pump in my basement which pulls directly from my Rodi tank which refills on its on through my Rodi filter. I haven't touched my ATO since I installed that basement pump 18 months ago. When I do water changes I open and close a couple valves and use the same pump to refill the tank with salt water also from the basement. I set an alarm to remind me to flip the valves back when its done. One day I'll upgrade to electronic valves like I have on the Rodi filter output line (I don't let the Rodi filter run overnight even though the tank has a float valve).

 

[Paul B]

I don't know, I think I built my ATO for about $15.00 and that was probably 25 years ago. It's still working and I never had to do any maintenance on it.

 

[GARRIGA]

I don't know, I think I built my ATO for about $15.00 and that was probably 25 years ago. It's still working and I never had to do any maintenance on it.

But inflation adjusted today that be like $150

 

[Gumbies R Us]

I have a TUNZE nano osmolator and don't regret getting one. It works great, and it has always been reliable for almost two years. I have it, so I don't mind it being a little more expensive.