40 Gallon Breeder Stocking

[zaekor]

So, I decided to quit the freshwater community and move on to saltwater. I guess freshwater lost its appeal to me once I started looking into saltwater. So, soon I will be getting a forty gallon acrylic aquarium off craigslist. It comes with a ten gallon sump and some live rock that I will most likely just not use and buy my own. It is going to be a mixed reef system and I would like to know what I should stock it with. I know I definitely want to do a nice cleaner crew and definatley some inverts, since I loved shrimp with freshwater. I also would like to do at least two Clownfish, a pair of course, and maybe a watchman goby. I need more ideas for fish stock, though. If you have any suggestions, please say them and maybe a suggested stocking lost for the cleaner crew, inverts, fish, or whatever you have advice on.
Thanks!
Mitch

 

[Reefrookie220]

Welcome to saltwater and r2r!

Me personally my clean up crew would be 24 hermits a shrimp and a few turbo snails.

As far as fish including your clowns and goby (get him a shrimp partner) I'd get a wrasse for sure, and a fuzzy dwarf lion fish!


Of course all this would be over the course of a month or 2 !

 

[zaekor]

I had no clue there was DWARF lion fish
Awesome, I will look into the wrasse and lion fish, I had heard of wrasses, but never really looked into them. Yea, I was going to cycle the tank for a month or two before I even put any fish in it. Is a month or two good enough? or should I wait a little longer? Also, 24 hermits, isn't that a little much? What kinds? Does it make a difference? By shrimp I meant cleaner shrimp, the big ones with the huge whisker things, that should be fine with the watchman goby right?
Thanks,
Mitch
P.S. Sorry for all the questions, haha.

 

[zaekor]

Also, on live aquaria it says dwarf lion-fish need a minimum of 50 gallons because they can get up to 7 inches. Is this fine, or should I not do the dwarf lion fish?

 

[melypr1985]

I had no clue there was DWARF lion fish
Awesome, I will look into the wrasse and lion fish, I had heard of wrasses, but never really looked into them. Yea, I was going to cycle the tank for a month or two before I even put any fish in it. Is a month or two good enough? or should I wait a little longer? Also, 24 hermits, isn't that a little much? What kinds? Does it make a difference? By shrimp I meant cleaner shrimp, the big ones with the huge whisker things, that should be fine with the watchman goby right?
Thanks,
Mitch
P.S. Sorry for all the questions, haha.

Dont do the dwarf lion, stick with smaller fish that you know arn't going to be tempted to eat each other.
He meant a pistol shrimp for the goby. They often pair up and make a neat team.
check out the carpenters wrasse or fairy or flasher wrasses. All have great color and movement.
Bangaii cardinals are cool too.

If you think 24 hermits is too much then you could always start with 12 and add more later if you want to.

You'll want to wait until your cycle has finished establishing itself before adding livestock. Here's a great link for your research on how to start up. http://reef2reef.com/threads/the-supreme-guide-to-setting-up-a-saltwater-reef-aquarium.138750/ I know @KJ has some really great graphics on the nitrogen cycle that he will post.

 

[steve&mari]

http://m.liveaquaria.com/product/aquarium-fish-supplies.cfm?c=15+2124 Welcome and gobies and blennies are cool, firefish, wrasse, all are nice fish for a 40. Hopefully we'll get some pics of your setup.

 

[zaekor]

Thanks for all the replys. Can I still do a cleaner shrimp with a pistol shrimp? They won't kill each other, right? I think I will just start out with 12 hermits and go up form there. I really like gobies, so I definately want to do the watchman. I like the look of the lion, but I don't know if I am going to do it. I will look into those wrasses, thanks melypr.
Thanks!

 

[zaekor]

Hopefully I will get some pics once it is setup in a couple of months. I still have to get the tank though, the craigslist seller is being a little slow on responding, though.

 

[KJ]

Dont do the dwarf lion, stick with smaller fish that you know arn't going to be tempted to eat each other.
He meant a pistol shrimp for the goby. They often pair up and make a neat team.
check out the carpenters wrasse or fairy or flasher wrasses. All have great color and movement.
Bangaii cardinals are cool too.

If you think 24 hermits is too much then you could always start with 12 and add more later if you want to.

You'll want to wait until your cycle has finished establishing itself before adding livestock. Here's a great link for your research on how to start up. http://reef2reef.com/threads/the-supreme-guide-to-setting-up-a-saltwater-reef-aquarium.138750/ I know @KJ has some really great graphics on the nitrogen cycle that he will post.

Section 5: The Cycle

image via rusticgirls

In a freshwater aquarium you can add some flake food, wait a couple weeks, and then you can add fish. In the ocean there is much more involved than mechanical filtration. In fact, 70% of your aquariums filtration relies on the maturity of the live rock. A combination of bacteria, algae, and various invertebrates compose the “live” part of the rock. It takes quite a while to establish an ecosystem, even on a microscopic level. Without a proper understanding of the Marine Cycle, you will be in for a long term battle with parameters and algae. There are six main stages to a properly cycled tank. Follow this guide and you cannot mess up. You will need your basic test kit to test the progress.

Stage 1: Ammonia Cycle

Ammonia is the first thing that forms when something rots. It is a waste product in nearly all creatures as well. Instead of using a fish to start the cycle just use some food. Anything that is all natural and uncooked works just fine. Table shrimp that is uncooked works great. Drop it on the sand so it is in view. The shrimp should begin to rot within a couple hours or more. Let this shrimp rot until it is completely gone. If you are curious what your ammonia levels are, go ahead and take some tests. Keep track of the results as the shrimp rots. The smaller the food gets the more ammonia should be present in your water column and pretty soon should be off the charts. This will stay high for a while, but then start to drop. As soon as the ammonia starts to drop you will see a rise in Nitrite, you are now on the next stage.

Stage 2: Nitrite Cycle

Ammonia when broken down by bacteria becomes Nitrite, which is still a toxin. As your Nitrites rise your Ammonia will drop, drop, and keep dropping as long as you haven’t added any animals. Keep up with testing to observe your progress. Eventually your Ammonia will be very low and your nitrites will peak out until it starts feeding a different type of bacteria that turns it into Nitrates. Once your first signs of Nitrates are seen you are on the next stage.

Stage 3: Nitrate Cycle

Nitrates are removed within the live rock deep inside in all of the deep pours. This hidden bacteria consumes the nitrate and creates nitrogen gas as a byproduct. The nitrogen gas rises in the water column and escapes into the air. When one gas leave, another enters. Oxygen is then infused into the water. After the Nitrates start to dissipate your oxygen will increase and you will be ready for the intermission:

 

[melypr1985]

Section 5: The Cycle

image via rusticgirls

In a freshwater aquarium you can add some flake food, wait a couple weeks, and then you can add fish. In the ocean there is much more involved than mechanical filtration. In fact, 70% of your aquariums filtration relies on the maturity of the live rock. A combination of bacteria, algae, and various invertebrates compose the “live” part of the rock. It takes quite a while to establish an ecosystem, even on a microscopic level. Without a proper understanding of the Marine Cycle, you will be in for a long term battle with parameters and algae. There are six main stages to a properly cycled tank. Follow this guide and you cannot mess up. You will need your basic test kit to test the progress.

Stage 1: Ammonia Cycle

Ammonia is the first thing that forms when something rots. It is a waste product in nearly all creatures as well. Instead of using a fish to start the cycle just use some food. Anything that is all natural and uncooked works just fine. Table shrimp that is uncooked works great. Drop it on the sand so it is in view. The shrimp should begin to rot within a couple hours or more. Let this shrimp rot until it is completely gone. If you are curious what your ammonia levels are, go ahead and take some tests. Keep track of the results as the shrimp rots. The smaller the food gets the more ammonia should be present in your water column and pretty soon should be off the charts. This will stay high for a while, but then start to drop. As soon as the ammonia starts to drop you will see a rise in Nitrite, you are now on the next stage.

Stage 2: Nitrite Cycle

Ammonia when broken down by bacteria becomes Nitrite, which is still a toxin. As your Nitrites rise your Ammonia will drop, drop, and keep dropping as long as you haven’t added any animals. Keep up with testing to observe your progress. Eventually your Ammonia will be very low and your nitrites will peak out until it starts feeding a different type of bacteria that turns it into Nitrates. Once your first signs of Nitrates are seen you are on the next stage.

Stage 3: Nitrate Cycle

Nitrates are removed within the live rock deep inside in all of the deep pours. This hidden bacteria consumes the nitrate and creates nitrogen gas as a byproduct. The nitrogen gas rises in the water column and escapes into the air. When one gas leave, another enters. Oxygen is then infused into the water. After the Nitrates start to dissipate your oxygen will increase and you will be ready for the intermission:

Thanks @KJ! Exactly what i was talking about. You rock!

 

[KJ]

YW

 

[zaekor]

Guys, I know about the nitrate cycle. I said I have been doing freshwater for a while now. I was really into planted tanks, but I want to try something different.
I just didn't know if you need to wait a bit longer than you do on freshwater. I was going to do live sand, dry rock, bio spira and cycle with pure ammonia.

 

[zaekor]

Should I put in like one piece of live rock, or just wait for everything to replenish on the dry rock and just cycle normally with the ammonia.

 

[jadwv2210]

For a cleaner crew I like snails as well as crabs. I know the crabs can sometimes go nuts on the snails for their shells but the diversity is cool.

For the rock, you can use a piece of already established live rock from the original owner's tank to seed the tank with bacteria. You will also be adding anything that person had in their tank to your new tank. I personally don't like that risk but there is nothing inherently wrong with it.

Your other option is to use only dry rock and cycle with ammonia as you stated. Just add the dry rock and put some ammonia in the water an wait. I think the rule of thumb is if your tank can process 3ppm of ammonia into 0ppm ammonia and 0ppm nitrite within 24 hours then your tank is ready for a fish.

 

[melypr1985]

Guys, I know about the nitrate cycle. I said I have been doing freshwater for a while now. I was really into planted tanks, but I want to try something different.
I just didn't know if you need to wait a bit longer than you do on freshwater. I was going to do live sand, dry rock, bio spira and cycle with pure ammonia.

I'm sorry. I only wanted to share that because when that's complete you can start adding animals slowly. Since that was your question I figured it was an appropriate answer. I apologize for any offense, I was just trying to help.

 

[zaekor]

It's fine melypr, you didn't cause me any offence, I don't get offended easily. I just didn't explain myself enough, it was my fault. Sorry. Also, any chance of doing a starfish? I think that would be pretty cool for a detritus, right? What is that, exactly? There wasn't any of that in freshwater, is it some sort of algae or bacteria? Thanks. I would like to have a star fish if it is possible because I think that they are pretty cool looking, although I don't know too much about them. All I know is that they are pretty much reef safe and that they are detritus removers. Also, I am going to add the cleaner crew first, then a week or 2 later the inverts (shrimp, ornamental crabs) and then a week or two later a clownfish or two, then the rest of the fish each week or whatever. Thanks for your guys help, any more reccomendations are welcome

 

[zaekor]

Hey, also, in my schedule for adding stuff, I forgot to include when I was going to add corals. Do you think I should add those before inverts or after inverts, or even after fish? People have different opinions on this, but I was planning on adding these a week before inverts. Thanks, mitch

 

[jadwv2210]

Detritus is the word for waste. Fish poop, uneaten food, etc.

For starfish some are reef safe and other are coral eaters. Most are very difficult to keep from what I understand. A brittle star or a serpent star is an easy to keep reef safe starfish. These may not appeal to you though. Some of the serpent stars get very large and one species may eat fish if I recall correctly. You should research starfish more and get other opinions though because I'm far from informed on starfish.

As far as I know there is no order in which things need to be added to the tank. As long as you are testing your water and verified your tank can effectively process ammonia into nitrate then you can add anything you want. The plan of clean up crew, corals, inverts, and then fish sounds fine to me. I have heard from many sources though that when it comes to adding fish you should never add more then double the amount of fish already in the tank within a month. I.E add two clowns, wait a month, add two more fish and so on.

 

[zaekor]

Thanks for the info, jadwv! Those were actually the stars I where looking into, I really love the look of the thin, long arms/legs/things of the brittle or serpent starfish. I will do a bit of research on those.

 

[zaekor]

Also, how fast should I add the coral? I don't know if produce any ammonia, but it just sounds like a bad idea to introduce them all into an aquarium at once.