Another PH Dilemma

[flyfisher2]

Okay so I had a long chat with CB at Neptune regarding the low PH issue and despite the independent results using liquid test kits which show PH consistently at 8.0 he feels that the Probe reading at 7.6 ish is accurate. In his explanation he said that liquid test kits have a tendency to read lower than PH probes and are therefore not accurate as accurate.
I tried to understand the logic behind this and went with it. As a precaution Neptune is swapping out the probe but Cb expects that the replacement will read the same. I wish to thank Neptune and CB personally for the time, patience and professionalism in handling this matter.
If this is accurate and I strongly believe it very well may be, I am not at all comfortable with my PH hovering between 7.5 and 7.6
I have since mixed a one gallon container with two measured teaspoons of Kalkwasser and it tested with the probe at exactly 12.4 after it settled. This I did to test the probe in water with an expected known value.
Another issue that I'm wondering about is the effect of Seachems Acid Buffer to lower ALK in my make up water In following another thread where it was recommended as a way to lower Alkalinity in freshly made water. I add roughly one teaspoon to 30 gallons when I use it and aerate heavily for 24-48 hours before the water change. When I check the PH with Salifert it checks at 8.0 to 8.1 Could the chemical composition of the Acid Buffer in the makeup water be affecting the tank and lowering or not allowing the PH to rise longterm ?

 

[GarrettT]

Added co2 scrubber this morning. Highly recommend. The PH probe is accurate.

 

[ZombieEngineer]

Okay so I had a long chat with CB at Neptune regarding the low PH issue and despite the independent results using liquid test kits which show PH consistently at 8.0 he feels that the Probe reading at 7.6 ish is accurate. In his explanation he said that liquid test kits have a tendency to read lower than PH probes and are therefore not accurate as accurate.
I tried to understand the logic behind this and went with it. As a precaution Neptune is swapping out the probe but Cb expects that the replacement will read the same. I wish to thank Neptune and CB personally for the time, patience and professionalism in handling this matter.
If this is accurate and I strongly believe it very well may be, I am not at all comfortable with my PH hovering between 7.5 and 7.6
I have since mixed a one gallon container with two measured teaspoons of Kalkwasser and it tested with the probe at exactly 12.4 after it settled. This I did to test the probe in water with an expected known value.
Another issue that I'm wondering about is the effect of Seachems Acid Buffer to lower ALK in my make up water In following another thread where it was recommended as a way to lower Alkalinity in freshly made water. I add roughly one teaspoon to 30 gallons when I use it and aerate heavily for 24-48 hours before the water change. When I check the PH with Salifert it checks at 8.0 to 8.1 Could the chemical composition of the Acid Buffer in the makeup water be affecting the tank and lowering or not allowing the PH to rise longterm ?

The acid buffer could definitely be at least part of the issue. If you do continuous AWC or do water changes in small batches, you don't need to worry about the alkalinity being high in make up water. If you do large batches, you might want to consider a different salt brand that has your desired parameters as mixed without adjustment needed.

 

[flyfisher2]

The acid buffer could definitely be at least part of the issue. If you do continuous AWC or do water changes in small batches, you don't need to worry about the alkalinity being high in make up water. If you do large batches, you might want to consider a different salt brand that has your desired parameters as mixed without adjustment needed.

I had begun to do larger changes in order to lower nitrates .
I’ve since succeeded and I’m now under 10ppm from 50ppm a couple months ago.
As it stands I’ll attempt to go back to 10 percent weekly. In which case I’d not be concerned with the ALK.

 

[flyfisher2]

Added co2 scrubber this morning. Highly recommend. The PH probe is accurate.

Please keep us updated as to how long the media last for you.

 

[GarrettT]

Please keep us updated as to how long the media last for you.

I’ve always had a co2 scrubber, but I temporarily took my skimmer offline. The graph just shows once I put it back into production. As you can see, this morning the overall dip was substantially less. I get a couple months out of it before it needs to be refilled. This is on a 200g system. I do have a Lifereef skimmer that recirculates the air and helps the media last longer.

 

[flyfisher2]

I’ve always had a co2 scrubber, but I temporarily took my skimmer offline. The graph just shows once I put it back into production. As you can see, this morning the overall dip was substantially less. I get a couple months out of it before it needs to be refilled. This is on a 200g system. I do have a Lifereef skimmer that recirculates the air and helps the media last longer.

I'm really reading all I can about this and have my reservations. I'vs come close to pulling the trigger and then I hear people say, "Don't worry about your PH, it's fine where it is" And then you ask them about their tank and it's at 8.2 LOL
My daytime high yesterday was 7.70 going by the PH probe.
I want consistency. I'm concerned about raising my Alk through the roof and stressing my SPS. I'm stressed out by this and want to do it right If doing it at all is the way to go.

 

[GarrettT]

people say, "Don't worry about your PH, it's fine where it is" And then you ask them about their tank and it's at 8.2 LOL

Exactly

Many don’t fully understand the underlying reasoning. When they say don’t worry about ph, which has become an overly broad statement nowadays, they’re generally mirroring what knowledgeable people have told them. However, It was in relation to bring a 8.1 to 8.4ph for faster growth, not about stability of an overly low ph! At 7.7ph your dKh will just continue to rise without being utilized.

 

[ZombieEngineer]

Exactly

Many don’t fully understand the underlying reasoning. When they say don’t worry about ph, which has become an overly broad statement nowadays, they’re generally mirroring what knowledgeable people have told them. However, It was in relation to bring a 8.1 to 8.4ph for faster growth, not about stability of an overly low ph! At 7.7ph your dKh will just continue to rise without being utilized.

The more correct statement is don't try to chase pH. If it's in the range 7.8 to 8.5 you don't gain much by focusing on changing it and many hobbyists crash their tank trying to get pH exactly a specific value because they don't realize that they made their tank 15+ alkalinity to do so.

Making sure your tank is in that broad range is worthwhile and necessary but you will gain little to nothing by focusing a bunch of energy trying to make a 7.9pH tank 8.3.

 

[flyfisher2]

Exactly

Many don’t fully understand the underlying reasoning. When they say don’t worry about ph, which has become an overly broad statement nowadays, they’re generally mirroring what knowledgeable people have told them. However, It was in relation to bring a 8.1 to 8.4ph for faster growth, not about stability of an overly low ph! At 7.7ph your dKh will just continue to rise without being utilized.

I understand your statement yet that's not what I'm seeing in the tank. Corals are encrusting and growing well. Keep in mind this is an acro dominant tank and not showing the non utilized ALK.
When I look at it from that point is when I question the results obtained.

 

[GarrettT]

I have an acro dominate tank as well. When my ph drops below 7.8, my Alk will not lower, only rise. Even if I shut off my carx and kalk, my alk will not drop. I question how accurate your readings are, especially if your highest ph reading is 7.7. Thats very low.

 

[flyfisher2]

I know, this is stressing me out. Lets wait and see what the new probe shows once it gets here. The 2 Saliferts and the API 8.0 reading seem to make more sense based on the coral growth, and appearance of the tank overall. That 7.6- 7.7 really isn't making sense.

 

[flyfisher2]

I ordered a Kamoer X1 Pro T and was all set to start Kalkawasser. Spent the night reading on how to connect this thing to my internet. I tried everything.The sun came up and guess what? I'm sending it back.
Very disappointed. In this day and age things shouldn't be this complicated. Plug and play is the standard.