Going fallow and QT'ing all fish Questions

[Humblefish]

OK, and I am assuming this would be counterproductive then causing the ammonia to rise from the dead bacteria.

The dead bacteria probably wouldn’t contribute much to an ammonia spike, you’d just be wasting your money.

What you can do is seed more media in a bucket with no medication in the water. Add Microbacter7 to that for at least a few days (5-7 days would be better), and then add this media to your biofilter. The nitrifying bacteria will be entrenched in the media, and their numbers will be able to withstand copper long enough to adapt & repopulate a more resistant strain.

 

[Cjud7982]

Looks like 0.25 to me, but can you take another photo outside? Under natural light?

I took a couple pictures of the copper test today after about a 65% water change to bring ammonia down. Its pretty rare to get a good sunny day in western new york this time of year and today I finally got one. I took a one with a shadow from my face and another one without a shadow on the colors. I think I am at .25 still. Which is the target. please if anyone can confirm I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[Humblefish]

@Cjud7982 Going mainly off the first photo, I think you are at 0.25 ppm.

 

[Cjud7982]

@Cjud7982 Going mainly off the first photo, I think you are at 0.25 ppm.

Thank you for your input! that makes me feel better because all along this is what my color samples look like in the tank and in my replacement water for water changes. I have been doing approximately 50 to 60% water changes every 3 days or so to keep my ammonia as low as possible.

Now, I have noticed one thing. The other night I noticed my yellow tang is showing some signs of hlle, at least that is what I think it is. I read your thread https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/hlle-head-lateral-line-erosion.259916/ about it and apparently this is rather normal? My purple is also showing some signs as well, some white developing around the nose and around the eyes. I have attached a picture of my yellow because his symptoms seem a little different. Sorry for it being blurry, hes fast and I am terrible at taking close up pictures of fish. It looks like there are pores around his eyes and up the bridge of his nose that are dilated. very visible in person. I have never seen them before. I feed a few square inches of algae sheets, along with lrs reef frenzy and frozen mysid shrimp soaked and rinsed in selcon everyday. In the pictures, it is the darker spots around his eyes. I am probably being paranoid and your thread says that it should go away during recovery. Just wanted to see what your thoughts were, because this is the first I have ever seen for myself potential hlle. I am assuming this is because he isn't happy with the confinement of qt, and the lack of freely eating algae of the rocks in the display.

 

[Humblefish]

@Cjud7982 Fish exposed to copper will often develop HLLE. Fortunately, it usually clears within a few months (post copper) if you maintain good water quality and soak the fish food with a vitamin supplement: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/vitamins-herbal-remedies.304287/

 

[Cjud7982]

well i just looked into my qt to feed some algea sheets and noticed spots on one of my clown fish and my yellow tang is showing a couple spots as well. I have not needed to do any water changes over the last couple weeks because my ammonia had leveled out at 0 and my copper level was right on point the entire time, atleast .25ppm of cuprion according to my salifert test. So I was trying to wait until end of copper to do a large water change and add carbon. I have 5 days left of copper. if this is ich still, I am about to rip my hair out. Is this normal for ich to occasionally reoccur within the 30 days of copper? maybe flukes? I did a methylene blue/freshwater dip on the tangs prior to qt, but not my clowns. attached is a picture of one of the clowns, a few spots behind her stripe and a couple on her forehead. The tang has a couple small spots on his tail fin and one on his left just below his lateral line... the tang picture is not good, but the best I can do with my phone right now, he is fast lol. any insight would be greatly appreciated. I thought that everything was going so well until just now.

 

[Cjud7982]

Well the more I look at the fish the more I am doubting it is ich. The spots on my tangs tail fin make me think lymph, and the spot on his side is protruding out more than I've ever seen ich and has sort of a clearish white color. The spots on the clown look slightly elongated and the one spot on his head has a brownish color to it. So I am thinking flukes maybe? I plan on finishing up the copper treatment and removing the copper then doing a prazi treatment. Then observe, if anything else shows up I may just commit to 30 more days using cp rather than copper. Does this seem like the best plan of attack? I do plan on doing a last freshwater sip prior to going into display after being clear for 4 weeks. That is if I ever get there lol. Sorry for my last post sounding angry, It just seems that every time I think I am getting somewhere I notice something else :/

 

[deedubz]

It just seems that every time I think I am getting somewhere I notice something else :/

I'd say you don't even know, but you clearly do. I'm still battling my never ending qt(did ttm/hypo for flukes/ich and now ramping up copper for velvet). These parasites will definitely cause premature aging and the human equivalent of HLLE.... hole IN the head disease.

Aside from the spots, are they exhibiting any symptoms? If it was ich or velvet the 30 days should have taken care of it..unless somehow the range dropped below therapeutic. Before you dose anything I'd recommend a freshwater dip. That'll tell you if you need to treat with prazi or not. In the event it is something else and you needed to start copper again you really wouldn't want the prazipro already in the water

 

[deedubz]

I apologise. I thought this was post 30 days. Nonetheless, the copper should have prevented free swimmers from attaching..I think

 

[Cjud7982]

I apologise. I thought this was post 30 days. Nonetheless, the copper should have prevented free swimmers from attaching..I think

Yeah that is what my thoughts were as well. I think I am going to watch the clown to see if the spots resemble the normal life cycle of ich. If not, then I will do a fw dip to see if it is flukes. The white spot on the tang looks to be mostly gone as of today. Which is good news I think. End goal of this is to have a sterile display tank.

 

[Maritimer]

Copper should, indeed, prevent free-swimmers from re-infesting.

Once your 30 days is up, best to clear the copper outta there . . .

~Bruce

 

[Cjud7982]

thank you @Maritimer for your response. I just got caught up on your thread about your qt and fallow period and am terribly sorry for what is happening. This hobby is tough, but we all have the determination to keep going and do the best for our tank friends. I know I have learned a lot from you, and if there is anything I can offer I will try.

@dwwataz, I havent noticed any other signs on my clown other than what was described. No scratching, heavy breathing, still eating well and everything. Maybe a little fin damage but that may be another damsel in the tank being a jerk. My yellow tang however is a different story. pretty shy, occasionally swimming high in the tank, showing signs of hlle as with my purple. I expected this to happen from previous posts. Although as of today the white spot I saw the other day is almost gone, he now has a bulging eye and his fins tail fin and pectoral fins are looking a little rough. Still eating which makes me happy. I am doing a 30 percent water change tonight and still maintaining copper levels.

 

[deedubz]

I believe Epsom salt(human/food grade?) helps with Popeye, though I'm not entirely sure. A lot of these parasites can cause secondary bacterial infections. If you don't have kanaplex, metroplex, and furan-2 you may want to pick some up (good to have anyway) Hopefully someone more knowledgeable will chime in and get you pointed in the right direction.

 

[Maritimer]

USP Grade epsom salts can, indeed, be helpful in cases of popeye due to injury - usually only on one side of the fish. One tablespoon per five gallons, repeat one time after 48 hours if needed. Epsom salt is magnesium sulphate, so pretty reef-safe.

~Bruce

 

[Cjud7982]

I picked up some epsom salts today after work and am just wanting to make sure it is ok to add while copper is in the tank. I didn't know if chemically the sulfates would bond with the free copper to form copper sulfates and free magnesium. Then throwing off my copper levels or worse, cause a toxic reaction. Thank you. I may be over thinking this lol

 

[deedubz]

I picked up some epsom salts today after work and am just wanting to make sure it is ok to add while copper is in the tank. I didn't know if chemically the sulfates would bond with the free copper to form copper sulfates and free magnesium. Then throwing off my copper levels or worse, cause a toxic reaction. Thank you. I may be over thinking this lol

That's a good question. I'd love to know the answer myself

 

[Cjud7982]

FYI- https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/epsom-salt-with-copper-treatment.373413/#post-4574807

Straight from the resident chemist. . Good news!!