ICH or NOT ICH???

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

How's it goin. So I've recently discovered that my blue Hippo tang has some cloudy spots on the black region of his body. I've actually grown this fish out from the size of a quarter and how hes about 6-7". Recently I've just set up a new display and moved him in there and all of a sudden he starts showing these weird cloudy white spots and I'm very baffled as to what it could be. Here's a little background.

I've been in the hobby for about 12 years so I'm well aware of what ich looks like, even on this particular fish. It has been with me for about 3 years and has had ich before; he has fought it off multiple times and is a very strong fish. Prior to me adding him to this new tank, I quarantined him for 3 weeks at a full dose of copper and a salinity of 1.020. For the duration of the 3 weeks, he had't shown any signs of ich whatsoever. Furthermore, I started this tank dry and ran it for 3 days with RODI water. After the cycle, I added the first group of fish (all acanthurus, including: 2 achilles hybrids, 1 regular achilles, a powder blue, a powder blue hybrid, and a gold rim) then about 10 days following I added only the blue tang. After about 5 days, he started showing these cloudy white spots (all about the size of ich). Not sure what it could be. It should also be noted that these spots are not raised or bumpy but present almost as if under the scales. Let me know what you all think.

DLHDesign · Sep 24, 2016

Welcome, fishguy!

Do you have any photos available?
Are there any notable behaviors (swimming into high flow, avoiding light, rapid breathing, discoloration, etc.)?

The #reefsquad is likely the best audience to help (perhaps a mod can move this into the Fish Disease section to get it some more attention as well?).

steve&mari · Sep 24, 2016

@Humblefish calling Dr fish

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

DLHDesign said:
Welcome, fishguy!

Do you have any photos available?
Are there any notable behaviors (swimming into high flow, avoiding light, rapid breathing, discoloration, etc.)?

The #reefsquad is likely the best audience to help (perhaps a mod can move this into the Fish Disease section to get it some more attention as well?).

Sorry, not sure how to move the thread, still new to the forum, but the blue tang has no signs of distress or other notable behaviors. He maintains calm breathing and isn't flashing on the rocks, he eats more than any of the other fish, and his coloration is one of the best I've ever seen on a blue tang this size.

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

immafishguy said:
Sorry, not sure how to move the thread, still new to the forum, but the blue tang has no signs of distress or other notable behaviors. He maintains calm breathing and isn't flashing on the rocks, he eats more than any of the other fish, and his coloration is one of the best I've ever seen on a blue tang this size.

I'll try to post some pictures later.

DLHDesign · Sep 24, 2016

immafishguy said:
Sorry, not sure how to move the thread

No worries; you can't (nor can I - only mods). It's okay; that's just a nice-to-do - all the people that can help you best will see this thread anyways.

Sorry I can't help any; I'm far newer to this lifestyle/hobby than yourself - I've just been following along on these forums enough to get an idea of the things that will help others help you best.

Here is a reference resource that may be worthwhile to glance at. A lot of the symptoms overlap, so it may not be enough to identify what your fish is experiencing, but it may give you an idea of some of the things that might be indicators. I think the pics will help the forums help you more than anything else, however.

Just in case; to upload a picture, click the "Upload a File" button to the lower-right of the text box. Select your image (or images - multiple can be done at once) and upload them. You'll see the progress below your text. Once uploaded, you can insert an image by clicking on either button (one does full image, the other a thumbnail). If you don't include a newly uploaded picture, it'll get appended to your post anyways, so once uploaded you can just post your reply and they'll make their way onto your post automagically.

kschweer · Sep 24, 2016

Welcome to R2R!!! Wish I could help but I'm not very good with fish disease. I agree pictures will help. I also moved your thread to the disease forum to get some more help. Best of luck.

redfishbluefish · Sep 24, 2016

Include @4FordFamily and @melypr1985 in this discussion

4FordFamily · Sep 24, 2016

Welcome home, you will love it here!

I'm also an acanthurus lover. I have a pair of Achilles, a PBT, powder brown, sohal, clown, and an Atlantic blue tang.

Anyway, we will need photos to be certain.

Good luck on the PBT and PBT hybrid, I have kept two or more in quarantine without issue, even got them to do their courting dance in the display when released. One day a couple weeks later they had a viscious divorce and one nearly died. They were together in qt for 3 months without issue. They were best friends that morning. My Achilles pair is ok for now but it's only been two weeks in the display.

I would love to know if your story ends better than mine!

melypr1985 · Sep 24, 2016

agreed. Pictures will help tremendously. If you can't get one..... where are the spots on the body? How long have they been there? Are they getting bigger?

Humblefish · Sep 24, 2016

^^Photos of these cloudy spots on the Hippo are needed. But "under the scales" sounds a lot like ich to me. However, if its only showing up on the black part then flukes are a possibility as well.

If you do have ich in this tank, I suspect one or more of those Acanthurus tangs you listed are going to let you know about it real soon.

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

Here's one of the best pics I could take, he doesn't like to be photographed haha... and the few really white spots are actually just sand grains. I watched them fall off when he swam across the tank. Also in response to the flukes, I have freshwater ripped him multiple times both before I added him while in quarantine and twice once I saw these spots develope

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

immafishguy said:
Here's one of the best pics I could take, he doesn't like to be photographed haha... and the few really white spots are actually just sand grains. I watched them fall off when he swam across the tank. Also in response to the flukes, I have freshwater ripped him multiple times both before I added him while in quarantine and twice once I saw these spots develope

The spots I'm referring to are most notisable towards the back part of the fish

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

Here's another pic. Also as another note, these exact same spots have been in the exact same places for about 3 days in a row. Which would be very uncharacteristic of the trophont stage as they should have fallen off by now.

Humblefish · Sep 24, 2016

IME; Hippos will get these weird splotches on their body (forgot about that) sometimes. I personally don't see anything to worry about (yet) from your photos.

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

Here's a close up. Not the size of the spots in comparison to the scales

Humblefish · Sep 24, 2016

immafishguy said:
Here's another pic. Also as another note, these exact same spots have been in the exact same places for about 3 days in a row. Which would be very uncharacteristic of the trophont stage as they should have fallen off by now.

Actually, ich trophonts will remain on a fish 3-7 days before dropping off.

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

Last thing, the spots become harder or easier to see depending on if the light catches them or not

immafishguy · Sep 24, 2016

Humblefish said:
Actually, ich trophonts will remain on a fish 3-7 days before dropping off.

True, but when they first enter the fish's body, they are virtually invisible because they are so microscopic. They turn white once they are about to leave the body and fall off. That's why a fish with ich can still have it even if you can't visually see it.

Humblefish · Sep 24, 2016

immafishguy said:
True, but when they first enter the fish's body, they are virtually invisible because they are so microscopic. They turn white once they are about to leave the body and fall off. That's why a fish with ich can still have it even if you can't visually see it.

The "white spots" you see are excess mucous which builds up around the insertion point(s). It's the immune system's natural reaction to trophonts burrowing in under the epithelium. Typically, there is a delayed reaction before the white spots show up. It may also be present for a day or two even after the trophont has dropped off the fish.