LEDs, T5s and MHs for zoas discussion. What are your thoughts?

[themcnertney]

Not to nag but a horizontal orientation over a tank like that gives lousey coverage.

They should be oriented perpendicular.

Pardon the dust..and the bad pic (cellphone camera lens is busted)

I tend to disagree. I think I would get equal coverage regardless of the orientation.
The reason I am adding T5's is because I am looking for the color and growth I get from my MH. I miss the hot expensive totally awesome lights.

 

[themcnertney]

Beautiful tank by the way!!

Thank you.

 

[Newb73]

Oh, OK, so you're not a zoa killer then!

If others can keep Acros under those lights anyone can, right? Have you tested and see what else could be wrong?
Perhaps ...
"...with alk swings, moving tanks, swapping lights, severe hyposalinity, very high nitrates, dropping stuff on them, too little flow, too much flow, and i even went so far as to let cyano completly cover them for weeks at a time..."?


Thanks for sharing the info on your LEDs. That might be of some help to others reading this...
Good luck to all the LED lovers!!
LOL!
Grandis.

My point was that the only non variable in those particular 2 years was the lights...(everything else was somewhat unstable over that time) and 95% of what i have tried has lived and thrived...under 3 types of LEDs.

Point 2, many claim that acros are the exception to what can be kept easily under LEDS and while some do it...i cant say for sure in MY tanks because over the initial set up phase (this time around), ive been too busy with work to keep them as stable as they should be. (First year tanks are rarely great choices for expert level livestock anyway...historically).

 

[Newb73]

I tend to disagree. I think I would get equal coverage regardless of the orientation.
The reason I am adding T5's is because I am looking for the color and growth I get from my MH. I miss the hot expensive totally awesome lights.

Equal coveage in a horizantal position will not work as well according to..

Both ecotech and aqua illumination.... the manufacturers (see their recommendations on orientation)

 

[themcnertney]

Equal coveage in a horizantal position will not work as well according to..

Both ecotech and aqua illumination.... the manufacturers (see their recommendations on orientation)

Looks the same to me regardless of orientation...

With that said, utilizing my existing mount for my MH, I wasn't able to arrange them perpendicular to the tank.

Now back to the original post, I think all the light options will grow zoa's equally & quickly if your water quality is on point.

 

[reefwiser]

Zoa's orientate upwards and their stem's do not have light going zooxanthellae in their tissue. SPS have zooxanthellae on all parts of their body.

 

[Newb73]

These are about 8 inches from bottom of tank.

On one occasion i even washed these under hot tap water to remove cyano. Didnt lose a single polyp and they were back out the following day

Zoas (at least when under my leds) have been probably more resilient than aptisia ...and the success is almost certainly NOT attributed to the husbandry ive given them.

Ive joked for a while now that you could probably grow a tank full of zoa in toilet water if you had leds.

That tiny 24k frag...will be a good sized colony in less than 6 months (guaranteed) and if i wanted to, ive no doubt that i could get zoa to cover every inch of my tank over the course of a single year if i wanted to.

 

[reefwiser]

You find zoa's growing on the pilings of boat docks in oily water so they are some tough cookies.

 

[Slm222]

Has anyone done a comparison of energy consumption and cost on a hydra 52 vs a halide or 6 bulbs t5 year over year?

 

[A. grandis]

My point was that the only non variable in those particular 2 years was the lights...(everything else was somewhat unstable over that time) and 95% of what i have tried has lived and thrived...under 3 types of LEDs.

Point 2, many claim that acros are the exception to what can be kept easily under LEDS and while some do it...i cant say for sure in MY tanks because over the initial set up phase (this time around), ive been too busy with work to keep them as stable as they should be. (First year tanks are rarely great choices for expert level livestock anyway...historically).

I guarantee that if you had MHs and/or T5s over your system things would be much, much, much better then.
Even some of the Acros would be easy to grow after like 3 or 4 months, with a decent set up.
That way you could concentrate in water chemistry and buying more frags, forgetting all the packaged trouble your LEDs comes with...

That is the reason this thread was posted in the first place!!
I've been recommending T5s as the most inexpensive option for zoas for a long time.
I also aways tell people that my best systems was with MHs. So metal halides are the very best for me!!!

Metal halides and T5s are the best lights available today to resemble the ocean's natural light, comparing to LEDs. Period.
That doesn't freaking mean that LEDs can't grow corals, people. Just means that T5s are better doing a great job.
Doesn't mean that you HAVE to change just because I'm saying. Only means that if you try you'll see the difference!
So, if people want to have a good system with decent growth and healthy corals/zoas in the long run, without even thinking about light problems, adaptations, burnings, moving frags, weird growth, positions and so on... why not just have the best lights already?

Am I writing in greek here? LOL!

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

I tend to disagree. I think I would get equal coverage regardless of the orientation.
The reason I am adding T5's is because I am looking for the color and growth I get from my MH. I miss the hot expensive totally awesome lights.

Why not get the hot expensive totally awesome lights back then?
I really doubt you're gonna get the same results with any LEDs!

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Looks the same to me regardless of orientation...

With that said, utilizing my existing mount for my MH, I wasn't able to arrange them perpendicular to the tank.

Now back to the original post, I think all the light options will grow zoa's equally & quickly if your water quality is on point.

Please think twice. I assure that MHs grow zoas much faster than my best T5 fixture and bulb combination I ever had.
LEDs are not better than T5s in the long run...
There are many differences, posted since the beginning.

That said, if you have a very good water quality control for your tank with LEDs, for example, and you change for all T5s you'll get more coverage. Everything changes!! Even if you add some T5s to the LEDs you'll do better. That's it...

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Zoa's orientate upwards and their stem's do not have light going zooxanthellae in their tissue. SPS have zooxanthellae on all parts of their body.

That's a nice observation!
I'm going further here...
With MHs and/or T5s you'll get zoas growing on walls almost vertically looking healthy and colorful.
Meaning the polyps almost on a vertical position.
If you put LEDs over that tank they will look like umbrellas after a while, very unnatural.

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

These are about 8 inches from bottom of tank.

On one occasion i even washed these under hot tap water to remove cyano. Didnt lose a single polyp and they were back out the following day

Zoas (at least when under my leds) have been probably more resilient than aptisia ...and the success is almost certainly NOT attributed to the husbandry ive given them.

Ive joked for a while now that you could probably grow a tank full of zoa in toilet water if you had leds.

That tiny 24k frag...will be a good sized colony in less than 6 months (guaranteed) and if i wanted to, ive no doubt that i could get zoa to cover every inch of my tank over the course of a single year if i wanted to.

I've grew zoas under T12 Coralife bulbs when I was a kid. They grow... Not better than my T5s...

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

You find zoa's growing on the pilings of boat docks in oily water so they are some tough cookies.

Yep, they grow around swage green water in Florida!!!

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Has anyone done a comparison of energy consumption and cost on a hydra 52 vs a halide or 6 bulbs t5 year over year?

That would be interesting...
Perhaps it's time to talk more about the energy consumption.
My 125 tank had 8 T5s first. Amazing!!! I changed for 2 Chinese LED fixtures from Ebay to try to save money on electricity.
My electricity went down to about 20% a month. That was a lot of money for me!!
Other friends changed to LEDs and they reported basically the same percentage (~20%).

The only problem is that my 125gal didn't have the zoas growing as I see in nature or in my 75gal with the 6 T5s...
They grew fast and stopped. Some receded and started to melt fast out of nothing.
I kept my water chemistry and maintenance just like I do with my 75gal. The only difference was the lights.
I had to constantly adjust the intensity and some times change the zoas around so they wouldn't die.
Constant fight against the lights!!!
The zoas would't grow on vertical walls, of course.
We had shadows all over the tank. I put up with that for a while because of the savings, then I couldn't help it anymore...

Grandis.

 

[themcnertney]

Please think twice. I assure that MHs grow zoas much faster than my best T5 fixture and bulb combination I ever had.
LEDs are not better than T5s in the long run...
There are many differences, posted since the beginning.

That said, if you have a very good water quality control for your tank with LEDs, for example, and you change for all T5s you'll get more coverage. Everything changes!! Even if you add some T5s to the LEDs you'll do better. That's it...

Grandis.

Mmmm. Ive tried all three kinds and I can't say for sure that one can grow better then another. The only way you could test this is three equal tanks with the same zoas (and only zoas, nothing else, no other coral) in each tank, with the different lighting over top. Then at that you cant say one grows better then another. Example, maybe AI grow better the EcoTech. Or Giesemann grow better then ATI bulbs. Then what about the bulbs themselves. Different combos make different results. Etc, etc.

This thread is too much of a generalization. All three are good and bad in there own ways. Which is why I said, "I think all the light options will grow zoa's equally & quickly if your water quality is on point."

 

[Newb73]

2 Chinese LED fixtures from Ebay to try to save money on electricity.


Some receded and started to melt fast out of nothing.

.

There is really no mystery here.

 

[Newb73]

Mmmm. Ive tried all three kinds and I can't say for sure that one can grow better then another. The only way you could test this is three equal tanks with the same zoas (and only zoas, nothing else, no other coral) in each tank, with the different lighting over top. Then at that you cant say one grows better then another. Example, maybe AI grow better the EcoTech. Or Giesemann grow better then ATI bulbs. Then what about the bulbs themselves. Different combos make different results. Etc, etc.

This thread is too much of a generalization. All three are good and bad in there own ways. Which is why I said, "I think all the light options will grow zoa's equally & quickly if your water quality is on point."

Mark Callahan has his 450 up and running with LEDs on the left, metal hallides in the middle, T5s on the right.

He is officially on record as stating zero difference in color and growth, including sps.

 

[themcnertney]

Mark Callahan has his 450 up and running with LEDs on the left, metal hallides in the middle, T5s on the right.

He is officially on record as stating zero difference in color and growth, including sps.

What is zero difference in color and growth?
I'm lost, just trying to give the original poster my experience. No point in this back and forth.