Rich Ross - Home Tank - guess the phosphate

[tripdad]

Are you noticing any measurable differences in the corals as you drop phosphate levels?

 

[Thales]

Are you noticing any measurable differences in the corals as you drop phosphate levels?

I have not. I didn't notice much when it has gone up and down in the past.

 

[Thales]

Impossible with high phosphate?

 

[Kraig]

Amazing

 

[tripdad]

Bravo!!!

 

[taricha]

@Thales how do you phosphate-acclimate your new additions from low PO4 environments to the high PO4 stresses of your tank?

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

AI generated photos have come a long way... haha

 

[Thales]

@Thales how do you phosphate-acclimate your new additions from low PO4 environments to the high PO4 stresses of your tank?

Hahah!

 

[taricha]

@Thales you've said that you feed a lot of food but that the amount is hard to convey to people until they actually see it for themselves.
I'd be really curious to see what it is quantified on a mg/L protein basis. (Dan's idea for comparing food amounts.)
If you've got a scale then approximations could be worked out form just knowing mass of each food input.
here's an estimate worked out for my anemic feedings.

I would like to know what people's actual food inputs are. It's not hard to know - foods say right on the label what % is protein.
If I feed a cube of mysis, a cube of brine, and a pinch of flake...
mysis: 3.3g x 7.6% protein x 16% N in protein = 40mg N
brine: 3.3g x 3.7% protein x 16% N in protein = 20mg N
pinch of flake: 0.5g x 53% protein x 16% N in protein = 42mg N
Total = input of 40+20+42 = 102mg N in 260L system = 0.39 mg/L of N
if 100% of that protein N went into NH4 that'd give 0.39 x (18 mass NH4 / 14 mass N) = 0.50 ppm NH4

0.39 mg/L of N = 2.4 mg/L Protein.

 

[Thales]

@Thales you've said that you feed a lot of food but that the amount is hard to convey to people until they actually see it for themselves.
I'd be really curious to see what it is quantified on a mg/L protein basis. (Dan's idea for comparing food amounts.)
If you've got a scale then approximations could be worked out form just knowing mass of each food input.
here's an estimate worked out for my anemic feedings.

0.39 mg/L of N = 2.4 mg/L Protein.

I love it. According to the notes I just looked at, when I feed frozen food I feed about 80 grams or LRS, Hikari mysis, and PE Calinus. I have the weights on the avast auto feeder somewhere. I'll try to find it or measure again, and measure the other auto feeders as well. And then figure out if I actually feed frozen with any regularity (it has been very irregular as of late!). I aslo have a vid of a feed somewhere that I did for a talk (but that isn't data, but it also gives a visual idea of the feeding), that I can try to find or recreate.

That may happen in January when I am done with the bulk of spawning stuff. Or, it could happen in the next few days beause it is such a goood idea.

EDIT - I found it in a note. Looks liek the estimate of dry foods into the tank is 6 grams a day

 

[Subsea]

Impossible with high phosphate?

What am I looking at? Is that a snowstorm in the water?

 

[Thales]

What am I looking at? Is that a snowstorm in the water?

Coral spawning. Here is a vid from earlier in the thread

Rich Ross - Home Tank - guess the phosphate

Roughly the phosphate level of EZ-Gro Liquid Plant Fertilizer

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Garf]

 

[Subsea]

Coral spawning. Here is a vid from earlier in the thread

Rich Ross - Home Tank - guess the phosphate

Roughly the phosphate level of EZ-Gro Liquid Plant Fertilizer

www.reef2reef.com

That is awesome. I salute your achievement.

Once, Red Grapes went sexual in a seaweed grow-out tank, 6 months later Bortacladia sprouts were emerging everywhere.

 

[taricha]

I aslo have a vid of a feed somewhere that I did for a talk (but that isn't data, but it also gives a visual idea of the feeding)

here's the post with the feeding vid. Impressive amounts of food per volume.

I like food going in over several hours at least, but also sometimes flood feed a lot once they are open. I have lots of recruits of tubastrea and some dendro. I feed a lot - here is a video from a while ago

link to post here since I don't think the vid will show up in quote

 

[taricha]

I love it. According to the notes I just looked at, when I feed frozen food I feed about 80 grams or LRS, Hikari mysis, and PE Calinus. I have the weights on the avast auto feeder somewhere. I'll try to find it or measure again, and measure the other auto feeders as well. And then figure out if I actually feed frozen with any regularity (it has been very irregular as of late!). I aslo have a vid of a feed somewhere that I did for a talk (but that isn't data, but it also gives a visual idea of the feeding), that I can try to find or recreate.

That may happen in January when I am done with the bulk of spawning stuff. Or, it could happen in the next few days beause it is such a goood idea.

EDIT - I found it in a note. Looks liek the estimate of dry foods into the tank is 6 grams a day

Let's make a bunch of assumptions to get some very approximate numbers:
assume 80g frozen is split equally between the three....

26.7g PE Calanus * 12% protein (label) = 3.2g protein
26.7g Hikari mysis * 4.2% protein (label) = 1.1g protein
26.7g LRS reef frenzy * 20% protein (shrimp and scallops are like ~24%, ocean perch 16%, let's assume other ingredients bring it down a bit and call it 20%) = 5.3g protein

Dry foods - flakes, pellets etc are frequently 45-55% protein so let's guess 50%.
6g dry foods * 50% = 3.0g protein

Total = 3.2+1.1+5.3+3.0 = 12.6 grams protein daily input.


I'll take this as the water volume....

The system is also connected to the Secret Home Lab system, so the total is somewhere like 500 gallons in sumps and tanks. The display is 150 gallons, 4 by 2 by 2.

500 gallons = 1890 Liters so
12.6g protein (12,600mg) / 1890 L = 6.7 mg/L protein per day or
6.7 mg/L Protein * 16% N in protein = 1.1 mg/L N

...which is actually kind of hilarious. You feed like ~1ppm of nitrogen per day (for that water volume). Which isn't really that much after all!

But it looks like a lot for the display tank volume, and it is a lot for the mouths in that tank.
But the mouths in your tank get the best of both worlds. Food at big concentrations per tank volume, but the chemical consequences of those feedings are diluted in ~3x the water volume.

 

[Thales]

Let's make a bunch of assumptions to get some very approximate numbers:
assume 80g frozen is split equally between the three....

26.7g PE Calanus * 12% protein (label) = 3.2g protein
26.7g Hikari mysis * 4.2% protein (label) = 1.1g protein
26.7g LRS reef frenzy * 20% protein (shrimp and scallops are like ~24%, ocean perch 16%, let's assume other ingredients bring it down a bit and call it 20%) = 5.3g protein

Dry foods - flakes, pellets etc are frequently 45-55% protein so let's guess 50%.
6g dry foods * 50% = 3.0g protein

Total = 3.2+1.1+5.3+3.0 = 12.6 grams protein daily input.


I'll take this as the water volume....


500 gallons = 1890 Liters so
12.6g protein (12,600mg) / 1890 L = 6.7 mg/L protein per day or
6.7 mg/L Protein * 16% N in protein = 1.1 mg/L N

...which is actually kind of hilarious. You feed like ~1ppm of nitrogen per day (for that water volume). Which isn't really that much after all!

But it looks like a lot for the display tank volume, and it is a lot for the mouths in that tank.
But the mouths in your tank get the best of both worlds. Food at big concentrations per tank volume, but the chemical consequences of those feedings are diluted in ~3x the water volume.

Rock. Thanks for this. One of the original philosophies behind the system from the beginning was a sump bigger than the display because water volume helps with all manner of issues, and since I had space under the house I could do it. That said, I have been testing phosphate daily and it def goes up when I feed frozen foods and maybe recently from feeding the baby coral. I should weigh that out - I don't think it is that much honestly. Hard to tell though because I have been doing both recently.

 

[Cthulukelele]

Guess the phosphate. Testing at 12:25 PST

Shot taken with iphone, SKY's on neptune sky mode, 100%, with Polyp Lab orange filter. Take at 7 amish, with the lights turned up for the photo. Most fish sleeping

This is probably the most impressive tank I've ever seen

 

[Thales]

This is probably the most impressive tank I've ever seen

Thank you so much!

 

[Thales]

Shot from yesterday. Kinda cleaned the glass. NPS half awake. Guess the phosphate