Second New DIY Two Part Recipe with Higher pH Boost

[legalizedreefer]

Not sure what you are getting from my statements. Balling Part C has a lot of magnesium (more than any other ion except sulfate) but should not be used for purposes of boosting magnesium since it boosts lots of unrelated ions.

Randy, for clarity sake because I’ve got lost in the 45 pages…

Part 1: sodium hydroxide + TM A-
Part 2: calcium chloride + TM K+
Part 3: TM balling part C

Is this ok? Also, I’m hoping to replace all-for-reef with this for the pH boost, but I do appreciate the fact that all-for-reef is “complete”

Does this method + the traces somewhat closesly replace that “complete” product like All-for reef? Or am I missing something

Is there a salinity rising effect even with the addition of balling part C?

 

[ingchr1]

Not sure what you are getting from my statements. Balling Part C has a lot of magnesium (more than any other ion except sulfate) but should not be used for purposes of boosting magnesium since it boosts lots of unrelated ions.

That Balling Part C is not a magnesium supplement. If you need to supplement magnesium, Balling Part C is not the product to use. Balling Part C is to maintain balance when dosing Parts A and B.

If you are dosing Parts A, B and C is it possible that one may also need to dose a separate magnesium supplement at times?

 

[Miami Reef]

If you are dosing Parts A, B and C is it possible that one may also need to dose a separate magnesium supplement at times?

This is my opinion, Randy can confirm if my opinion is correct or not:

If you never do water changes and have a lot of coralline algae, it’s possible for magnesium to trend down, but it will take a VERY long time.

If you make at least some water changes, it’s likely you‘ll never see it skew from proper seawater levels.

 

[Miami Reef]

Randy, for clarity sake because I’ve got lost in the 45 pages…

Part 1: sodium hydroxide + TM A-
Part 2: calcium chloride + TM K+
Part 3: TM balling part C

Is this ok? Also, I’m hoping to replace all-for-reef with this for the pH boost, but I do appreciate the fact that all-for-reef is “complete”

Does this method + the traces somewhat closesly replace that “complete” product like All-for reef? Or am I missing something

Is there a salinity rising effect even with the addition of balling part C?

Yes. The recipe you posted above it a very good replacement for All For Reef.

I personally believe the trace element A and K are not necessary unless it’s clear they are a benefit to your tank, but you can add them in if you’d like.

There will be a salinity increase even if you opt out of the balling part C. The increase in salinity is from the byproducts of the alk (sodium) and the calcium (chloride)

Sodium chloride = salt.


When you lower back down the salinity, the balling part C; which adds magnesium, sulfates, flouride, etc keeps the salinity looking like seawater instead of a table salt solution overtime.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

That Balling Part C is not a magnesium supplement. If you need to supplement magnesium, Balling Part C is not the product to use. Balling Part C is to maintain balance when dosing Parts A and B.

If you are dosing Parts A, B and C is it possible that one may also need to dose a separate magnesium supplement at times?

Yes, I understand that, and yes, one may need to add additional magnesium occasionally.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy, for clarity sake because I’ve got lost in the 45 pages…

Part 1: sodium hydroxide + TM A-
Part 2: calcium chloride + TM K+
Part 3: TM balling part C

Is this ok? Also, I’m hoping to replace all-for-reef with this for the pH boost, but I do appreciate the fact that all-for-reef is “complete”

Does this method + the traces somewhat closesly replace that “complete” product like All-for reef? Or am I missing something

Is there a salinity rising effect even with the addition of balling part C?

Just adding to Miami’s explanation, Balling Part C also contributes to the salinity rise. It just makes sure that everything stays in a proper ratio as the salinity rises, and things stay in that proper ratio when you lower the salinity by replacing some tank water with ro/di.

 

[thedon986]

I have been using this two part in my DDR which I had to super glue the optical mounts back on to and noticed this discoloration on the super glue joint. Any idea what this might be? Any cause for concern? This is on the alkalinity side, no discoloration on the calcium side.

 

[legalizedreefer]

Does the addition of TM Part C negate the need for the magnesium sulfate/chloride mix? Or is it used in addition to that

 

[Miami Reef]

Does the addition of TM Part C negate the need for the magnesium sulfate/chloride mix? Or is it used in addition to that

Balling part c negates the needs for the magnesium sulfate chloride mix

 

[legalizedreefer]

Balling part c negates the needs for the magnesium sulfate chloride mix

Thank you so much Miami, you have helped turn this from something I wanted to do for the pH benefit but seemed too complicated to something I can actually see myself doing. Thanks for all your replies.

Do you mix in a glass beaker or HDPE?

 

[Miami Reef]

Thank you so much Miami, you have helped turn this from something I wanted to do for the pH benefit but seemed too complicated to something I can actually see myself doing. Thanks for all your replies.

Do you mix in a glass beaker or HDPE?

I mix it directly into the HDPE container.

I fill the old vinegar gallon bottle 75% full. I place the bottle on top of my magnetic stirrer and measure 283g of NaOH in a small beaker. Next, I turn on the magnetic stirrer and place a funnel on the gallon jug.


I will then pour the hydroxide into the container and add RO/DI to the beaker that contained the hydroxide granules to dissolve any excess from the beaker that remained. I will swirl, add it to the beaker, and repeat until the gallon HDPE is filled to the top.


Once the container isn’t hot anymore (or just slightly warm), I’ll get the magnetic wand to fish out the magnetic pill.

 

[Miami Reef]

This is the magnetic stirrer I use (it comes with the magnetic wand and pills)




This is a funnel similar to what I use:

 

[Miami Reef]

I’m not saying you need that stuff. I just like to be safe because sodium hydroxide gets VERY hot when dissolving, and I don’t like to manually shake a caustic, hot, filled plastic container.

I like to be as safe as possible so I can keep doing the things I love for my reef tank.

 

[legalizedreefer]

I’m not saying you need that stuff. I just like to be safe because sodium hydroxide gets VERY hot when dissolving, and I don’t like to manually shake a caustic, hot, filled plastic container.

I like to be as safe as possible so I can keep doing the things I love for my reef tank.

I’ll be buying that stuff as well. Imagine the chaos if a kid popped when you were shaking it.

You don’t have any issues with the heat in the vinegar jug?

 

[Miami Reef]

I’ll be buying that stuff as well. Imagine the chaos if a kid popped when you were shaking it.

You don’t have any issues with the heat in the vinegar jug?

I mean, you can technically hold the lid in place, but I find that the container gets really hot to hold while shaking. I also don’t feel comfortable holding such a caustic, hot container if were to accidentally drop it while aggressively shaking it.

I think container can potentially melt if there is a lot of heat on the bottom, especially from dissolving granules on the bottom. The purpose of the magnetic stirrer is to disperse the heat throughout the container, which greatly reduces the localized heat on the bottom of the container. That’s the main reason why I use the magnetic stirrer.

@Randy Holmes-Farley Can you please confirm if the heat from dissolving granular of hydroxide sitting on the bottom can melt HDPE containers? I find (with my experience) that the container gets VERY hot (can’t even touch it) if the solids sit the bottom without stirring it with the magnetic stirrer.

I’ve tried mixing it without the stirrer in the past, but the anxiety I felt to quickly shake the bottle because I didn’t want the container to melt with the solids on the bottom made me look for the stirrer as my go to for mixing hydroxide.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I mean, you can technically hold the lid in place, but I find that the container gets really hot to hold while shaking. I also don’t feel comfortable holding such a caustic, hot container if were to accidentally drop it while aggressively shaking it.

The container can potentially melt if there is a lot of heat on the bottom, especially from dissolving granules on the bottom. The purpose of the magnetic stirrer is to disperse the heat throughout the container, which greatly reduces the localized heat on the bottom of the container. That’s the main reason why I use the magnetic stirrer.

@Randy Holmes-Farley Can you please confirm if the heat from dissolving granular of hydroxide sitting on the bottom can melt HDPE containers? I find (with my experience) that the container gets VERY hot (can’t even touch it) if the solids sit the bottom without stirring it with the magnetic stirrer.

That seems sensible. Yes, it can get hot enough to melt/soften plastic if a bunch of solids sit on the bottom.


There are a number of ways one might get around these issues. Mixing in glass is one. Adding NaOH slowly over time while dissolving the NaOH in many small portions in the total water is another (like 1/10th of the NaOH each time. allowing cooling in between).

 

[Miami Reef]

That seems sensible. Yes, it can get hot enough to melt/soften plastic if a bunch of solids sit on the bottom.


There are a number of ways one might get around these issues. Mixing in glass is one. Adding NaOH slowly over time while dissolving the NaOH in many small portions in the total water is another (like 1/10th of the NaOH each time. allowing cooling in between).

Thank you, Randy.

I’m always looking for ways to improve my hydroxide mixing methods.

 

[legalizedreefer]

Thank you, Randy.

I’m always looking for ways to improve my hydroxide mixing methods.

Sorry, one more question. Part 1 and 2 are 1:1 dosing, but is the TM part C 1:1:1 or is it dosed at a different ratio? Did I see you say something about mixing the Part C to 2x potency as well?

 

[Miami Reef]

Sorry, one more question. Part 1 and 2 are 1:1 dosing, but is the TM part C 1:1:1 or is it dosed at a different ratio? Did I see you say something about mixing the Part C to 2x potency as well?

Correct.

Balling Part C was made to match the concentration of Tropic Marin’s alk and ca concentrations.

Randy did the math and found Tropic Marin alk and ca is 50% weaker in concentration.

I've never looked into calculating how much Balling Part C to use or how concentrated they make it. I hope they didn't mess that up.

One can determine how much of the standard concentration TM Part C to use based on the alk or calcium potency.

Normal Balling full liquid recipe:

Balling Zwischenseite | Produktinformationen

www.tropic-marin-smartinfo.com

Part A: Calcium chloride dihydrate (20,000 ppm Ca)
Part B: Sodium carbonate/sodium bicarbonate (2,800 °dH/l)
Part C: Sodium chloride free sea salt (~ 3,350 ppm Mg; ~ 980 ppm K)

Separately add equal amounts of all three solutions successively to the tank water daily (DO NOT MIX THE SOLUTIONS).

The addition of 1 fl.oz./30 ml of each solution will raise the calcium level of 10 US-gal./35 l by approx. 15 ppm and the alkalinity by 2.2 °dH.

My sodium hydroxide recipe (which is identical in potency to my recipe #1) has this potency:

30 mL of the calcium part to 10 gallons boosts calcium by 29 ppm
30 mL of the alk part boosts alk by 4.2 dKH.

Thus, my recipe is essentially twice as potent as normal balling (they are lower because it is less soluble bicarbonate in the alk part) and you should thus dose twice as much Part C per volume of the other parts as you would with normal Balling.

Hence, the BRS directions look correct in that regard.

Thus,

283g NaOH per gallon RO/DI
500g CaCl per gallon RO/DI
182g Balling Part C per gallon RO/DI


Dose equal amounts of each to maintain your alkalinity; Ca, Mg, minor, and major elements will remain in line.

 

[legalizedreefer]

Correct.

Balling Part C was made to match the concentration of Tropic Marin’s alk and ca concentrations.

Randy did the math and found Tropic Marin alk and ca is 50% weaker in concentration.



Thus,

283g NaOH per gallon RO/DI
500g CaCl per gallon RO/DI
182g Balling Part C per gallon RO/DI


Dose equal amounts of each to maintain your alkalinity; Ca, Mg, minor, and major elements will remain in line.

Thank you so much!