Too much "Bacteria In a Bottle"... Did it happen to me?

[brandon429]

RC Reefer, a quick breakdown of my response/troubleshooting your tank

--I have posted a link, the only example so far to accompany my opinion piece among pieces, = shows a lot of tanks putting in a lot more bacteria than you did, take from it what you will. take from the fact there arent alternate link examples, using home reef tanks like yours, to consider.

-I posted old vs new cycling science to cover why your fish disease happened: chemists have heels dug in and cannot be swayed away from quoting cycle readiness based solely on stated test levels. time in cycle will never be considered, disease levels for today not considered, tanks with rocks full of algae can still be quoted as not ready if someone's api levels aren't stated acceptably (have copious examples, anyone can search these themselves) etc. this is the duel between old and new science I mentioned.

-I have lots of experience handling dinos tanks. if I posted the experience, it would just be discounted, so no problem there. how to manage dinos is anyone's opinion, and for mine, it's unrelated to bottle bac. if you were interested in seeing ways I fix dinos tanks, it has nothing to do with adding things.

its amazing how civil dialogue can work in reefing, if we're not always trying to start arguments Bean. you're on block though, I won't see your response. this here jn was the sole one for 2025 to see if your input was helpful science, or more arguing. shoulda known heh

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

-I have lots of experience handling dinos tanks.

There are lots of ways to deal with dinos. But that does not seem to be the purpose of this thread since the OP wrote:

"Dino's are now for the most part gone.."

The concern seems to be more about coral problems.

Put the Zoa's in DT, then total melt down.
I've also noticed other corals not doing so well

• Kenya tree coral is droopy
• Duncan has been closed up for months
• Leather toadstool does not have as much PE

That's the context of thinking it a possibility that the microbiome is messed up and causing issues.

 

[brandon429]

Understood. My main take is the OP posted three challenges for this tank which have copious work threads we can individually search to find counters to the claim bacteria over usage was implicated in disease challenges and invasion issues. I'm sure there really is a tipping point where sustained changes could be made, it's just not in the pattern set of things we can search in my opinion


One of the best ways to look at dinos involves by key inclusion the 900+ page dinos thread, stickied at the top of the nuisance algae forum

Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

I don't know what percentage of folks had luck battling dinos with any of the methods in the old Dino thread but it's obviously a very low percentage, so I'd like refresh folks on the natural alternatives and lay out three areas of info: some of the factors that contribute to a dino outbreak...

www.reef2reef.com

That thread is ground zero for proof of what works in reef dinos


They're trying every known method in pattern the last eight years, that's gold pattern work. Anyone posting there is open to input on what works: claimants for best practices can show up asking for jobs, we can type out steps for them to take right there to battle dinos and see what really works.



What does a review of the very last 20 pages of that dinos thread show: cures? Fixes?

Or works in progress?


What did the first 20 pages show? Fixes, or challenges+works in progress

What about the middle


In the center 20 pages if we flip through pictures, are there a lot of fix pics?


In that entire thread...the largest sole example for dinos patterns so far, how much does bottle bac factor coming or going


My belief= we can unlink bottle bac from every condition here. Agreed opening syntax wasn't ideal, it's a good thing RC reefer isn't on angry by default

I thought his post tied into lots of major ongoing conflicts in reefing. This is a good thread for sure.

Anyone presenting opinions here should already have a work request logged on file there, in my opinion, so we can track outbound work. #12,496.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Understood.

Clearly not - or you would have stopped.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

In that entire thread, the largest sole example for dinos patterns so far, how much does bottle bac factor coming or going


I believe we can unlink bottle bac from every condition here.

But there is clear concern and some evidence that bottle bacteria can contain coral pathogens.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Could these "Bacteria In a Bottle" have been detrimental to the ecosystem in my DT...?
Is the Bacterial Equilibrium out of balance in my DT...?
Should I source some Live rock and introduce it in my DT...?
Is there another parameter I should be checking...?

I'm really curious as what the results will be from the Aquabiomics Snap Shot.

In general your water parameters look good.

Adding established live rock is certainly a reasonable idea, especially considering that your biome report appears to indicate something other than normal "healthy" diversity.

It is not unreasonable (as Randy and others have pointed out) to conclude that adding so much "bottled" bacteria could have possibly upset what would otherwise be a natural balance expected in a healthy reef tank.

Aside from the ICP and general ION tests, there is not really much else to test for. While the biome test is not conclusive, it is the only thing that does appear to be off.

I certainly would not dump any more bacteria into the tank. I would concentrate on water changes, import of known healthy biological material (rock, sand, fauna) and see if time helps move things back in the desired direction.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I certainly would not dump any more bacteria into the tank. I would concentrate on water changes, import of known healthy biological material (rock, sand, fauna) and see if time helps move things back in the desired direction.

I agree.

 

[brandon429]

I agree we encounter coral pathogens routinely, Ive seen those aquabiomics findings stated in posts too.

next thing I'm curious to see now that grievances were completed: status of op's tank. Rc reefer am going to look at your current progress see if I missed updates

 

[Garf]

Ya I started with Dry rock.
Never again!
Looking back, I should have seeded the tank with as much live rock from multiple tanks that I could find.
Check out the diversity report I posted.

I'm another for believing in the possibility of bacterial skewing. I don't think it's the rock, itself. Multiple times I've added dry rock to a running system, no weirdness. I've also started a few tanks with dry rock and ceramic and aged water (no bottle bac) with no oddities. I started my current tank with all sorts of bacterias (more the merrier, right?), 12 months of crap ensued. I've got a new small tank to start up soon, no way am I buying bottle bac.

 

[BeanAnimal]

I'm another for believing in the possibility of bacterial skewing. I don't think it's the rock, itself. Multiple times I've added dry rock to a running system, no weirdness. I've also started a few tanks with dry rock and ceramic and aged water (no bottle bac) with no oddities. I started my current tank with all sorts of bacterias (more the merrier, right?), 12 months of crap ensued. I've got a new small tank to start up soon, no way am I buying bottle bac.

Exactly - my reef was started ~20 some years go with dry rock and thrived. It wasn't until sometime later that I added Fiji rock that I obtained when we hosted MACNA (2007).

I don't know that I have ever dumped a bottle of bacteria in the tank -- in fact, I am almost positive that i have not.

There is no shortage of "My parameters and ICP test look perfect, why are my coral in such bad shape" type of threads or people with pristine parameters that suffer from STN or RTN or BJD, etc.

There is no question in my mind that many of these issues are bacterial in nature and I am not convinced that dumping some random bottle of one or more strains of whatever into the system is the solution or beneficial. It makes as much sense as alchemy or homeopathy to me.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

. It makes as much sense as alchemy or homeopathy to me.

Homeopathy. Now there’s a term losing its meaning to the public, who now seem to think it means natural home remedies. lol