Pressure on False Claim Products

[jason2459]

So, back to the Vibrant mentioned earlier. I've been off the forums for a few years and missed this one. But reading up on threads exposing it as an Algaecide really fills in a lot of gaps and makes a lot more sense to me now from things I saw.

I did some testing with the product and it worked well. When looking under the microscope I could see the algae being affected. What I didn't know and makes sense as an algaecide is that it was causing the cells to rupture which I captured some of this happening.

I looked for bacteria in the product itself and would find strands of something and bacteria off those strands but looked dormant. Vibrant rep said that was their product and their secret bacteria all right. Most likely knowing what we know now they were possibly just not living and the strands just a contaminant. And looking even harder I would find some bacteria here and there. But again, knowing what we know now it was probably just contaminated from the environment and not the main driver for the effects that are seen in the aquarium.

 

[Shooter6]

Polylab medic is a good canadite for your list

 

[KrisReef]

It’s a straight admittance that they’re not sure what it does and likely does nothing

I'm wondering if you would mind if I borrowed this sentence?

I'm helping a friend write a resume.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yes

Assuming I'm referring to the same ChemiPure media product, it contains "activated carbon plus high-grade ion-exchange resins" in a bag.

"High-grade ion-exchange resins"...as in DI resin?

Yes, although likely going in with different chemicals prebound to the resin than DI resin. . Chemi Pure is an example of a company that makes some claims that may only relate to fresh water applications but which unfortunately they do not clarify and perhaps hope marine hobbyists will assume they apply and buy the product (or maybe they just do not understand the difference).

 

[rtparty]

I'm wondering if you would mind if I borrowed this sentence?

I'm helping a friend write a resume.

Let me think about it.

Am I going to get credit in the citations?

 

[Nonya]

Most of us (sometimes all of us?) in the hobby are pretty ignorant when it comes to reef chemistry and biology. That means that we become lemmings when it comes to fads, and that when things go wrong (especially in the first several months of a new tank) we look for the magic products that promise quick fixes. When we resort to these kinds of products in desperation and the problem remains, we chalk it up to acting too late for the product to be effective, not realizing the product is total crap anyway.

 

[Nonya]

Yes


Yes, although likely going in with different chemicals prebound to the resin than DI resin. . Chemi Pure is an example of a company that makes some claims that may only relate to fresh water applications but which unfortunately they do not clarify and perhaps hope marine hobbyists will assume they apply and buy the product (or maybe they just do not understand the difference).

The label on the jar clearly states, "Superior Filtration for Fresh, Marine and Marine Aquariums" and "Original Formula", and the Blue version states, "Superior Filtration for Marine and Marine Aquariums". No ambiguity there.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The label on the jar clearly states, "Superior Filtration for Fresh, Marine and Marine Aquariums" and "Original Formula", and the Blue version states, "Superior Filtration for Marine and Marine Aquariums". No ambiguity there.

I agree, but a number of the specific claims may work in fresh water and not in seawater (phosphate binding by a polymer resin, and the various ion exchange resin claims, including the preferred negative ions. lol).

"Chemi-pure does not remove trace elements and is the only filter medium which aids in the natural balance of positive and negative charges, with an emphasis on the beneficial negative ion. "

 

[Nonya]

"Chemi-pure does not remove trace elements and is the only filter medium which aids in the natural balance of positive and negative charges, with an emphasis on the beneficial negative ion. "

Those words amount to word salad written by a snake oil salesman, or a prominent politician. Words like "aids in" and "beneficial negative ion" just add fuel to the argument that so many of these companies really care less about revealing the whole truth.

According to their web site, "Chemi-pure Blue’s proprietary formula significantly reduces organic compounds, odors, phenols, toxins, medications, dissolved metals, phosphates and silicates. Chemi-pure Blue’s high-capacity pelletized activated carbon has very low ash content and rinses clean quickly, thus reducing the potential of HLLE within your aquarium. Chemi-pure Blue uses the finest laboratory grade resin technology to RAPIDLY remove organics and phosphates from your aquarium water while raising redox and helping stabilize pH."

"Contains two high-grade hybrid ion exchange resins to produce a synergistic formula for the health and well-being of your aquarium inhabitants."
Sure sounds like typical DI resin to me. Is there a way to determine this?

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

Yeah I just got lost in the Googleverse for awhile….. apparently negative ion therapy is a thing. Who would have thought? Stitch some tourmaline into your clothes and the negative ions get absorbed into your body and you magically become a happy people surrounded by unicorns and rainbows! I’m guessing I would need a cargo ship’s worth of tourmaline, but maybe I could just bathe in chemipure?

 

[Nonya]

Yeah I just got lost in the Googleverse for awhile….. apparently negative ion therapy is a thing. Who would have thought? Stitch some tourmaline into your clothes and the negative ions get absorbed into your body and you magically become a happy people surrounded by unicorns and rainbows! I’m guessing I would need a cargo ship’s worth of tourmaline, but maybe I could just bathe in chemipure?

I prefer crystals, mini-Buddha statues, incense and candles. I'm having trouble testing those params, though.

 

[taricha]

When looking under the microscope I could see the algae being affected. What I didn't know and makes sense as an algaecide is that it was causing the cells to rupture which I captured some of this happening.

I actually thought about that microscope observation of yours when I learned about what was in it. Tempting to conclude that you observed the polyquat disrupting the cells - which is expected behavior, but it could also have simply been osmotic shock since it was drops added to algae on a microscope slide.

 

[jason2459]

I actually thought about that microscope observation of yours when I learned about what was in it. Tempting to conclude that you observed the polyquat disrupting the cells - which is expected behavior, but it could also have simply been osmotic shock since it was drops added to algae on a microscope slide.

What's interesting is when left to evaporate it left behind a rather viscous substance. I would hypothesize that AlgaeFix may do the same if they are the same product or very similar.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

What's interesting is when left to evaporate it left behind a rather viscous substance. I would hypothesize that AlgaeFix may do the same if they are the same product or very similar.

That's what one expects of a material like that. It will powder when totally dried, but will be viscous and noncrystalline before that.

 

[taricha]

Yep @jason2459 you're right. see 3c

 

[Nonya]

So has anyone compiled a list of products that have definitely been proven to either have made false claims , or have proven harmful to aquariums?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So has anyone compiled a list of products that have definitely been proven to either have made false claims , or have proven harmful to aquariums?

No, and there will be different opinions on what qualifies.

 

[Bugger]

You know I recall when Vibrant first came out and the company kept talking so highly about the product. lol They must have made a ton of money. There was a whole forum on the product with rave reviews. Its kind of shameful.

All that needs to happen is have Randy give a stamp of approval to all products that don't mislead. A simple stamp on the product sticker, or label with your face or reef2reef avatar could set the whole thing right.
You have the power to do anything.
Set up a page on the forum with all the products you approve of. Send out some stickers to the companies. Reef2Reef could get involved. People and their tanks need you Randy

 

[KrisReef]

I prefer crystals, mini-Buddha statues, incense and candles. I'm having trouble testing those params, though.

The challenge is to separate the truth from fiction, and people all struggle to make progress when so many false claims are foisted everything begins to come into doubt.
I had a friend who claimed grounding would help, and there may be something to it, or not?

The effects of grounding (earthing) on inflammation, the immune response, wound healing, and prevention and treatment of chronic inflammatory and autoimmune diseases

Multi-disciplinary research has revealed that electrically conductive contact of the human body with the surface of the Earth (grounding or earthing) produces intriguing effects on physiology and health. Such effects relate to inflammation, immune responses, ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

NIH was more believable before that virus killed the discussions.

 

[Nonya]

The challenge is to separate the truth from fiction, and people all struggle to make progress when so many false claims are foisted everything begins to come into doubt.
I had a friend who claimed grounding would help, and there may be something to it, or not?

If you ever felt stray current in an ungrounded tank, then yes, grounding is essential for safety.