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10K.
Coral Boring Spionid Worms- Anybody Killed them?
- Thread starter Reefahholic
- Start date
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BristleWormHater
2500 Club Member
I agree they are so nasty, very lucky to not have any at the moment.That’s about where I’m at. I finally avoided Vermetid snails though blood sweat and tears of sterile conditions trying to keep them out in the beginning only to realize boring Spionid worms are worse and even more annoying. I always hated when I had a beautiful acro base with freakin’ Vermetid snails coming up through it. That’s super annoying! When you break the little dirt tubes of Spionid’s, they multiply much faster and make a bigger colony. Frustrating! See pic below. Do you want a beautiful acro base in your pictures or a base full of Spionid dirt spike tubes. It really slows down some corals and takes away my joy. Looking at them daily starts to wear on you.
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Here’s a quick summary of Kenny Lee’s treatment who resides in Vietnam:
Disclaimer:
Everything summarized here is my own personal experience. I will not take responsibility for anybody trying this treatment. It could lead to a tank crash. I don't recommend it. Every tank can react differently.
I have used Ivermectin 1% many times to dip my corals. My tank is 330 gallons, and now 2 years old. I have over 100 species of coral. I didn’t have any problems with AEFW or Bugs, but I did have issues with Spionid worms.
I have followed my friend Reefahholic’s thread about this issue, and decided to use Ivermectin in my tank. Previously, I've dipped at a dose of 3.2mL per gallon for 1 hour, and it worked well for AEFW and Spionid worms.
I decided to use a 45mL dose for my tank. That dose is around 4-5mL for 100/L. That night, around 8:30pm, I was a bit drunk, and maybe the alcohol made me bolder! I removed the activated carbon, turned off the UV, Ozone, removed the Skimmer cup, and put in a Wool filter. Before that, I tried to remove most of the snails from my tank for 3 consecutive days. Then I poured 45mL into my tank. I watched for about 15 minutes. The first immediate reaction was the corals released their slime. All the polyps closed. pH and ORP lowered a bit, and at that moment the lights went out. I left it alone and went home to sleep. The next morning at 6:00 a.m. I went back to look, turned on the light and realized that some of the remaining snails were dead. Four of my wrasses were lying on the floor but the fish's mouth and gills were still breathing. I immediately noticed a lot of slime had accumulated in the overflow close to the places where there were Spionid worms. They came out of the tubes. I used some Tweezers to pick them up and pull them out. They are quite long! The longest one was about 10cm. Of course, sometimes when I take them out, I will break them…HaHa. There were quite a lot of worms! Under the Sump Refugium, and in the filter wool there were a lot of Copepods. I had to buy more to replenish them.
Later, all the corals put out their polyps again. There was zero damage even to the most exquisite species. Neither did any of the most difficult tangs have issues. Achilles did well and also completely normal.
ORP decreased about 40 points, pH decreased about 0.05 pH units. I performed a 20% water change, which was about 240/L (Approx 63 gallons of the total water volume of (330/G). After replacing the water, I put the Rox 0.8 Carbon back in, turned on the UV, Ozone, and put the skimmer cup back on. The skimmer still went crazy. I lowered it to the lowest level, and fully opened the valve. Then I went to work. When I returned in the afternoon, a wrasse had died. He was caught in a wave maker. I also collected all the remaining dead snails in the system. I noticed the coral polyp extension is extremely good! There were no signs of stress.
About 12 days later, I decided to do a second dose to make sure nothing was left behind. I reduced the dose to 25mL last night, and this morning I had the same results. There was no damage, because I removed all the Wrasse out of the tank prior to starting the treatment, but the strange thing was that my Foxface Fiji was on the floor. I caught him and this afternoon when I got home he luckily recovered. No more Spionid’s were detected coming out of the tubes.
In short, according to my personal experience, Ivermectin is quite gentle on corals. It’s harsh on worms and snails. Wrasse will have problems if they eat worms that die due to the drug. After using the drug twice, the water never become cloudy. That is a good thing. This makes me believe that it doesn't affect the microbiology that much.
Disclaimer:
Everything summarized here is my own personal experience. I will not take responsibility for anybody trying this treatment. It could lead to a tank crash. I don't recommend it. Every tank can react differently.
I have used Ivermectin 1% many times to dip my corals. My tank is 330 gallons, and now 2 years old. I have over 100 species of coral. I didn’t have any problems with AEFW or Bugs, but I did have issues with Spionid worms.
I have followed my friend Reefahholic’s thread about this issue, and decided to use Ivermectin in my tank. Previously, I've dipped at a dose of 3.2mL per gallon for 1 hour, and it worked well for AEFW and Spionid worms.
I decided to use a 45mL dose for my tank. That dose is around 4-5mL for 100/L. That night, around 8:30pm, I was a bit drunk, and maybe the alcohol made me bolder! I removed the activated carbon, turned off the UV, Ozone, removed the Skimmer cup, and put in a Wool filter. Before that, I tried to remove most of the snails from my tank for 3 consecutive days. Then I poured 45mL into my tank. I watched for about 15 minutes. The first immediate reaction was the corals released their slime. All the polyps closed. pH and ORP lowered a bit, and at that moment the lights went out. I left it alone and went home to sleep. The next morning at 6:00 a.m. I went back to look, turned on the light and realized that some of the remaining snails were dead. Four of my wrasses were lying on the floor but the fish's mouth and gills were still breathing. I immediately noticed a lot of slime had accumulated in the overflow close to the places where there were Spionid worms. They came out of the tubes. I used some Tweezers to pick them up and pull them out. They are quite long! The longest one was about 10cm. Of course, sometimes when I take them out, I will break them…HaHa. There were quite a lot of worms! Under the Sump Refugium, and in the filter wool there were a lot of Copepods. I had to buy more to replenish them.
Later, all the corals put out their polyps again. There was zero damage even to the most exquisite species. Neither did any of the most difficult tangs have issues. Achilles did well and also completely normal.
ORP decreased about 40 points, pH decreased about 0.05 pH units. I performed a 20% water change, which was about 240/L (Approx 63 gallons of the total water volume of (330/G). After replacing the water, I put the Rox 0.8 Carbon back in, turned on the UV, Ozone, and put the skimmer cup back on. The skimmer still went crazy. I lowered it to the lowest level, and fully opened the valve. Then I went to work. When I returned in the afternoon, a wrasse had died. He was caught in a wave maker. I also collected all the remaining dead snails in the system. I noticed the coral polyp extension is extremely good! There were no signs of stress.
About 12 days later, I decided to do a second dose to make sure nothing was left behind. I reduced the dose to 25mL last night, and this morning I had the same results. There was no damage, because I removed all the Wrasse out of the tank prior to starting the treatment, but the strange thing was that my Foxface Fiji was on the floor. I caught him and this afternoon when I got home he luckily recovered. No more Spionid’s were detected coming out of the tubes.
In short, according to my personal experience, Ivermectin is quite gentle on corals. It’s harsh on worms and snails. Wrasse will have problems if they eat worms that die due to the drug. After using the drug twice, the water never become cloudy. That is a good thing. This makes me believe that it doesn't affect the microbiology that much.
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OP
A few pics of his sump with this second treatment:
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Also, a couple shots of the tank after the second treatment:
Solo McReefer
Valuable Member
Bet it doesn't get Covid
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Ivermectin Pre-Treatment prep/check list:
Prepare and Mix (2) 32/G Brutes with NSW (Red Sea Blue) to appropriate temp, salinity, etc.
Pre-draw all Ivermectin dose’s in syringes. Will start with 1mL dose (10mg) and increase by 2mL increments (20mg) every 15 minutes
per 100/G volume observing from dose to dose while voice texting live to notes.
Prepare Siphon hoses near tank for water changes and die-off removal.
Prepare 8” (10 Micron) Filter Socks in sump for continuous siphoning if needed. Don’t forget to siphon drain chamber and overflow boxes.
Dial Skimmer to lowest setting and raise it 3-6”. Open value. Remove skimmer cup. Put bowl or plate over the top if splashing too much.
Cut airlines and setup Fluval Q2 Air Pump with air stone in Overflow box.
Setup Hospital tank with matching salinity and temp. Add air stones for good aeration/oxygenation for stunned fish that are unable to be removed before treatment.
Deploy Power-Filters on each side of tank with Sera Filter Wool.
Position 8” Filter Cup in sump with Sera Filter Wool.
Pre-cut and position extra filter wool for both Power-Filters and Filter Cup.
Position 3 Fine Mesh Nets close to tank with open garbage can.
Remove any existing GAC and prepare new fluidized reactor with fresh GAC. Also measure out two more quantities for later use.
Prepare all testing equipment by tank at kitchen counter. Test… KH, P, N, Ca, & Mg just prior to dosing. ICP-MS results will be here today 07/26. Aquabiomics Microbiome testing (pre/post) will also deliver today. Will send out tomorrow.
Clean and Calibrate pH probes.
Stop GHL nutrient dosing for 5 days or until testing indicates otherwise. Stop organic carbon for 24-48 hrs.
Prepare Waste Away (Dose if nutrients are rising significantly by 72 hr mark. If rising by 48 hrs restart Organic Carbon.
Relocate all loose frags and frag racks to sump.
Scrape back glass to observe/monitor new biofilm/ color over next two weeks. Compare with current pre-treatment pictures to assess destabilization, stability, nutrients, etc.
Prepare towels and floor for a lot of water dripping from nets and siphoning.
Remove all Snails from the system.
Check CO2 Scrubber media, replace if needed.
What am I missing? I feel like I’m forgetting something.
Prepare and Mix (2) 32/G Brutes with NSW (Red Sea Blue) to appropriate temp, salinity, etc.
Pre-draw all Ivermectin dose’s in syringes. Will start with 1mL dose (10mg) and increase by 2mL increments (20mg) every 15 minutes
per 100/G volume observing from dose to dose while voice texting live to notes.
Prepare Siphon hoses near tank for water changes and die-off removal.
Prepare 8” (10 Micron) Filter Socks in sump for continuous siphoning if needed. Don’t forget to siphon drain chamber and overflow boxes.
Dial Skimmer to lowest setting and raise it 3-6”. Open value. Remove skimmer cup. Put bowl or plate over the top if splashing too much.
Cut airlines and setup Fluval Q2 Air Pump with air stone in Overflow box.
Setup Hospital tank with matching salinity and temp. Add air stones for good aeration/oxygenation for stunned fish that are unable to be removed before treatment.
Deploy Power-Filters on each side of tank with Sera Filter Wool.
Position 8” Filter Cup in sump with Sera Filter Wool.
Pre-cut and position extra filter wool for both Power-Filters and Filter Cup.
Position 3 Fine Mesh Nets close to tank with open garbage can.
Remove any existing GAC and prepare new fluidized reactor with fresh GAC. Also measure out two more quantities for later use.
Prepare all testing equipment by tank at kitchen counter. Test… KH, P, N, Ca, & Mg just prior to dosing. ICP-MS results will be here today 07/26. Aquabiomics Microbiome testing (pre/post) will also deliver today. Will send out tomorrow.
Clean and Calibrate pH probes.
Stop GHL nutrient dosing for 5 days or until testing indicates otherwise. Stop organic carbon for 24-48 hrs.
Prepare Waste Away (Dose if nutrients are rising significantly by 72 hr mark. If rising by 48 hrs restart Organic Carbon.
Relocate all loose frags and frag racks to sump.
Scrape back glass to observe/monitor new biofilm/ color over next two weeks. Compare with current pre-treatment pictures to assess destabilization, stability, nutrients, etc.
Prepare towels and floor for a lot of water dripping from nets and siphoning.
Remove all Snails from the system.
Check CO2 Scrubber media, replace if needed.
What am I missing? I feel like I’m forgetting something.
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OP
ICP-MS pre-treatment and DOC value (SAC254).
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Aquabiomics Microbiome collected and shipped….
OP
OP
I may be leading my tank into the ditch, but it will be fun! I’ll get to see the Spionid's come down with me. If it survives…it could be very beneficial for the corals. Willing to take that chance to crash it for better health w/o the worms. I want to see them grow unhindered.
Last edited:
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Thx bro. Fingers crossed. Getting closer. Wednesday morning at the lastest.
BRS Mini Reactor installed and ready to go. It’s the perfect size for my 100/G volume, and Rox 0.8 GAC. The dose/amount is 10 TBS or 0.63 cups. The Reactor holds 3/4 cup.
Carbon Media Calculator - Bulk Reef Supply
Bulk Reef Supply - Saltwater Aquarium Supplies for Reef Tanks
www.bulkreefsupply.com
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Minifoot77
Jack of all trades and a master of none
Did he do another treatment after only losing a wrasse?
OP
OP
Yes, he just finished the second treatment. The 2nd treatment took his Foxface down, but I think it recovered. Corals still doing great. Consumption is up even after increasing the KH several times. One thing is for sure…fish need to be removed. We knew that from the start though.
I think the corals are stressing so much in that 1-3 hr initial dose period due to toxin’s being released by all the microorganisms dying in the water column. We’re not seeing that happen in the dips with much stronger doses.
Minifoot77
Jack of all trades and a master of none
Changing filter socks or running an over the side polishing filter might be a way to look into helping get everything out of the water column
Minifoot77
Jack of all trades and a master of none
Next test should be to find something aptasia die from that won't hurt corals...
OP
OP
Yes, a lot of changing filter cup wool, power-filters, and socks I’ll be siphoning into. Will be fun for the first 2-4 hours. Heh.
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