Please do a review/ article on the massive amount of red sea tank failures for the last five years

[YOYOYOReefer]

I simply indicated that your generalization was a silly because it was from an obtuse and biased context.

If you want to see acrylic tank failures, search for them.

As for providing data - you made the assertion, you should be the one backing it up with data.

So, please directly cite aquarium manufacturers and said language, not "common knowledge", that silicone and glass aquariums must be resealed every 10 years.

Furthermore, please compile the statistical data showing the failure rates of silicone and glass aquariums by years in service.

I am sure those following along will find the information very useful.

In the meantime, I have to go feed my fish that are swimming around in a 25+ year old glass and silicone aquarium.

No need to. it’s common knowledge. just try Google. Glass tank makers don’t point out their flaws or publish such data, sometimes You have to think for yourself. . And your old glass tank does not show anything except yours was built well ,I have 100 plus gallon acrylic tanks that have been moved several times and don’t expect any leaks lol The one in our gameroom has taken a cue ball full force right in the middle and it didn’t crack. Let’s try that on a glass tank Are bullit proof windows made of glass or acrylic? Which will last longer?

 

[DIYreefer]

In the meantime, I have to go feed my fish that are swimming around in a 25+ year old glass and silicone aquarium.

 
Same. Thanks for the lunch time reminder. I bought my tank used and forget exactly how long the original owner had it for, but I know it's well over 20 years old now. Holds water just fine

 

[BeanAnimal]

No need to. it’s common knowledge. just try Google.

Thanks, I prefer facts and science, not internet lore.

Glass tank makers don’t point out their flaws or publish such data, sometimes You have to think for yourself.

Says the person citing “common knowledge’

. And your old glass tank does not show anything except yours was built well ,I have 100 plus gallon acrylic tanks that have been moved several times and don’t expect any leaks lol

Well gee wiz, if we apply that logic, that must not show anything other than your acrylic tanks must be built well too then.

The one in our gameroom has taken a cue ball full force right in the middle and it didn’t crack. Let’s try that on a glass tank Are bullit proof windows made of glass or acrylic? Which will last longer?

What does a pool ball have to do with seam failure? That is like me saying my cleaning lady used windex, goo-gone and a green scratchpad on my aquarium, trying to get the sharpie and paint marker off after neighbors kids were left unattended… try that with you acrylic aquarium. It has nothing to do with the topic or my statement about your silly assertion that all glass aquarium fail and acrylic aquariums do not.


FWIW: Bullet ‘proof’ windows are made of Glass, Acrylic, Polycarbonate and other transparent materials And resins, including some ceramics and now hybrid metals. I beams are made of steel and donuts are made of flour - none of that has anything too do with this topic.

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

 
Same. Thanks for the lunch time reminder. I bought my tank used and forget exactly how long the original owner had it for, but I know it's well over 20 years old now. Holds water just fine

Ya. bet yours probably has top bracing? These red seas don’t have any bracing up top. Ive got old oceanic tanks too that don’t leak, again they were built right. But I don’t pretend that silicone has an infinite lifetime.

Thanks, I prefer facts and science, not internet lore.



Says the person citing “common knowledge’


Well gee wiz, if we apply that logic, that must not show anything other than your acrylic tanks must be built well too then.


What does a pool ball have to do with seam failure? That is like me saying my cleaning lady used windex, goo-gone and a green scratchpad on my aquarium, trying to get the sharpie and paint marker off after neighbors kids were left unattended… try that with you acrylic aquarium. It has nothing to do with the topic or my statement about your silly assertion that all glass aquarium fail and acrylic aquari

you are missing the point. In a glass tank it relies on seals of silicone On acrylic tank there are no seals. And have never seen any commercially built acrylic tanks without top bracing. Much strongreconstruction all around. these Red Sea tanks are always gonna fail at some point with no top bracing , and the lifetime of the silicone is the factor there … is more like how long till they fail. Best ppractice would be to reseal any of these leakers or seams that are about to go , and brace the top if you want it to last

 

[BeanAnimal]

you are missing the point.

I am not missing anything. You simply changed the topic.

In a glass tank it relies on seals of silicone

When was this debated and who argued otherwise?

And have never seen any commercially built acrylic tanks without top bracing.

And I have never seen one with a tutu and neither the bracing or the tutu have anything to do with your initial (silly) comments or my response.

Much strongreconstruction all around.

I would look toward titanium and carbon fiber for stromger construction all around. It would also hold up better under high G stress and thermal expansion and contraction due to atmospheric friction. Ohh wait, that’s not the topic either.

these Red Sea tanks are always gonna fail at some point with no top bracing , and the lifetime of the silicone is the factor there … is more like how long till they fail

There are more factors than just top bracing. I outlined my thoughts many many pages ago. In a nutshell I think there are multiple contributing factors from engineering to materials to QC, not a single flaw.

That however is its own topic (and relevant to this thread) and a departure from the your statement that “all glass tanks fail and need new silicone every 10 years and acrylic tanks do not fail”…. The comment (silly) that started our exchange and your wandering points.

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

Yet all,old house windows need new silicone. wonder why that is? And ya the structural integrity of a box is stronger if it has a top. Maybe simple physics are too complicated for you

 

[BeanAnimal]

Yet all,old house windows need new silicone. wonder why that is? And ya the structural integrity of a box is stronger if it has a top.

Except, we are not talking about old house windows or the strength of various types of box construction.

FWIW - old house windows don't have silicone, they have glazing compound, which historically was linseed oil whiting (calcium carbonate) and other materials that set hard over time... AKA "glaziers putty". Many also use bituminous materials, as did old aquariums... where were we?

Maybe simple physics are too complicated for you

I am not sure that personal insults are warranted or needed or that there were any physics in any context whatsoever in our conversation being debated.

As far as physics, I certainly do accept your challenge. Unless of course your insult was not meant to imply that your grasp of the topic is superior to mine.

So please feel free to pick a neutral moderator and proctored testing venue or methodology. I will pick up the tab for the testing and results. The subject can be general physics, applied physics and/or include any subset such as fluid dynamics, thermodynamics, magnetism, electricity, space, time, relativity or geology. I am a bit weak in astronomy, but think I can hold my own.

Or wait... did you mean to say engineering instead of physics. While physics provides the laws and theory that govern the materials and interactions, it is engineering that we use to design said box and calculate its structural integrity. In any case, engineering or physics, you chose. What are we wagering if I may ask?

 

[brandon429]

make a competing thread that documents break incidence in any other brand

i made this one because the examples pour in weekly without any hunting effort, break owners can log patterns

 

[brandon429]

I have seen a waterbox break mention and one oceanic break mention recently (by owners here not from random internet searches) so try and find 30 of them and log them

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

Yoyo

make a competing thread that documents break incidence in any other brand

i made this one because Red Sea is terrible, and the examples pour in weekly without any hunting effort assuming for the next two years.


we will compare your number of breaks to this one. That’s how to battle this thread, apples to apples.

you own a Red Sea tank it seems, is that right

Red Sea owners have the most problems simply reading an account of others massive loss rate. Rarely does a non Red Sea owner care as much

Except, we are not talking about old house windows or the strength of various types of box construction.


I am not sure that personal insults are warranted or needed or that there were any physics in any context whatsoever in our conversation, being debated.

As far as physics, I certainly do accept your challenge. Unless of course your insult was not meant to imply that your grasp of the topic is superior to mine.

So please feel free to pick a neutral moderator and proctored testing venue or methodology. I will pick up the tab for the testing and results. The subject can be general physics, applied physics and/or include any subset such as fluid dynamics, thermodynamics, magnetism, electricity, space, time, relativity or geology. I am a bit weak in astronomy, but think I can hold my own.

Or wait... did you mean to say engineering instead of physics. While physics provides the laws and theory that govern the materials and interactions, it is engineering that we use to design said box and calculate its structural integrity. In any case, engineering or physics, you chose. What are we wagering if I may ask?

ok Let’s both build cube tanks apples to apples. Ive built plenty acrylic tanks which you seem to be aware of, which Red Sea model will be you be presenting as your champion I will use same dimensions. Mine will be eurobraced and your Red Sea tank will lose without any top bracing.
How do you suggest the test be conducted. Just simply putting pressure on 2 walls at once or on all 4 till a seam blows ? Or till the glass or acrylic cracks? what’s your definition of a failure / winner?

Bet my simple physics wins over your badly engineered design Cell cast is only 10 times stronger than glass so it will be an easy win for acrylic. That’s a fact not internet lore. check out any acrylic vendor site like tap plasics if you can’t grasp that simple fact. Which you seem to not be able to grasp. acrylic tank Seams are stronger than glass tanks with silicone. It’s not even debatable.

as far as a bet name your wager and the conditions for the testing.

 

[brandon429]

Nice

 

[brandon429]

Why not just let this thread exist for testimonies of breaks, that’s what it is

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

He drew first blood. Sorry didn’t mean to wreck your thread bout the poor design of the Red Sea tanks. Peace


Back to the topic ya bought a guys whole saltwater setup and it came with a Red Sea tank. and the seam was already doing the same thing at the bottom ,so took it apart , resealed it and it’s eurobraced. The stand had small feet and was a bad design too. Been working just fine probably 2 years. It’s an ato tank now and sits on the floor where it belongs .

 

[BeanAnimal]

ok Let’s both build cube tanks apples to apples. Ive built plenty acrylic tanks which you seem to be aware of, which Red Sea model will be you be presenting as your champion I will use same dimensions. Mine will be eurobraced and your Red Sea tank will lose without any top bracing.

I (very honestly) have no idea what you are talking about or who you are arguing with or what your actual point is, you are all over the place.

Moreover, I don't care for RedSea aquariums and given my prior comments on this subject, would not own one or present one as my "champion" to whatever misplaced challenge you are presenting.

How do you suggest the test be conducted. Just simply putting pressure on 2 walls at once or on all 4 till a seam blows ? Or till the glass or acrylic cracks? what’s your definition of a failure / winner?

Well I put water, rock, fish and coral in my aquariums and trust, hope and expect that they are designed to safely hold said items under normal conditions, as well as minor adverse events like a small temblor, construction vibrations or fat uncle bob leaning in to get a better look.

Apples to apples, you pick your favorite apple and I will pick mine. Shall we smash them with a 10 ton press or fling them at a wall from a trebuchet? Do we judge on the best apple sauce or which apples skin remains more intact?

What on earth does any of this have to do with your (silly) comment that "100 percent of glass aquariums fail and acrylic aquariums don't fail and glass aquariums need to have their silicone replaced every 10 years"

Bet my simple physics wins over your badly engineered design Cell cast is only 10 times stronger than glass so it will be an easy win for acrylic. That’s a fact not internet lore.

I was not aware that the physical properties of the two materials were in debate or said properties were labeled "internet lore" by anyone.

You said that it was "common knowledge" that silicone in glass aquariums must be replaced every 10 years (several times) and said to google it. That is what was labeled as silly internet lore.

check out any acrylic vendor site like tap plasics if you can’t grasp that simple fact.
Which you seem to not be able to grasp.

Again with the insults, yet nobody is even debating the properties of acrylic or glass.

acrylic tank Seams are stronger than glass tanks with silicone. It’s not even debatable.

as far as a bet name your wager and the conditions for the testing.

Wager about what? Not one time have I mentioned strength differences between solvent welds or silicone. You are stuck on that tangent of your own accord.

Let's recap:

You said 100% of glass tanks fail.
You said acrylic tanks don't fail.
You said glass tanks MUST have their silicone replaced every 10 years, per manufacturer and common knowledge.

I said that 100 percent of humans will die, 100 percent of stars will burn out and acrylic aquariums do fail. Gross generalities are useless.

Instead of directly responding you keep bouncing from topic to topic, none of which have any relevance to those initial comments or my responses.

 

[DIYreefer]

Ya. bet yours probably has top bracing? These red seas don’t have any bracing up top. Ive got old oceanic tanks too that don’t leak, again they were built right.

It does, and ironically, it's an Oceanic. Lol.

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

I (very honestly) have no idea what you are talking about or who you are arguing with or what your actual point is, you are all over the place.

Moreover, I don't care for RedSea aquariums and given my prior comments on this subject, would not own one or present one as my "champion" to whatever misplaced challenge you are presenting.


Well I put water, rock, fish and coral in my aquariums and trust, hope and expect that they are designed to safely hold said items under normal conditions, as well as minor adverse events like a small temblor, construction vibrations or fat uncle bob leaning in to get a better look.

Apples to apples, you pick your favorite apple and I will pick mine. Shall we smash them with a 10 ton press or fling them at a wall from a trebuchet? Do we judge on the best apple sauce or which apples skin remains more intact?

What on earth does any of this have to do with your (silly) comment that "100 percent of glass aquariums fail and acrylic aquariums don't fail and glass aquariums need to have their silicone replaced every 10 years"


I was not aware that the physical properties of the two materials were in debate or said properties were labeled "internet lore" by anyone.

You said that it was "common knowledge" that silicone in glass aquariums must be replaced every 10 years (several times) and said to google it. That is what was labeled as silly internet lore.


Again with the insults, yet nobody is even debating the properties of acrylic or glass.


Wager about what? Not one time have I mentioned strength differences between solvent welds or silicone. You are stuck on that tangent of your own accord.

Let's recap:

You said 100% of glass tanks fail.
You said acrylic tanks don't fail.
You said glass tanks MUST have their silicone replaced every 10 years, per manufacturer and common knowledge.

I said that 100 percent of humans will die, 100 percent of stars will burn out and acrylic aquariums do fail. Gross generalities are useless.

Instead of directly responding you keep bouncing from topic to topic, none of which have any relevance to those initial comments or my responses.

Man you just can’t admit that acrylic is stronger than glass. It’s that simple

 

[Cell]

This thread has nothing to do with acrylic tanks.

 

[Oldreefer44]

For most of us it is not about strength. I have owned both glass and acrylic and it only took one acrylic tank for me to never consider one again largely due to how easily it scratches. My latest purchase was from what I consider to be a higher end manufacturer because the extra cost is worth it to me so I don't have to worry about 200 gal. of water all over my office. Let alone some very expensive corals and fish. Not everyone has that option.
When a brand, regardless of the product, is designed to appeal to potential customers based on price point versus quality then IMO, the person purchasing it needs to take into account the risks of doing so. IMO, Red Sea marketed their initial products based on the above therefore appealing to a larger customer base. That larger customer base allows them to have a higher failure rate and still maintain profitability up to a point. From what I can see, they have made improvements such as metal stand frames that should help with the primary issues.

 

[brandon429]

I would never ever ever reef with acrylic for that same reason

By leaving all their gen1 buyers in the dust as beta testers, rs deserves to be canceled.

By taking no proactive measure to contact g1 owners before the break, and then downplaying 100% after the fact and offering lame compensation for reactive breaks only they deserve to be out of business. There's no justification for this

My nine dollar wal mart vase has better integrity than a thousand dollar g1 what a ripoff for rs customers

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

Yet I have all acrylic no scratches. They make plastic scrapers , And unlike glass can buff out acrylic , and glass scratches are not gonna buff out. , especially starphire it scratches the easiest