DIY Ammonia dosing for low nitrate systems

[Harpo]

Randy, you mentioned in your first post that the Ammonium Chloride could be included in an ATO. I'm currently using Kalk in my ATO. Could these be combined?

Thanks

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy, you mentioned in your first post that the Ammonium Chloride could be included in an ATO. I'm currently using Kalk in my ATO. Could these be combined?

Thanks

I would not, but it’s not impossible. Kalk pH is so high that it becomes nearly all NH3 in the water and can smell strongly as the ammonia evaporates. I once let my di deplete and ammonia from chloramine got into it. It smelled of ammonia.

 

[martinsp]

I have a 225 gallon highly stocked SPS System, my nitrates are usually very low and the coral will deplete NO3 to 0ppm in a day or so if i stop dosing.
I been dosing nitrates with Calcium Nitrate.
My solution contains 125grams CaNO3 per liter.
I'm dosing 10ml per day with a doser, and it keeps my nitrates around 5ppm

I want to switch to dosing Ammonia instead.
How many grams of ammonium bicarbonate per liter should i use to match the potency of my current CaNO3 solution?
Is dosing Ammonium hydroxide a viable option?
If i want to dose Ammonium hydroxide which product should i use?

Thanks!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I have a 225 gallon highly stocked SPS System, my nitrates are usually very low and the coral will deplete NO3 to 0ppm in a day or so if i stop dosing.
I been dosing nitrates with Calcium Nitrate.
My solution contains 125grams CaNO3 per liter.
I'm dosing 10ml per day with a doser, and it keeps my nitrates around 5ppm

I want to switch to dosing Ammonia instead.
How many grams of ammonium bicarbonate per liter should i use to match the potency of my current CaNO3 solution?
Is dosing Ammonium hydroxide a viable option?
If i want to dose Ammonium hydroxide which product should i use?

Thanks!

Why would you want to dose ammonium hydroxide?

 

[martinsp]

Why would you want to dose ammonium hydroxide saw an interview with mike paletta he said he started dosing ammonium hydroxide. I'm ok with dosing Ammonium Bicarbonate.

Why would you want to dos ammonium hydroxide?

I saw an interview with Mike Paletta and he said he is dosing ammonium hydroxide. i wanted to know if that's a viable option? how strong can i make an ammonium bicorbonate solution? I'm dosing CaNO3 @ 125grams/liter.

 

[drawman]

I saw an interview with Mike Paletta and he said he is dosing ammonium hydroxide. i wanted to know if that's a viable option? how strong can i make an ammonium bicorbonate solution? I'm dosing CaNO3 @ 125grams/liter.

Maybe he misspoke? I've heard him say he's dosing ammonium bicarbonate.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I saw an interview with Mike Paletta and he said he is dosing ammonium hydroxide. i wanted to know if that's a viable option? how strong can i make an ammonium bicorbonate solution? I'm dosing CaNO3 @ 125grams/liter.

It’s an option, I just see no advantage of it over ammonium bicarbonate. If you can get food grade and can keep the ammonia from evaporating, it will work.

You can make ammonium bicarbonate stronger than my recipe, or even your nitrate recipe, but there’s no advantage to high potency and the drawback is a dosing error may push ammonia up a lot more.

To match 125 g/L calcium nitrate, you’d use 120 g/L ammonium bicarbonate. Solubility at 25 deg C is about 248 g/L.

 

[DangerDave]

I've been manually dosing ammonium bicarbonate sporadically since Randy started this thread. At first it was in my display tank, which sprung a leak and has since been taken down (I believe a coral grew through the silicone!) The current tank is a 4x8 frag tank, total system is about 425 gallons. It's fishless, just corals, some flower nems, and the cleanup crew (150ish snails, 30 blue legs, and about 8 pitho crabs) currently. I've been dosing about 40-50 ml of Randy's suggested mixture, i have to dose nitrates to keep it from bottoming out. As a note I'm also dosing phosphate, iodide, and H202 via an oxydator.

I want to up the dosage of ammonia to the point I can stop dosing nitrates altogether. I'm not sure how I want to dose it, or how much. I'm going to start at 60ML and go up from there. Should I program my Dos to do 6 doses of 10ml a day, or let the apex meter it out over the 24hr period?

Dave

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I've been manually dosing ammonium bicarbonate sporadically since Randy started this thread. At first it was in my display tank, which sprung a leak and has since been taken down (I believe a coral grew through the silicone!) The current tank is a 4x8 frag tank, total system is about 425 gallons. It's fishless, just corals, some flower nems, and the cleanup crew (150ish snails, 30 blue legs, and about 8 pitho crabs) currently. I've been dosing about 40-50 ml of Randy's suggested mixture, i have to dose nitrates to keep it from bottoming out. As a note I'm also dosing phosphate, iodide, and H202 via an oxydator.

I want to up the dosage of ammonia to the point I can stop dosing nitrates altogether. I'm not sure how I want to dose it, or how much. I'm going to start at 60ML and go up from there. Should I program my Dos to do 6 doses of 10ml a day, or let the apex meter it out over the 24hr period?

Dave

I don’t know what sort of delivery control is best, but it is important to have confidence it won’t run wild somehow.

 

[martinsp]

It’s an option, I just see no advantage of it over ammonium bicarbonate. If you can get food grade and can keep the ammonia from evaporating, it will work.

You can make ammonium bicarbonate stronger than my recipe, or even your nitrate recipe, but there’s no advantage to high potency and the drawback is a dosing error may push ammonia up a lot more.

To match 125 g/L calcium nitrate, you’d use 120 g/L ammonium bicarbonate. Solubility at 25 deg C is about 248 g/L.

I was thinking to prevent evaporation make a dosing container with a check valve on the vent, this way way i can only allow air to come into the container as the liquid is dosed.
Will this work?

 

[Big E]

I've been manually dosing ammonium bicarbonate sporadically since Randy started this thread. At first it was in my display tank, which sprung a leak and has since been taken down (I believe a coral grew through the silicone!) The current tank is a 4x8 frag tank, total system is about 425 gallons. It's fishless, just corals, some flower nems, and the cleanup crew (150ish snails, 30 blue legs, and about 8 pitho crabs) currently. I've been dosing about 40-50 ml of Randy's suggested mixture, i have to dose nitrates to keep it from bottoming out. As a note I'm also dosing phosphate, iodide, and H202 via an oxydator.

I want to up the dosage of ammonia to the point I can stop dosing nitrates altogether. I'm not sure how I want to dose it, or how much. I'm going to start at 60ML and go up from there. Should I program my Dos to do 6 doses of 10ml a day, or let the apex meter it out over the 24hr period?

Dave

Am I reading this right? No fish in a 425 gallon system?

If so get some fish in there, they fix a lot of things fast and it's going to create a more natural way than throwing in a bunch of chemicals.

 

[DangerDave]

Am I reading this right? No fish in a 425 gallon system?

If so get some fish in there, they fix a lot of things fast and it's going to create a more natural way than throwing in a bunch of chemicals.

This is the first time I've been fishless. It wasn't the plan, but I'm finding the environment a bit more controllable/predictable. I'm sure I'll eventually get some to full a few clean up crew roles I have open.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

This is the first time I've been fishless. It wasn't the plan, but I'm finding the environment a bit more controllable/predictable. I'm sure I'll eventually get some to full a few clean up crew roles I have open.

I would not be so critical of one manually adding the same forms of N and P that fish excrete. It’s stretching it a bit to criticize it as unnatural, IMO.

 

[Miami Reef]

I agree that dosing ammonium and phosphate is not considered dosing “chemicals,” implying it’s unnatural and unsafe, I do think there are also additional benefits of feeding particulate foods to corals.

 

[Justin A.]

Since through dosing ammonia your providing the needed nitrogen is there any opinion as to what nitrate levels to aim for? Or is it more so to just have a detectable amount of nitrates to know that your meeting the demand through the ammonia dosing.

I have had chronically low Nitrate and Phosphate, literally 0s for a long time, and just began dosing ammonium bicarbonate and neophos since i was getting some tip down recession i feel was due to lack of nutrients. So far the recession stopped on a couple pieces which is a positive, i did overdose phosphates so results are still pending.

Based on the stock solution from Randys first post I've been dosing roughly 4ml ammonium bicarbonate in a rsr250 daily for two weeks. Nitrates were finally detected yesterday but are still low 0.5-1 - which could still be a 0 with +/- accuracy. I am just happy to finally have some type of reading other than 0 but I'm unsure of how to adjust my ammonia dosing.

I just put it on my doser instead of dosing the full amount in one shot. To what extent is there concern with dosing "too much" ammonia? Is just having a detectable amount of nitrates the point where one should stop adjustments and go to a maintenance dose amount?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Since through dosing ammonia your providing the needed nitrogen is there any opinion as to what nitrate levels to aim for? Or is it more so to just have a detectable amount of nitrates to know that your meeting the demand through the ammonia dosing.

I have had chronically low Nitrate and Phosphate, literally 0s for a long time, and just began dosing ammonium bicarbonate and neophos since i was getting some tip down recession i feel was due to lack of nutrients. So far the recession stopped on a couple pieces which is a positive, i did overdose phosphates so results are still pending.

Based on the stock solution from Randys first post I've been dosing roughly 4ml ammonium bicarbonate in a rsr250 daily for two weeks. Nitrates were finally detected yesterday but are still low 0.5-1 - which could still be a 0 with +/- accuracy. I am just happy to finally have some type of reading other than 0 but I'm unsure of how to adjust my ammonia dosing.

I just put it on my doser instead of dosing the full amount in one shot. To what extent is there concern with dosing "too much" ammonia? Is just having a detectable amount of nitrates the point where one should stop adjustments and go to a maintenance dose amount?

I don’t have a perfect answer, but my supposition is that if you maintain at least a few ppm nitrate, then that would be sufficient since organisms can use the nitrate if they missed out on ammonia.

 

[andrewb70]

Hi

System volume 600 Ltrs, mixed reef mostly SPS, some of which have recently lost colour and growth.

My Nitrates are less than 2ppm, there is barely any colour on the test sample - Salifert.

So I have added 100g of Ammonium Bicarbonate (food Grade) to 5 litres of RO.

Started yesterday dosing 20ml at 4x5ml doses every 3 hours during the day.

Looking to get Nitrate to the 10-15 mark so interested to see what happens.

PO4 is fairly steady at 0.08, I have some cyano on the substrate and on some of the rocks which I have not experienced til recently.

1kg of ammonium bicarbonate cost me £11.80 so cheap as chips.



A

 

[akaimal]

@Randy Holmes-Farley My 650G system consumes 1.25 ppm of nitrate a day. Is it possible to know exactly how much Ammonium bicarbonate solution needs to be dosed daily to provide 1.25 ppm of nitrate? I have been maintaining 10 ppm of nitrate by dosing Sodium Nitrate.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley My 650G system consumes 1.25 ppm of nitrate a day. Is it possible to know exactly how much Ammonium bicarbonate solution needs to be dosed daily to provide 1.25 ppm of nitrate? I have been maintaining 10 ppm of nitrate by dosing Sodium Nitrate.

That corresponds to about 0.35 ppm of ammonia, but I do not know if the amount of consumption will change when dosing ammonia.

 

[Dread Pirate Dave]

Based on the stock solution from Randys first post I've been dosing roughly 4ml ammonium bicarbonate in a rsr250 daily for two weeks. Nitrates were finally detected yesterday but are still low 0.5-1 - which could still be a 0 with +/- accuracy. I am just happy to finally have some type of reading other than 0 but I'm unsure of how to adjust my ammonia dosing.

How is this going so far? I have been running at 0 nitrates for months but phosphate is usually .03 to .05 when I test. My corals are growing and look fine but I feel like they could be better. The ammonium bicarbonate route sounds promising and economical.